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Post by davycannonhound on Mar 6, 2018 5:10:29 GMT
Maybe it's time to let this thread die, yeah? Many of the points of conversation on here are pretty general and off topic at this point. Rabbit trails, yes, but not entirely off topic.
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Lanz
Junior Strategist
Posts: 685
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Post by Lanz on Mar 6, 2018 7:56:50 GMT
I wish PP would just fix our theme lists. The whole 'run more infantry' attitude was as lazy as it was appauling for a faction that they'd built up over 10 years to be beast-heavy. CoTD and Ravens should have no beast restrictions, just rules to emphasize and encourage some beasts over others. If all beasts were available in CoTD, nephilim would still have the advantage of unyielding, and that could make them more compelling than similar choices in that theme list specifically. Meanwhile, Ravens could also have all warbeasts and just have some bonus specifically to flying warbeasts (+2 SPD on the first turn or something).
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Mar 6, 2018 14:06:10 GMT
I wish PP would just fix our theme lists. The whole 'run more infantry' attitude was as lazy as it was appauling for a faction that they'd built up over 10 years to be beast-heavy. CoTD and Ravens should have no beast restrictions, just rules to emphasize and encourage some beasts over others. If all beasts were available in CoTD, nephilim would still have the advantage of unyielding, and that could make them more compelling than similar choices in that theme list specifically. Meanwhile, Ravens could also have all warbeasts and just have some bonus specifically to flying warbeasts (+2 SPD on the first turn or something). Not arbitrary enough. I fully expect the final version of Primal Terrors to only allow beasts that start with S because they needed the other letters of the alphabet for design space.
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Post by elladan52 on Mar 6, 2018 14:08:14 GMT
I wish PP would just fix our theme lists. The whole 'run more infantry' attitude was as lazy as it was appauling for a faction that they'd built up over 10 years to be beast-heavy. CoTD and Ravens should have no beast restrictions, just rules to emphasize and encourage some beasts over others. If all beasts were available in CoTD, nephilim would still have the advantage of unyielding, and that could make them more compelling than similar choices in that theme list specifically. Meanwhile, Ravens could also have all warbeasts and just have some bonus specifically to flying warbeasts (+2 SPD on the first turn or something). Laziness is the laziest critique.
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danx
Junior Strategist
Posts: 120
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Post by danx on Mar 6, 2018 15:02:55 GMT
I think theme forces are pretty good as a general idea.
I like the Restrictions in exchange for benefits. I'm unsure about the free points, but I think Solos are too expensive in Mk3, so them being free quite often is a good move.
All themes are not equal is fine too.
What is not good is not having enough Themes, to allow interesting play of things.
We have one widely open theme - Oracles. It lets you play many lists that you like to anyway and get some free stuff, but it also makes several casters much more playable Free Upkeeps turn one, and fixed hex Hunters back to a fast speed.
Ravens is too restricted in my opinion. CoTD is too restricted too - though it is actually really cool in lots of ways too.
Primal terrors is very restricted - but probably in an OK way. I think Orgryn could have done with some more releases - a support unit of beast handingly Ogryn would have been neat, and may be some interesting solo.
Its weird that Nyss, Ogryn and Striders never meet (except on Raptor) and the Grotesques only hang out with Striders. May be we will get some themes that restrict "Only warriors with Ranged attack" "Only warriors with no range attack.
Current themes are nearly "Spd5, Spd6 and Spd7" warrior units.
I think is CoTD was Unyielding to Nephalim and Blighted Nyss, free stuff for every 30 points of Nephalim and Blighted Nyss warrior Units/Solos, but you could also take a wider selection of beasts and warriors it would be more fun seeming, but not make a lot of difference to what you build with the main part of the list. Strider Deathstalkers would may be make a return? Or would they... I'm not sure. Sometimes they would. More wide and intresting list options would appear. People would run Blight bringer and the Nyss Swordsmen, and may be a unit of Groteques may be in that theme, and it would get nearly no benefits. Or may be they would run 60 points of Nyss and a blight bringer, and get 2 free solos which would be pretty fun.
I think they key thing is flexible Themes that let you play stuff that you want to play - rather than feeling straight jacketed into particular themes and lists.
CoTD - 50 points of Zureil, Azuril, Bolt Thrower + a Caster + Nyss - is fun with a few casters - but its very cookie cutter seeming. The other character beasts (Abby and Thag lists) will mix up CoTD as you can take 75 points of beasts and have fun with 3 characters - but its probably just novelty in the brave new world of really cheap Sytheans?
Ravens - 60 points of Warriors is not that many different combinations. Paying for Solo's is really annoying. Bee's mix it up a bit too. Ravens list with 40 points of warriors seem very low on benefits, though not being ambushed is often nice?
Primal Terrors incudes the solo's in the mix towards free points so choices for 40 or 60 points are somewhat varied and a bit more interesting seeming may be?
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