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Post by Stormsmith Dropout on Mar 13, 2017 21:49:23 GMT
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Post by Swampmist on Mar 13, 2017 21:54:51 GMT
Stickying this because yeah
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Post by schostoppa1 on Mar 13, 2017 21:55:13 GMT
Excellent. I saw it in my feed just havent had a chance to post it or listen. Hopefully informative.
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Lanz
Junior Strategist
Posts: 685
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Post by Lanz on Mar 13, 2017 22:45:51 GMT
A whole hour D: I don't have a whole hour. What are the footnotes?
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Post by Stormsmith Dropout on Mar 13, 2017 22:58:11 GMT
Footnotes: For the forums and pressgangers, its pretty much what was expected. The PG program was ended because it got bigger than could be handled. It was not confirmed or denied if the WOTC law suit was a factor, and it seems that the program would need to end eventually anyway due to how much support it takes to manage the 1-2 thousand pressgangers. PP was sad to see it go, and has been very gracious about it.
The forums did go down because of the negativity in them. That was pretty openly confirmed. He gave some fair reasons for it. The new players who wandered into the faction forums were generally greeted with negativity.
Goreshade4 confirmed.
Lots of exciting stuff in the works.
Jackson says that this is the last of the year's earth-shattering events of the year. We'll see.
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Miafan
Junior Strategist
Eater of Brains
Posts: 130
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Post by Miafan on Mar 13, 2017 23:13:57 GMT
Well yeah, shoving PP failure after failure into PP's face was pretty negative for them, no wonder they decided they want to read either pleasantries or nothing from now on.
Otherwise, this is still a ridiculous argument.
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Post by Stormsmith Dropout on Mar 13, 2017 23:15:44 GMT
Argument?
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Post by Swampmist on Mar 13, 2017 23:18:35 GMT
there was some serious unconstructive criticism on the old forums, especially in the general discussion. Whether it was a good decision or not, it's not like they didn't have a bunch of legitimately venomous comments on the old forums.
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Miafan
Junior Strategist
Eater of Brains
Posts: 130
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Post by Miafan on Mar 13, 2017 23:18:40 GMT
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Post by schostoppa1 on Mar 13, 2017 23:20:04 GMT
Well yeah, shoving PP failure after failure into PP's face was pretty negative for them, no wonder they decided they want to read either pleasantries or nothing from now on. Otherwise, this is still a ridiculous argument. Sounds like PP had a #negativeplayexperience with their forums.
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Post by Stormsmith Dropout on Mar 13, 2017 23:24:09 GMT
I mean, now that I hear the reasoning I can understand the decision. I'm still pissed that they gave us such a short notice, vague description, and no explanation when closing it down.
Anyway, we got our own forum now. We can choose to be good or bad. Time will tell.
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Lanz
Junior Strategist
Posts: 685
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Post by Lanz on Mar 13, 2017 23:32:54 GMT
I honestly didn't even see that much negativity. There was a surge of recent negativity on the faction forums for the factions that got smeared by Mk3, but if PP is blaming the forum posters for that, they're just in denial. Even then, I didn't see much negativity directed at actual players - especially new ones - much at all. People criticized PP a lot, and people on opposite sides of the fence squabbled a lot, but I can't recall ever seeing any newb-bashing going on.
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Post by Swampmist on Mar 13, 2017 23:39:33 GMT
I honestly didn't even see that much negativity. There was a surge of recent negativity on the faction forums for the factions that got smeared by Mk3, but if PP is blaming the forum posters for that, they're just in denial. Even then, I didn't see much negativity directed at actual players - especially new ones - much at all. People criticized PP a lot, and people on opposite sides of the fence squabbled a lot, but I can't recall ever seeing any newb-bashing going on. The fence fighting certainly didn't help matters (it killed my enthusiasm for menoth for a few months, at the very least.) I think newbbashing often happened becvause people didn't talk about how to use bad stuff much, and discussions devolved into buff\nerf wars (see the stormlances post on this forum for an example of a "deal with it" post turned to talking about game design .)
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Post by Aegis on Mar 14, 2017 0:02:18 GMT
Yeah. I always found that new players were treated pretty well in the faction forums I used to frequent. There were tons of people that strived to help newbies on their first steps, suggesting the first things to buy and answering to questions.
Sure, there were complains on the general forums, and sometimes also on the faction forums when a faction felt particulary un-heard about its problems, but that kind of thing is impossible to eradicate (people will complain, is inevitable), and sometimes the complains were actually justified.
Sadly, the podcast makes me happy only by half. I liked to know that most people in PP were sad about closing the PG program, but I didn't felt that they understand what they have lost with the forums at all. They seem pretty convinced that everything they purged was trash talk and unconstructive criticism, but under the loud voices of whiners there were a treasure of people being there to help people, to share experiences on the game (hyping one with another and making everyone more invested into the game), and guides made with hours of work by the people of the faction forums.
Even the General forum had his pearls. The Secret Santa threads as an example, or the topics about the lore with the answers from Doug Seacat, or even the discussions with the devs into the insiders. Some of the latter devolved into critiques when the changes where particulary hard to understand by the community, its true, but a lot of others were wounderful topics, things that I waited for anxiously... Actually, a things I often said in the past about PP was "You know, they have a forum where Devs or members of the staff come and discuss with the people about things directly with their community, and answering questions!", and that was often a thing that created awe and interest in the people I was talking with (often potential new players).
I know that CID is still basically that, but is a lot different. It's a sort of pubblic playtest, where they ask precise feedbacks on precise topics selected by them in a strictly policed environment. It's not the same of the "friendly" chat you could have in some of the well received insider topics.
Hearing the podcast I didn't feel at all that they know what they renouced or that the decision was difficult for them at all (that it doesn't mean that it wasn't, but I really didn't feel it), and that saddens me.
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Post by greytemplar on Mar 14, 2017 0:52:39 GMT
Yeah, I never EVER saw anybody treat a new player badly. Unless treating badly is defined as "tells a new player that X is bad" which is of course ridiculous. Better to keep a new player from wasting $$$ on something only to have their dreams shredded. Like telling a new Khador player in mk2 that running 10 warjacks is a bad idea and will only lead to tears, maybe it stung a little bit, but it was the best thing for that player in the long run. The dream's gonna get crushed immediately, better to rip the bandaid off and only cause a little ouchy before a few hundred bucks and weeks of hobby time gets put in on a list thats going to perform badly.
The absolute best way to get a player to leave a game is for him to get false hopes that something is going to perform fine, only for the player to find out after buying, painting, and generally getting emotionally invested in an army that the stuff he loves is crap. Thats what causes players to dump armies in trash cans and never come back to the game.
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