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Post by jpgreat1 on Feb 14, 2018 18:22:30 GMT
I didn't watch the videos but if the GW one is the one I suspect then you should know that the guy Tony "beat" was offeted $5000 by a GW player who owns league of Legends (I think that's the Co's name). The player donated the money to a childrens hospital then got his boss to match that gift of $5000. GW then also matched that gift to the hospital. Now GW is thinking of offering a sportsmanship award at major events. www.warhammer-community.com/2018/02/13/the-very-best-of-sports/Yes I stated that in my first post. Thank you for providing the direct link though
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Post by jpgreat1 on Feb 14, 2018 18:21:25 GMT
I've personally wanted to comment on a few 40k youtube personalities who were commenting on this and the nature of competitive play in 40k. But I figured I would just be pumping how good warmachine is and it wouldn't be a debate but just two people yelling at each other.
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Post by jpgreat1 on Feb 14, 2018 17:57:59 GMT
What I think this further reminds me why I will never pick up a GW game besides the video games. Rules are not clear, rules are not concise, and too much room is left to interpretation. Watching this play out and then seeing how folks reacted ofcourse reminds me of any other video game competition but how the big name in the gaming world handled it just left a sour taste in my mouth. I also think that Alex guy has a heart of gold but more on that later.
I get having been a competitive gamer myself that sometimes the pressure gets to you and mistakes are made. I mean anyone who read the issue with Jarl's team at last years WTC can attest to this. Lets not also forget the drama of Keith getting Caine2 blown away by a menoth gun line only for them to pause the time come back and redo it simply because the guy never hit his jacks with the choir buff. Mistakes happen and happen to the best of us. Clearly this Tony guy was a win at any cost type character, however; he didn't do anything illegal or strong armed his opponent into making a bad decision. To me I think its bad PR (despite my friends disagreeing with me) decision to give Alex a player who didn't follow the rules money. This makes 2 clear statements. 1. GW hates players who are trying to win by any means necessary( which isn't so bad considering sportsmanship is a thing ) & 2. This sends a message that they don't write very initiative rules and that they know this and instead of addressing the rule they reward the player for not following them.
If I was GW I would re-vise the rules if they really felt that bad. Like Warmachine, WH40k rules and faction balances are in a constant state of flux simply because the game truly isn't finished yet and to me its okay to say "hey this rule we don't like cause of what happen to we will address it".
As far as Alex, there is a special place in heaven for him. The guy got majorly lucky that people with money overwhelmingly felt bad for him and offered him something. For him to brush aside large sums of cash and say "give it to charity" shows that he has a heart of gold.
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Post by jpgreat1 on Feb 14, 2018 17:44:40 GMT
Saw this making its rounds, figured I share and ask what people think of it. www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpA_YOL6mN8&feature=youtu.beAnd for the follow up video were karma comes in is here www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYKpbkGy_bY&feature=youtu.beFor those who don't want to watch and want a tldr version see below Now I did ask some of my friends who are really into 40k and they told me Tony was in the right (as the first video explains). Specific phases can trigger specific stratagems and Tony was right to hold accountable his opponent for playing by the rules. But what does this say when GW PR team also decides to drop large sums of money onto a player who didn't follow the rules correctly? What do you think?
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Doooom
Feb 14, 2018 16:12:43 GMT
Post by jpgreat1 on Feb 14, 2018 16:12:43 GMT
...On social media, warmachine/hordes is the most talked about tabletop game out. I know this, cause I personally measured this. The discussion between games like infinity, Warhammer, and so on don't even come close to the number of posts or discussions. This, however; can be explained because most of those other games have a direct website forum that people can go too... Can you elaborate on this? Because I don't see it that way. In my experience, podcast and youtube channels are way less active/dead these days. Take Chain Attack (the podcast) as an example: Before, they played several games each week for the weekly podcast, often attended tournaments and generally played and talked about the game a lot. Now? Games are rare, they briefly rate casters and have introduced board games to their content now. I don't want to start a discussion on the podcast or the guys behind it, I just notice that their excitement and interest in the game seems very low compared to a couple of years ago. (Yes I know some or a lot of that can be related to real life, burnout, podcast fatigue etc. But some of it has to be the game itself as well) In short, point me towards the active areas (Not Facebook pls) I am talking about facebook and twitter. Unless a spoiler or some big tournament comes out, generally warmachine beats any other game by a couple of 100 posts. Again this can be explained because many of those other sites have there own forums and PP wanted to use social media more.
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Doooom
Feb 11, 2018 22:12:00 GMT
Post by jpgreat1 on Feb 11, 2018 22:12:00 GMT
I'm going to go ahead and point out a few things. It may sound like I am directing it at people in particular but I assure you I am not. I am more or less directing this at the whole negative lot.
On social media, warmachine/hordes is the most talked about tabletop game out. I know this, cause I personally measured this. The discussion between games like infinity, Warhammer, and so on don't even come close to the number of posts or discussions. This, however; can be explained because most of those other games have a direct website forum that people can go too.
