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Post by Ajax on Jan 15, 2018 21:36:43 GMT
Elwinar, awesome write-up, thanks for taking the time out to type that out. I'm glad to see you doing some playtesting with the Hooch Hauler, it's one of those pieces that people seem to be struggling to make fit, but your list looks great.
The lack of a fell caller scares me a bit, since Borka really wants that +2 mat to close out games, but I suppose with the HHH, you have a decent substitute. I'm gonna have to try your list out, I think a lot of people are underestimating the HHH at the moment (probably because of the lack of accessibility from the cost...).
You said that you're having some trouble with true shooty lists, do you think Borka2 carries enough weight on his own as an all comers list, if you can find a suitable pairing to cover the shooty matchup?
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Post by Ajax on Jan 15, 2018 18:04:46 GMT
I just received a $25 coupon from PP to "start the new year correctly". Anyone else receive this? Feels like a direct response to the Hooch Hauler backlash to me.... though I'm not complaining, since I'm now considering purchasing it...
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Post by Ajax on Jan 15, 2018 17:39:07 GMT
Man, I've been dying to try out some northkin raiders, but that box price is killing me. I'll have to pick them up soon, but will need to proxy in the meantime.
I'm curious about Tim Banky's results from the ATC. Team Canada (the team he was on) managed to make it to 2nd, but I haven't seen a round breakdown yet. I'd love to see Bearka represented in the tournament scene.
My only worry is that he might fall off since he doesn't really help forge a "strong" pairing as much as casters like Madrak1/2, Gunnbjorn, or Kolgrimma do.
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Post by Ajax on Jan 12, 2018 22:36:33 GMT
What's your opinion on the "right" matchups? I think a problem that I'm thinking I'll be seeing is that he's really only a "great" drop into pretty straightforward lists, a la Khador jack spam etc. Is his stealth feat and concealment usually enough to drop him into true ranged matchups? Will he have trouble with things like cloud walls that are so prevalent these days?
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Post by Ajax on Jan 12, 2018 21:19:16 GMT
So I haven't seen an official Borka 2 dojo thread, and the ATC seems to have a few interesting Borka 2 lists. I figured I'd post a thread to get some real Dojo done, since Borka 2 was the caster that originally brought me into Trollbloods.
What kind of lists have you guys been running and finding success with? I've seen him pop up pretty regularly in other threads, with a multitude of builds.
To get it started, here's the list I've been running:
Trollbloods Army - 75 / 75 points
[Theme] Storm of the North
(Borka 2) Borka, Vengeance of the Rimeshaws [+27]
- Earthborn Dire Troll [14]
- Pyre Troll [8]
- Rok [19]
- Troll Axer [10]
Fell Caller Hero [0(5)]
Lanyssa Ryssyl, Nyss Sorceress [4]
Northkin Shaman [4]
Valka Curseborn, Chieftain of the North [0(6)]
Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes (min) [6]
- Northkin Elder [3]
Northkin Bear Handle & Battle Bears [10]
Northkin Bear Handle & Battle Bears [10]
Northkin Fire Eaters [7]
Northkin Fire Eaters [7]
I've been happy with the flexibility of the bears to act as a solid front line when needed, or to use them to funnel the enemy into the middle of the board when necessary. I'm not currently sold on Valka, but Lanyssa has been a clutch piece consistently. Borka's personal threat skyrockets with her addition, and a free Pyre animus + Hunters Mark + Stone grants a 15" threat.
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Post by Ajax on Jan 8, 2018 17:56:41 GMT
I'm sure gdnerd can My bet is because of the clouds, which is a new (besides Jarl) thing in Trolls. It enables to deliver stuff safely across the board. A good answer to a lot of gun lists, which Trolls did'nt have prior. Only answer before was Warders and Bouncer (shield guard), but that got screwed over by Theme lists. And of course the amazing Spray spell. Good pow, easy to hit. Sprays in mk3 are just really good. Makes assassination very possible AND has decent game into most dudespams. Note this is with Mulg as arc node in mind. Without I would probably not play Kolgrimma. Yes it's that good I mean, as far as anti-shooting goes, Gunnbjorn does better at shutting down ranged game, as does Borka 2. There seem to be a lot of anti-cloud tech because of things like Grymkin and Haley 3.
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Post by Ajax on Jan 8, 2018 17:25:53 GMT
Can anyone explain the fascination with Kolgrimma? I've seen her pop up in so many competitive lists, but I'm just not seeing her benefits over other casters. What's her main draw?
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Post by Ajax on Jan 4, 2018 19:19:37 GMT
Hard pass on this. At $90-100, I was prepared to buy 2. $165 is "Firetruck you" pricing. It's pretty maddening that the Troll tax has gotten so expensive, as further demonstrated by the Sea King and the Northkin Raiders.
The saving grace on those two was that it was possible to get them with a retailer discount, or something like ebay. I regularly see both on "sale" for ~30% off or more. With this being direct to consumer, there aren't going to be ANY discounts on the hooch hauler to make this an easier pill to swallow.
I wouldn't be surprised to see this model start appearing on the table, but from "distributors" in China or Russia.
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Post by Ajax on Nov 17, 2017 18:58:11 GMT
So it seems like the consensus is largely that Stryker 2 can bring anything, as the end goal is to ultimately be able to close in for the assassination? Does he make a fairly good all-comers 2nd list, to plug whatever holes are in your primary list? Or do you find yourself having to build around him?
