gdnerd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 656
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Post by gdnerd on Mar 28, 2018 21:08:56 GMT
allinontrolls I'm not sure what you mean, did you mean without? TBH I've been pretty happy with the Glacier King in all iterations. He keeps your medium-high quality troops from being shot up until you engage (at which point you should win the value game). It's odd playing him as a second line piece but I tend to keep him last for when my opponent runs out of gas. CaptCommy yeah I can see that. I played a couple games with a similar configuration except instead of Valka and Eilish, I kept the sorcerer and added Lanyssa + Swamp Gobbers. Beat Darius on attrition/scenario then beat Siege2 after he failed to assassinate me. Need more reps but I'm a big believer in this getup.
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Post by allinontrolls on Mar 29, 2018 8:15:33 GMT
i asked myself of how good a GK without any support will work in a list. I would guess the shooting of him is mediocre. When you shooting 12" rat5 power 14. The concelment bouble should be nice. I would guess u play champs infront of him. I will test him i am looking for a partner for my Kolgrima list. Cause the Kolgrima hate is getting real in my meta i switched back from Sotn to Pod and looking for a partner who is capable of handling the cryx matchup. Perhaps u are able to give me some info where u drop madrak and where u drop kolgrima
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gdnerd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 656
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Post by gdnerd on Mar 29, 2018 17:13:23 GMT
The GK CAN hit pow 16 on the gun if you want to do cold damage instead of speed or strength for some reason, but yeah he just kinda waits back and threatens to whallop things between him and Madrak jackhammering once more pieces are off the board. My Champs, Bears and Raiders are all out in front of the GK - nothing gets to it until they've gone through the rest of my army. At which point, they've probably run out of things that can deal with the GK.
Madrak I play into most bricks but TBH he can deal with infantry pretty well as well - infantry that relies on charging really is useless on his feat turn. I don't particularly like him into dedicated gunlines if I think they don't care about my defensive tech (sources of blessed, eyeless sight or Nemo3 just indirectly blowing you up). Those games might be playable but why not just play the favored matchup with Kolgrima? Kolgrima also gets dropped into any excessive reliance on offensive spells on the opponent's part because between Mulg and Owl's Wisdom your whole army should be functionally spell immune.
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gdnerd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 656
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Post by gdnerd on Mar 29, 2018 20:43:55 GMT
List I doodled up on a bathroom break. Surprised I didn't come up with this before. Not sure if champs are worth giving up a screen in the form of max raiders or double fire eaters but I think this bears consideration.
War Room Army
Trollblood - Madrak Champions
Theme: Storm of the North 3 / 3 Free Cards 74 / 75 Army
Madrak Ironhide, Thornwood Chieftain - WB: +29 - Trollkin Runebearer - PC: 0 - Glacier King - PC: 35 (Battlegroup Points Used: 29)
Valka Curseborn, Chieftain of the North - PC: 0 Lanyssa Ryssyl, Nyss Sorceress - PC: 4
Northkin Bear Handler & Battle Bears - Bear Handler & 2 Battle Bears: 10 Northkin Bear Handler & Battle Bears - Bear Handler & 2 Battle Bears: 10 Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes - Leader & 5 Grunts: 9 - Northkin Elder - PC: 3 Trollkin Champions - Leader & 4 Grunts: 16 - Skaldi Bonehammer - PC: 0 Trollkin Champions - Leader & 4 Grunts: 16
THEME: Storm of the North ---
GENERATED : 03/29/2018 13:40:16 BUILD ID : 2061.18-02-21
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Post by Ajax on Mar 29, 2018 20:51:47 GMT
I'm still trying to understand the GK pick. Seems like a Bomber/Mauler pairing would work so much better for you, and comes in at a lower cost as well.
I guess I understand the appeal to concealment, but it just seems like the champs are going to be outside of the concealment bubbles most of the time anyway. Why give your opponent the low DEF juicy target to shoot at? The bears like the Prowl, sure, but they're ambushing most of the time, or hiding in the snowstorm bubbles anyway.
