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Post by HereComesTomorrow on May 31, 2017 17:11:27 GMT
Actually, on this point, if it's already too slow, why would you want to give it support abilities that would inevitably hampers its speed? Some support abilities do not require an action, like the Fulcrum pulling fury off of Wolds/Veteran Leader, the Vessel of Judgment and its pile of utility, or the Wraith Engine providing its defensive buffs. Given that the only model slower than the Throne right now is the Blightbringer, being able to run up the table and still provide value to the army in front of it is a worthwhile consideration, since we have a lot of units that aren't played because they lack delivery capabilities. But a passive buff would be OP if it didn't have to use an action. Also saying its "slow" isn't really true and it would be nice if you'd stop perpetuating that falsehood. In case you forgot most of Legion's heavies have a lower threat range than the Throne even after being Slipstreamed. Only the Angelius is faster and thats only on one of its weapons and only Proteus exceeds it and hes actually more expensive.
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Whiskie
Junior Strategist
Posts: 288
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Post by Whiskie on May 31, 2017 20:02:06 GMT
The Throne isn't really slow per se, it does have limited mobility though since you can't Slipstream it. Its native threat range is the same as a Scythean after Slipstream so getting onto enemies isn't something it struggles with.
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Post by Cheesebeard on Jun 1, 2017 5:39:21 GMT
Some support abilities do not require an action, like the Fulcrum pulling fury off of Wolds/Veteran Leader, the Vessel of Judgment and its pile of utility, or the Wraith Engine providing its defensive buffs. Given that the only model slower than the Throne right now is the Blightbringer, being able to run up the table and still provide value to the army in front of it is a worthwhile consideration, since we have a lot of units that aren't played because they lack delivery capabilities. But a passive buff would be OP if it didn't have to use an action. Also saying its "slow" isn't really true and it would be nice if you'd stop perpetuating that falsehood. In case you forgot most of Legion's heavies have a lower threat range than the Throne even after being Slipstreamed. Only the Angelius is faster and thats only on one of its weapons and only Proteus exceeds it and hes actually more expensive. It's not all about threat range - it's about getting its huge base upfield in a terrain-heavy environment so that it can better contribute as a tanky piece. Its threat range isn't bad, but it's not particularly noteworthy in the faction, either - what we really need out of it isn't its meager offensive output (unless playing into ideal infantry spam), it's its board presence, and for that it needs to get to the front lines.
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Whiskie
Junior Strategist
Posts: 288
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Post by Whiskie on Jun 1, 2017 6:12:30 GMT
I played the Throne earlier tonight. It parked itself nicely between a house and a big rock taking up most of the space between the two terrain pieces. Wave upon wave of Immortals crashed into it trying to break through but due to Immortals attacking at only POW13 the Throne held an entire flank of the table basically by itself. Definitely the ideal scenario for the Throne but it is interesting to note how easily it can take advantage of terrain to make a nearly impassible wall.
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Post by HereComesTomorrow on Jun 1, 2017 7:40:26 GMT
But a passive buff would be OP if it didn't have to use an action. Also saying its "slow" isn't really true and it would be nice if you'd stop perpetuating that falsehood. In case you forgot most of Legion's heavies have a lower threat range than the Throne even after being Slipstreamed. Only the Angelius is faster and thats only on one of its weapons and only Proteus exceeds it and hes actually more expensive. It's not all about threat range - it's about getting its huge base upfield in a terrain-heavy environment so that it can better contribute as a tanky piece. Its threat range isn't bad, but it's not particularly noteworthy in the faction, either - what we really need out of it isn't its meager offensive output (unless playing into ideal infantry spam), it's its board presence, and for that it needs to get to the front lines. Does terrain really hamper it though? It flies and that 4" melee makes it really good at squeezing attacks into weird places. SR2017 is llbasically guarenteeing there will be more infantry in the meta and its a models that can easily destroy most units by itself leaving more points free for armor cracking heavies. I've played the Throne a bunch in Mk2 and Mk3 and I think you severly undervalue a lot of its abilities, especially in regard to its mobility.
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princeraven
Junior Strategist
Shredder spam is best spam
Posts: 256
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Post by princeraven on Jun 1, 2017 7:45:55 GMT
Lots of terrain is a massive detriment to huge bases, as obstructions and obstacles limit their placements and they are unable to take advantage of most line of sight blocking terrain while your opponent's models can.
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Lanz
Junior Strategist
Posts: 685
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Post by Lanz on Jun 1, 2017 8:00:58 GMT
The throne is less hampered by terrain than most huge bases, however. Flight helps it maximize its movement, and it doesn't need to be as particular with its placement to reach its intended targets. You only need to be a bit behind a wall to completely shut down most other melee battle engines, but blocking the throne's 4" reach is considerably more difficult.
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fanguad
Junior Strategist
Posts: 210
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Post by fanguad on Jun 5, 2017 22:25:11 GMT
The Throne isn't really slow per se, it does have limited mobility though since you can't Slipstream it. Its native threat range is the same as a Scythean after Slipstream so getting onto enemies isn't something it struggles with. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Battle Engines can be placed. "Can't be placed" is a restriction on Gargossals, not huge bases. (only have access to the digest right now and it doesn't list that under battle engine restrictions)
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Post by rhonlore on Jun 5, 2017 22:47:44 GMT
Its true that they don't suffer from that restriction, however, Slipstream reads "When the spellcaster ends its Normal Movement, choose one other non-huge-based friendly Faction..."
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Post by piedpiperwtf on Jun 6, 2017 2:17:37 GMT
Slipstream is worded this way specifically to prevent Lylyth3 from being placed 2".
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Post by DanX on Jun 6, 2017 11:46:12 GMT
OK I agree it is not really funny how many people think it can be slipsteamed. There again for a while I thought it could be Admonition-ed. Need to learn to read cards.
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Post by copperflame on Jun 6, 2017 13:37:21 GMT
Reading is hard.
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thelat
Junior Strategist
Posts: 480
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Post by thelat on Jun 6, 2017 21:49:55 GMT
Old slipstream is hard to relearn.
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Post by neutralyze on Jun 26, 2017 17:33:58 GMT
The throne kept all the CID abilities and dropped to 16 pts
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Post by snotling on Jun 26, 2017 17:52:38 GMT
That means my doublw throne lyl1 list got even better xD. Yay
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