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Post by Trollock on Mar 7, 2017 21:50:44 GMT
Playing Doomy 2 in PoD seems like the new hotness after LVO. I too will be on this train a while i think, cause it seems both good an fun. I too had to revise my opinion that Rök is essential for Doomy 2 (he is so damned good, but he effectively costs 33 points since you miss out on 12 free points, and that isnt worth it. 2 normal heavies are just better), and i played the list in to Karchev with 8 jacks yesterday and managed to come out on top, though it was super swingy. Basically, my annoying whelps forced him to use TWO heavy warjacks to kill ONE whelp each on Karchevs feat turn, and that caused him to fail to kill more the third heavy i had sent against him. that allowed me to remove most of what he had left and i could score the win. Anyway, this post was supposed to be about Madrak 3. Doomy does NOT like to be shot by things like Sloan or Caine 3. He also does not like Haley 2 with her control. He is not super crazy about playing massed infantry, but i think he has game there at least. So basically he does not want Cygnar. I was torn between Ragnor (strong anti shooting), Grissel 2 (some anti shooting and great at shooting back) and Gunnbjorn (incredible anti shooting, and pretty good shooting himself), but i felt like all of them Were sort of weak in to Haley 2. So, what to do? Enter Madrak 3. I think he is a bad caster over all, but he seems to have a few really good tools against Cygnar. Spell Piercer is REALLY good against the faction that always brings Arcane Shield. Rebuke is strong against both storm Lances and Stormblades, and those guys are popular. He is also one of the harder casters to assassinate at range, and they can not snipe out his Kriel Stone. I decided to go with a brute force list. A list that utilities his ability to have more stuff because he doesnt need a Kriel Stone, and combines it with the ability to get more free points by bringing 100+ points of beasts. Now, you can do this in many different ways, but i ended up with this little thing: | Trollbloods Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] The Power of Dhunia
(Madrak 3) Madrak, Great Chieftain [+29][*]Dire Troll Mauler [15] [*]Earthborn Dire Troll [15] [*]Glacier King [35] [*]Glacier King [35] [*]Trollkin Runebearer [0]
Northkin Shaman [0] Northkin Shaman [0] Troll Whelps [0] Troll Whelps [4]
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I have only played the list twice, but it seems solid. It has great shooting, and you can easily kill 4 storm lances in a single turn at range, and that reduces their hitting power something fierce. Then you basically offer up your heavies for trade, and then you use your two Kings to punch out what ever remains and bully the table. When i played yesterday i had 2 kings + Madrak against Maddox, an inert Firefly and a dismounted Laddermore in the end. It felt really good Whelps are super key. You NEED to have them for fury management, because the kings will be running hot and you want to camp to keep the aura big. Use the Shamans or Madrak to stand near the kings to prevent electroleaps on to the whelps. If they catch on to you and you start to frenzy with the kings, things will go down hill fast. And yes i know, it sucks to not have a feat. Use the feat on the turn they are forced to try and assassinate you. +4 tough with no knock down and the possibility to walk away drastically reduces the odds for assassination.
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Post by ryssen2 on Mar 8, 2017 6:50:47 GMT
Interesting. I just built my Mad3 and am thinking of how to use him. I would love to see one of those GKs be a mountain king, but that leaves you with three nasty points that cannot be used when you remove the whelps. conflictchamber.com/#b71b_-0bgP9DfmbLc60iczfJfJ6RTrollbloods Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] The Power of Dhunia (Madrak 3) Madrak, Great Chieftain [+29] - Dire Troll Mauler [15] - Glacier King [35] - Trollkin Runebearer [0] - Mountain King [36] - Troll Impaler [11] - Night Troll [7] Northkin Shaman [0] Northkin Shaman [0] Troll Whelps [0] I think going something like this would be more for me. I would like to use his spears, and having a reach beast to clear out a glacier king could be awesome. Having the night troll as a screening beast that cannot be shot away could be good too. What I am missing here is the earths blessing animus, but I really want to have the two different kings and I think this lists can put up as much ranged threat with the addition of the impaler and far strike on mad3.
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Post by Trollock on Mar 8, 2017 9:14:27 GMT
Since i do not own two GKs, i might have to make do with the following list in an actual tournament. Seems pretty nasty too: | Trollbloods Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] The Power of Dhunia
(Madrak 3) Madrak, Great Chieftain [+29][*]Dire Troll Mauler or EBDT [15] [*]Troll Bouncer [9] [*]Troll Bouncer [9] [*]Glacier King [35] [*]Mountain King [36]
Northkin Shaman [0] Northkin Shaman [0] Troll Whelps [0] FREE SOLO [0]
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I would love to see Madrak use his spear too, but since i want to camp as much as possible to get a bigger aura, i basically ignored the spear. He killed one stormblade to allow my EBDT to dig deeper in to them, but that was about it. I guess the ideal situation is when the Cygnar player does not bother with Arcane Shield, since you have Spell Piercer. That allows you to do more fun things
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Post by ryssen2 on Mar 8, 2017 9:37:31 GMT
I do like the mountain king more than an additional glacier. Sprays with fortune are nice and it can also get through clouds with a whelp running into them. I think I would prefer a storm troll over another bouncer. using the eleaps to bounce of the gk or mk might be nice if you want to contest with the shamans.
Anyways, thank you for posting this list. Actually gave me some ideas for playing him!
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Post by Trollock on Mar 8, 2017 9:48:27 GMT
Yeah, a Storm Troll would be decent too. It is awesome to be immune to electricity vs Cygnar. It is just incredibly frustrating that those bastards are also all immune to the Storm Troll
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Arcaux
Junior Strategist
Posts: 724
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Post by Arcaux on Mar 8, 2017 9:56:29 GMT
Hmmm, not sure. I definitely think Madrak 3 is one of our best casters against Cygnar, but I think it would crush me to use him with so little of his kit.