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gdnerd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 656
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Post by gdnerd on Mar 29, 2018 21:01:42 GMT
I'm still trying to understand the GK pick. Seems like a Bomber/Mauler pairing would work so much better for you, and comes in at a lower cost as well. I guess I understand the appeal to concealment, but it just seems like the champs are going to be outside of the concealment bubbles most of the time anyway. Why give your opponent the low DEF juicy target to shoot at? The bears like the Prowl, sure, but they're ambushing most of the time, or hiding in the snowstorm bubbles anyway. It's because the GK is insane with Jackhammer and Guided Hand, especially in lategame scenarios.
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Post by Big Fat Troll on Mar 29, 2018 21:12:43 GMT
I'm still trying to understand the GK pick. Seems like a Bomber/Mauler pairing would work so much better for you, and comes in at a lower cost as well. I guess I understand the appeal to concealment, but it just seems like the champs are going to be outside of the concealment bubbles most of the time anyway. Why give your opponent the low DEF juicy target to shoot at? The bears like the Prowl, sure, but they're ambushing most of the time, or hiding in the snowstorm bubbles anyway. It's because the GK is insane with Jackhammer and Guided Hand, especially in lategame scenarios. Also, POW 16 shots or +1 SPD with the Elder and concealment for the Bears.
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gdnerd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 656
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Post by gdnerd on Mar 29, 2018 21:29:39 GMT
Yeah, there's definitely a valid case for Bomber/Mauler but there's a ton of little synergies where I prefer the GK in a Madrak1 SotN list.
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Post by deviantcad on Mar 30, 2018 3:12:12 GMT
I think it comes down to blood boon. The GK offers a way to break armor and a control/ ranged element. Mauler breaks armor and the bomber is ranged suppot that with rage can hit pretty hard. Both are strong choices and they fill simalar roles. I think it comes down to how much you want to gamble. The ricochet shoots and saving a fury every turn can be huge.
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gdnerd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 656
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Post by gdnerd on Mar 30, 2018 4:43:31 GMT
But I don't need blood boon that much. Every turn I'm dumping 3+ into the stone as is. Once I've maxed out the krielstone I'm actively trying to burn my fury, I'm not trying to maximize fury efficiency.
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Post by allinontrolls on Mar 30, 2018 8:20:45 GMT
i would suggest a champ hero if you go for double champs. If their is nothing to screen your champs a ret strike could help soften up or even kill the target. I am not sure if a full stone is realy worth the extra 3 points. Reducing the stone would give u some points to play with. Especially if you are going second a small one would be often enough.
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Post by radamanthys on Mar 30, 2018 8:33:08 GMT
if you can only choose one, What would be the best support for the champions? fell caller skaldi champion
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gdnerd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 656
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Post by gdnerd on Mar 30, 2018 8:38:29 GMT
i would suggest a champ hero if you go for double champs. If their is nothing to screen your champs a ret strike could help soften up or even kill the target. I am not sure if a full stone is realy worth the extra 3 points. Reducing the stone would give u some points to play with. Especially if you are going second a small one would be often enough. No. God No. NEVER EVER EVER MIN THE STONE. Seriously, even in the best case scenario where you can actually cover up the entirety of your forces, that means the stone is further forwards and can more easily be targeted by scalpels. And if my LVO experience should teach anyone anything, it's that you pretty much lose when you lose your Krielstone. radamanthys I assume you mean Hero when you say champion but I'd probably pick Skaldi. 8 boxes for Sanguine Bond usage, as well as Overtake for infantry is just such a house.
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Post by Trollock on Mar 30, 2018 9:00:46 GMT
I wouldnt min the stone either (assuming your entire list wants the support). You will have a small enough footprint as is.
For the champ support id go Fell caller > Skaldi > Champ hero. With Madrak though i could make arguments for Skaldi before fell caller, but pathfinder is so key even on early turns where you cant really use relentless charge that i prefer the fell caller.
You should get 3 free things though, so Fellcaller, Skaldi and Runebearer are free. I leave the champ hero at home.
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Post by allinontrolls on Mar 30, 2018 9:11:29 GMT
It is always a big discussion about min or max stone. If you brick with both units of champs the question would be if they could draw line of sight. But i could see the reasons for a max stone. In your current build you lack a bit of magic weapons and upkeep removal. If fighting cryx this could be an issue. Perhaps Eilish instead of Llanyssa or a Sorccer could be an option.
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