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Post by Ajax on Nov 15, 2017 19:43:05 GMT
Has anyone had a chance to try him in Gravediggers at all? Seems like clouds + cover + decel would mitigate a lot of the problems he'd have with shooting lists, with Stryker's battlegroup handling armor?
That gives him access to gibbs, and he can take rhupert as well. Just a thought, like I said I've played very little of my cygnar, but it seems like it could be a possibility? Maybe something like this:
Cygnar Army - 75 / 75 points
[Theme] Gravediggers
(Stryker 2) Lord Commander Stryker [+28]
- Ol' Rowdy [18]
- Stormclad [18]
Captain Maxwell Finn [0(6)]
Major Harrison Gibbs [4]
Patrol Dog [2]
Rhupert Carvolo, Piper of Ord [4]
Trench Buster [0(5)]
Trencher Express Team [0(5)]
Trencher Infantry (min) [10]
- Trencher Infantry Officer & Sniper [5]
- Trencher Infantry Rifle Grenadier (3) [6]
Trencher Long Gunners (max) [18]
- Trencher Long Gunner Officer [4]
Trencher Blockhouse [14]
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Post by Ajax on Nov 15, 2017 0:02:21 GMT
I haven't really seen any discussion on Stryker 2 recently, which is a shame because he's the Cygnar caster that really pushed me into buying in. I haven't really had a chance to play my Cygnar yet, so I'd really appreciate a lot of your guys' insight.
How's Stryker 2 doing these days? What themes make him shine (or vice versa)? What kind of questions/answers does he provide, and who's a great caster pair for him (Kraye?)?
Thanks!
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Post by Ajax on Nov 14, 2017 19:57:00 GMT
So I've really enjoyed playing Borka 2 recently, but as far as his standing in the competitive scene, do you guys think he does enough to make it into your tournament 2-list pairings? I always feel like I'm having to build around him, or that what he does well could be done by someone better.
I'll probably keep at it, since he's my favorite model in the game, but curious about what you guys think so far.
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Post by Ajax on Nov 4, 2017 10:16:45 GMT
It depends on if you have strength buffs up. Those don't apply to the mount. Given that you can get up to+4 strength (being hurt and cold Stone) the higher ps on trauma can overwhelm the weapon master on average. and if you take a pyre along you can get an extra +2 damage on top of the +4 strength. put the chiller animus from the basher on him and you also have a +2 hit buff on anything you want to get close to add a fellcaller for another +2 hit and you are good to go and live the dream: 1 pow 16 mount impact attack (if the +2 dmg from pyre works on that) at mat 12 if you hit, then your target is knocked down and 6 p&s 21 attacks on a knocked down target should finish any caster. Just a correction to make here: You wouldn't be able to have both chiller and flaming fists up, so it's the +2 to attack OR the +2 damage. I'd usually go with Flaming Fists. Flaming Fists does count towards the mount though, since it's a melee attack. So depending on the buffs on Borka, buying mount attacks vs. using Trauma is situational. The northkin elder +2 STR buff would probably push me to using Trauma more frequently though. POW 21 w/ FF, Defiant Rage, Stone Aura vs a pow 16 Weapon Master, Trauma should put out more reliable damage. Had a chance to play with Borka2 a few times tonight in PoD. I feel like my first assumption was correct, though he plays a beast brick well, I think he really shines the most in a mixed arms list. With the beast brick, he can be bogged down easily by enemy infantry. Though a counter charging Mulg in PoD is amazing, it's rough having to give up the Fell Caller for that sweet MAT 10. Having a fell caller and infantry to jam/contest the board with really makes me think he's best in SotN. From what I gathered tonight, I think Lanyssa, a Fell Caller, and a Pyre are absolutely mandatory. Everything else can be substituted freely to compliment your 2nd list. Question about an interaction that came up tonight: Borka 2 charged Tanith, and missed his impact attack. After resolving the movement phase, Tanith Admonitioned out of range. Does that now count as a failed charge? Gut says no, because he "completed" the charge.
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Post by Ajax on Nov 2, 2017 21:10:45 GMT
With the new War Room push, I think Borka 2 does best as a balanced list, though I would argue that in the end it doesn't matter. Take whatever compliments your second list best.
I'm planning on playing him much like a Butcher 3. Everything else is simply a way to carve a path into their caster with Borka himself. Lanyssa is an auto-include in my opinion, being able to charge from 14 inches away on a high mat, high pow caster seems ridiculous. Much like Butcher 3, you can go with units or beasts, but Borka will be the main pull.
I'm not speaking from any experience, as I haven't put him on the table yet (soon!), but he synergizes extremely well with the Fire Eaters and Bears. The Bears essentially have perma-stealth thanks to Borka's concealment spell, and are tough enough to survive a hit and give stationary on feat turn.
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Post by Ajax on Nov 1, 2017 16:26:40 GMT
So, I may be stating the obvious, but Thexus loves them. He can TK a model to turn it around and bring it 2" closer. From there the unit can all get backstab. So people say this all the time, but in practice, I've found that it really doesn't do enough to count unless your meta is full of Legion and Circle. Generally, beasts/jacks have high enough armor that even a WM pow 10 doesn't matter much. And TK'ing infantry is just a waste of time and resources. I think I'd much rather take a unit of thorn gun mages for the utility.
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