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Post by Trollock on Mar 8, 2017 10:25:32 GMT
Try it. Having a list that big is BRUTAL on the opponent. You get use out of Fortune, Spell Piercer and Rebuke, Protective Aura plus some random bits and bobs. If you play Doomy 2, you use the feat, Wild Aggression, Hex blast and the field marshal. The other things come up too some times, but you get my drift. Madrak has a big toolkit and you simply can not use it all every game i think.
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Post by ryssen2 on Mar 8, 2017 11:09:42 GMT
The only thing I am worried about is that the kings will just die, they do in the other lists I have tried even when there is a protective feat. We will see.
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Post by TrollBossJusmu on Mar 8, 2017 14:32:01 GMT
Really liking the look of bouncer variant with mountain glacier thou i think the list would be solid with just 1 bouncer and storm troll. But i might be delusional because Nemo 3 is local bad boy here
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Post by BlackcladElf on Mar 8, 2017 14:40:59 GMT
That is a pretty intriguing list, Trollock! As both Kings are on my painting table at present, I'm going to have to try it out.
I think the Free Solo should probably be the Runebearer, yeah? Every little bit of Fury-saving helps when you're trying to camp for the Krielstone. I guess you could go with another batch of Whelps, but since the MK makes his own, it seems a little unnecessary.
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Post by Trollock on Mar 8, 2017 16:36:58 GMT
I am undecided on the last solo. A runebearer will always be useful, but the list is so heavily dependent on having fury management that having too few whelps can lose you the game quickly. You can not count on a clever opponent allowing your MK to spawn whelps i think.
About the GKs dying. They will have to play further back in this list than you normally would. Your other beasts are your front line. Nothing that can kill a king should be able to reach it. If it is a hard hitting unit, you try and Rebuke it. If it is a jack, you stay out of threat, or push it back with the guns. It has worked pretty well in the two games i have played. Also, remember that there are TWO kings. You will probably lose one at some point, but then there is a whole one left. It is sooo much to chew through.
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Post by Warsmith on Mar 8, 2017 19:48:41 GMT
Having just played Madrak 3, he's different. I thought he was just a bad caster when I first read him, but after playing him he is just weird. He's not particularly good at anything, but ok at some things. I actually kind of enjoyed playing him I just wish he was more focused. He's all over the place.
Personally, I like the Bouncer variant list. I like the two different kings because it provides options. I am more of a toolbox guy so the more options the better.
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Post by jeremiahkraykray on Mar 8, 2017 22:27:35 GMT
I am glad you are finding success with madrak3 and I have to say I like the second list. I agree with Warsmith that that added utility of two different kings is quite nice. I imagine you have been playing Earthborn as the 15 point heavy? That seems pretty natural to me, especially if this list is targeting cygnar so specifically. That does make your mk the king you commit last, but I don't necessarily think that is a bad thing.
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Post by chgros on Mar 9, 2017 13:37:26 GMT
heyy really nice !!
but if this is against cygnar, what about a sloan with gun mage captain adept. it will ignore your GK or MK with shadown fire and shoot madrak to death ... (BG ignore clouds) .... how to protect him ( 2 shield guard won't be enough).
Also, could ragnor 2 guarguan be better ? You loose things (spelpiercer, rebuke) for sure (have to take the krielstone etc) but you have a feat ... and a big one considering you have 2 guarg here.
Trollblood - 75 - Ragnor DBL guarguan Theme: The Power of Dhunia 3 / 3 Free Cards 74 / 75 Army
Ragnor Skysplitter, the Runemaster - WB: +30 - Trollkin Runebearer - PC: 0 - Mountain King - PC: 36 (Battlegroup Points Used: 30) - Glacier King - PC: 35 - Earthborn Dire Troll - PC: 15 - Troll Bouncer - PC: 9 Troll Whelps - 5 Whelps: 0 Troll Whelps - 5 Whelps: 0 Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes - Leader & 3 Grunts: 6 - Stone Scribe Elder - PC: 3
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Arcaux
Junior Strategist
Posts: 724
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Post by Arcaux on Mar 9, 2017 13:57:08 GMT
heyy really nice !! but if this is against cygnar, what about a sloan with gun mage captain adept. it will ignore your GK or MK with shadown fire and shoot madrak to death ... (BG ignore clouds) .... how to protect him ( 2 shield guard won't be enough). Also, could ragnor 2 guarguan be better ? You loose things (spelpiercer, rebuke) for sure (have to take the krielstone etc) but you have a feat ... and a big one considering you have 2 guarg here. Trollblood - 75 - Ragnor DBL guarguan Theme: The Power of Dhunia 3 / 3 Free Cards 74 / 75 Army Ragnor Skysplitter, the Runemaster - WB: +30 - Trollkin Runebearer - PC: 0 - Mountain King - PC: 36 (Battlegroup Points Used: 30) - Glacier King - PC: 35 - Earthborn Dire Troll - PC: 15 - Troll Bouncer - PC: 9 Troll Whelps - 5 Whelps: 0 Troll Whelps - 5 Whelps: 0 Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes - Leader & 3 Grunts: 6 - Stone Scribe Elder - PC: 3 I'm not sure Sloan even comes close to killing Madrak3 tbh. Trollocks idea was to camp 3 or 4 every turn. Madrak is base arm 16 so AP drops it to 8 + 2 from Shield, +2 from aura means he's already at Arm 12. Sloan was one of these boogiemen that everyone was scared about pre release who doesn't really get played because it never worked as well in practice as it did on paper.
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