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Post by Cryptix on Mar 14, 2017 16:01:32 GMT
Siege Weapon is all they need, and then they'd actually have a niche. A unit of 5 can take out approximately 2 Cryx Colossals on average if aiming.
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Post by enimaz on Mar 14, 2017 16:37:23 GMT
That would help a bit. If they don't get blasted off the table first and can actually hit their target.
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Post by welshhoppo on Mar 14, 2017 21:11:37 GMT
What they need is a mini feat which grants them sniper.
Also, they could make good use of dual attack. And maybe the Caraspace rule.
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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Mar 14, 2017 22:09:18 GMT
Well it depends on what we want the Bombardiers to BE. I want them to be a powerful ranged Unit. I think they might want Brutal on their Ranged guns.
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Post by Arthorn on Mar 14, 2017 22:48:21 GMT
Doesnt Ffe of irusk2 works on bombardiers
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wendan
Junior Strategist
Posts: 785
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Post by wendan on Mar 14, 2017 23:10:14 GMT
It does, and Hand of Fate/ S&P with Vlad
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Post by enimaz on Mar 16, 2017 11:34:42 GMT
With their low spd and rng they aren't that great at shooting IMO.
I would like for their grenade launchers to be a 1 time minifeat. Gives brutal dmg on their launcher and assault.
Keep the critical hit on their chainsaws and give them some armor against ranged and blast immune.
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Post by borderprince on Mar 16, 2017 12:50:09 GMT
For a Man of War theme force, I think there are a number of possible purposes: 1 - Use the theme force to make the un(der)-used units viable, like the buff to Posse in the Blindwater theme. That would mean unit specific buffs;
If they go down the individual unit buffs route, something needs to be done about Demo Corps and especially Bombardiers. One possibility might be simply losing the word 'Critical' on weapon abilities. Automatic Shred on hit would give the Bombardiers a quite nasty melee presence against medium armoured models (2 P+S13 attacks is not bad at all against other medium infantry, even light jacks/beasts). Automatic Stationary is always nice.
I'd be really interested if they tried to play up the warjack-like nature of Men of War. They've done that by giving the Kovnik the Slam power attack. Maybe let Demo Corps trample on the charge? It would let them get through screening infantry to hit harder targets and helps a Men of War army with the low volume of attacks problem.
2 - Focus on the theme as a way to make a Man of War army viable - that might focus less on the individual units, and more the collective. For example, shooting might be intended to be handled by jacks (maybe include Behemoth as this theme is about the future of armored warfare for Khador?), so there isn't much need to buff the bombardiers. But there might be buffs to the support solos which may benefit all the units in some way (maybe Wall of Steel if base to base with another warrior model?). Perhaps practiced manuvers or something for the units, but that might undermine the benefits of Irusk2 with the theme too much.
Iron Fangs are actually trickier I think, as the individual units are already pretty good. I think this also needs to be a theme which works well with Kozlov and the Vlads, given their backgrounds.
I'd like something to make the Great Bears better. Maybe Flank: Iron Fang, or Counter-charge?
Beyond that, maybe play this theme up as the counterpart to the Men of War theme. If Men of War are the future of Khadoran armored warfare, Iron Fangs are the past. So make this an old-school Khador army by using this theme to make the Berzerker chassis jacks more viable. Maybe Aggressive for them? That would give them all free runs/charges, together with the ability to spend one focus without triggering Unstable. A charging Berzerker with 3 P+S16 attacks isn't bad.
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Post by Cryptix on Mar 16, 2017 13:06:00 GMT
I'd actually like for MoW to be part of the spellcaster's battlegroup for spells like Chosen Ground, Boundless Charge, etc. I wasn't sure how to implement it however.
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Post by HeadHunter on Mar 16, 2017 13:18:58 GMT
I'd really like to see them do something to make MoW armies viable. I love the look and the fluff of these models, they're one of the things that drew me to Khador in the first place. I want an excuse to buy and paint some!
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Post by chrisbatson on Mar 16, 2017 13:47:02 GMT
Siege Weapon is all they need, and then they'd actually have a niche. A unit of 5 can take out approximately 2 Cryx Colossals on average if aiming. help me understand the math here. Seige weapons gives a +1 d6 vs colossals? How does aiming help add any more damage?
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Post by welshhoppo on Mar 16, 2017 13:50:54 GMT
Siege Weapon is all they need, and then they'd actually have a niche. A unit of 5 can take out approximately 2 Cryx Colossals on average if aiming. help me understand the math here. Seige weapons gives a +1 d6 vs colossals? How does aiming help add any more damage? cause they aim like Winterguard. As in they can barely hit a khador Jack.
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Post by Cryptix on Mar 16, 2017 14:50:53 GMT
That never made sense to me. Elite veterans have same rat as cannon fodder? I think everyone goes to MAT 7 RAT 6, then Demo corp get Mat 8 and Bombardiers get RAT7. Shockie Officers can get RAT 7.
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Post by borderprince on Mar 16, 2017 20:55:30 GMT
I'd actually like for MoW to be part of the spellcaster's battlegroup for spells like Chosen Ground, Boundless Charge, etc. I wasn't sure how to implement it however. Boundless Charge isn't restricted to battlegroup anyway (it is often assumed to be because khador players mainly use it to speed jacks up - you can sometimes catch an opponent unaware with that). As for relatively low RAT, working from the IKRPG, that can reflect the inaccuracy of their weapons. In the RPG, MAT/RAT raw stats can be subject to modifiers on the hit roll. In the tabletop game those modifiers are incorporated into the RAT stat for simplicity. It's only where a model has more than one ranged weapon that there is a reason to use the inaccurate rule to give an attack roll penalty. So bombardiers might be RAT6 or 7 elites, but with inaccurate weapons (so inaccurate that only the elite can use them with even a hope of hitting).
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Post by HeadHunter on Mar 16, 2017 23:18:53 GMT
Yeah, basically they are carrying a petard on a shield. Even for artillerists, such a weapon is inaccurate. Using it for direct fire makes it even worse.
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