What I've personally noticed is that communities that seem to draw the most active people do so by having a great storefront/place to play, active community organizers, people who enjoy playing multiple games that can be competitive but also can be casual. Personally speaking, a game like guildball is dead in all parts of the state but my own meta. The reason for that is simply due to one guy who goes above and beyond attempting to organize it and sell the game. Other games like 40k I feel aren't great games (I will go ahead on record and say the game is damn awful) but its easily one of the more recognized games that is often pushed by organizers to capture the imagination of the player (along with pretty models). So what does this have to do with warmachine? Push what appeals to your community and push to Warmachine's strengths.
Warmachine strengths would be its deep tactical play, still cheaper than other big war games, and smoother rule set. Can some folks get taken back by how deep the strategy and interactions are in this game but this is where the community organizers come into play. Instead of playing streamroller 100% of the time, its a good idea to start battlegroup only games or company of iron. Sometimes watchmachine can be fun. But this all depends on the people who want to run it. Because if no one wants to take the time then guess what, that will kill whatever community you have. I've personally see warmachine go in major cycles of dying and coming back simply based upon how the organizer runs things. So if its not doing well in your community, its likely your organizer.
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Post by jpgreat1 on Feb 9, 2018 5:45:36 GMT
Well....interestingly....the BR show them losing to precisely the kind of list that I would THINK they would lose to - armies that can Jam (kraye) and armies that can maximize armor/def to create problems for their combination of low volume of attacks and innately low'ish power. Again, 70+ games with them. The above has always been their problem and the CID didn't address that. What it DID do is provide them a non-conquest way of dealing with weaponmaster spam - another almost hard tilt problem. The below is spoken with an understanding of what threatens them and what match ups you need to be concerned with. Now lets look at "options". reducing RNG to 8 is a possibility but I think has minimal impact. If it satisfies the tilters oh well. Much more concerning is the idea of dropping the power on the spray. Consider. Currently the Gun is 1D6-1 against Piggybacks in Shield wall. So you have a 1 in 6 chance of killing them. At POW 14 you are dice -3. You have NO chance of killing them. Then Heretic gives them fury and they eat you for lunch. What we have seen in the first 48 hours is a decent number of "standard Khador tech". Trust me, once people figure out that it is an unboostable POW 16 they will recognize the tech that helps - from the above to Skarre getting bane knights up to ARM 23 to Trencher infantry under seige2 simply out threatening them and eating them up if they commit (or playing the no knock down tough game). I love the changes. I for one thing they are balanced by the fact that MoW's greatest weaknesses have been left to exploit - low speed and low attack to point ratio. Which battle report was that? Was it the one Octavius lost or was it the one he made following Groundpounder's first battle report after commenting on GP's findings saying its a bit too hasty to only say something similar in his? He even commented to you directly in that post. I mean dude, he even stated "His list included too many disparate elements that didn't synergise well enough" Outside of a few reports I read everyone is stating supressor tanker is overpowered.
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Post by jpgreat1 on Feb 9, 2018 3:54:03 GMT
Yes. Some of us with REAL lives can't play within 48 HOURS of the CID dropping. Touche. But how many games has he played with Man of Wars. Looking at IG I am at 74 with Man of War centric lists. Not theory mate - I have a CLEAR appreciation of the threats that Man of Wars face and the absolute imperative of keeping light, medium and heavy infantry off them. It is Def 9 ARM 21. Shoot it. Multiple times. Dude, I'm sorry I understand I was speaking in absolutes and slightly trolling but in a serious matter you just can't go "you don't have time" then say "I have experience based upon things in the past because of X" Your information in the past prior to this CID with MOW is grossly irrelevant. Report after report shows MOW are doing pretty good and while yes, they do have trouble in scenario play if you don't take those battle engines. They are monsters as far as the attrition focus.
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Post by jpgreat1 on Feb 9, 2018 3:31:41 GMT
Folks who think Suppression Tanker isn't OP. You are nuts. That is all OK. I will take this argument up. Yes. It is POWERFUL but is a one shot POW 16 going to kill THAT many casters? Probably not ONE. MAYBE....sometimes....2 if they didn't camp a thing (foolish them). So then we think about heavies. ARe there really THAT many heavies that are going to be hurt by POW 16? What it does is clear infantry - heavy and light - like a champ. And I can tell you having played a LOT of Man of Wars it is critical for that to be in play or you are going to find your expensive man of war infantry getting torn to shreads by Weaponmasters or buffed single wound infantry. A question worth thinking about is what is above and below, with buffs, the ARM 23 and Def 16 line and whether, in the game, the low volume high cost MoW need protection from the above? Cause it is clear that a direction that PP didn't go in was addressing volume. Instead you HAVE to keep your MOWs alive so they can do 2-3 turns of damage to make up for their high cost per model. Counter-argument. We have a few battle reports showing them ripping through light, medium, and heavy infantry. Many folks including Britain's very own golden boy Patbot which, has gone on record and written battle reports; exclaiming how ridiculously overpowered that piece is. His point its too effective at what it does. Your rebuttal? Before you write one, put this in context... he is considered by far one of the best players in the world as well as considered a higher tier playtester thanks to his insight on the CID forums. You have... theories?
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Post by jpgreat1 on Feb 9, 2018 2:41:34 GMT
Folks who think Suppression Tanker isn't OP. You are nuts. That is all
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Post by jpgreat1 on Jan 3, 2018 17:09:21 GMT
Some ideas I had for awhile Burrowers gain a 4 point CA called Pyg Burrower Officer & Ammo Bearer - Officer has Slip away order and has the ability Tactics: Adept Tunneler - When the Burrow ability is used increase the movement to 4 " and placement to 6".
- The Ammo Bearer like the Ammo Porter for the Legion Archers gives an extra shot while within so many inches of the model.
This would increase effectiveness of Burrowers slightly, giving some models 2 shots and some extra movement shenanigans with slip away and adept tunneler. Would work wonders in combo with Pyg Lookouts, Grim2, Calandra.
This idea seems like it could be partially useful. The extra shot means that you would still only be playing them with Grim2 for hus feat as RAT4 RNG4 POW14 is still pretty garbage even with 2 shots each. Also I would never pay 17 points for this. For Burrowers to see play again, I really think that they need their old rules back. The other idea I had was for the Ammo Bearer to give Flare to the unit while alive instead of a 2nd shot but go with me or a second on this. Slip away order means some Burrowers can get to the back arc of a model making them RAT 6. Add in a Lookout and now the Pygs are RAT 8. The Adept Tunneler ability also means a person has to watch out for janky 6 to 10 inch threat that would be hard to stop. While most heavily armor beasts can shrug off a pow 14 shot or two a lot of infantry can't and once you hit the realm of RAT 6 or higher suddenly burrowers are hitting at a good weight class. My memory may be foggy but Burrow before allowed them to pop up and fully activate which is something I think they are trying to get away from. They also as well had a pow 8 melee swing and point blank (which benefited from war cry) slug shot which that ability alone would help them out but both would make them a bit too good for the points. Keep in mind either idea I had for the CA (slip away w/adept tunneler & extra shot or Flare on all shots) make them a support/kill unit for 17 points.
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Post by jpgreat1 on Jan 3, 2018 7:38:01 GMT
Some ideas I had for awhile Burrowers gain a 4 point CA called Pyg Burrower Officer & Ammo Bearer - Officer has Slip away order and has the ability Tactics: Adept Tunneler - When the Burrow ability is used increase the movement to 4 " and placement to 6".
- The Ammo Bearer like the Ammo Porter for the Legion Archers gives an extra shot while within so many inches of the model.
This would increase effectiveness of Burrowers slightly, giving some models 2 shots and some extra movement shenanigans with slip away and adept tunneler. Would work wonders in combo with Pyg Lookouts, Grim2, Calandra, & Grim1.
Boomhowler and Company is one I do agree needs a slight change. Currently they are like worse versions of Raiders but rely way too heavily on boomhowler to be alive to be somewhat effective. A point decrease as well as unyielding should help these guys out. Perhaps with this change they will return to being the front line unit of choice like they were in MK2 but for trolls instead of Cygnar.
Highwayman as greenjello suggested should be range 10 with each pistol. I wouldn't be opposed if they gained a weapon attachment that had a hand cannon and a pistol. We really don't have a lot of weapon attachments I noticed (I'm speaking for hordes in general)
Scouts would be actually pretty good if they gained Ambush and Repo 3".
Scattergunners would be a lot more useful if the Gun Blade was a P+S 10 as oppose to a 9 as well as they gained a point of armor. These guys seemed as armored as Boomhowlers yet only arm 14? I would also like it if the CA gained a mini-feat to increase to spray ten.
The Thumper Crew just needs a range increase to 14 as oppose to 12. The momentum ability is nice but you have to be so damn close for you to be useful.
Pummeller Crew while nice would be better if it gained ROF 2
I would also like to see an extra solo or two.
1 solo would be the "Big game Hunter". A Grim wannabe RAT 7, stealth seeing solo with a pow 12 range 14 rifle with ammo shot types. He can choose between Flare or Grievous Wounds.
The other would be a Grizzled Trollkin Ex-Cygnar trencher character solo has your basic military rifle and a trench knife (but he is weapon master with his melee weapon). His abilities would be Battery Fire & Fire and Displace.
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Post by jpgreat1 on Jan 3, 2018 3:08:54 GMT
Many folks didn't think Sons of Tempest for Cygnar would go through CID until that fateful day on Lock and Load
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Post by jpgreat1 on Jan 3, 2018 2:53:20 GMT
Personally the Burrowers, both artillery crews, Scattergunners, Scouts, and Highwaymen needs something.
To me, if Burrowers got a command attachment that gave them Flare I wonder if that would be too much or enough to fix them.
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Post by jpgreat1 on Jan 3, 2018 1:28:12 GMT
As title suggests, I want Kriel Company to go through CID.
Updates some of our lesser used models and clearly add more solos in that theme. Am I the only one who feels that way?
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