Kavrae
Junior Strategist
Posts: 182
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Post by Kavrae on May 30, 2017 21:00:06 GMT
Yeah I was puzzling over how to fit Darragh into the list as well to be honest. I'm not sure how much work the knights will actually do, so maybe drop them to pick up Darragh and upgrade one of the min units of Bane Warriors to a max unit? By themselves, the Knights don't do much. But under the Wraith Engine's aura, buffed with Death Ward, or with Darragh Wrathe's Mortal Fear aura against hordes, they can be obnoxiously hard to remove from a scenario zone.
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Post by DakRamsin on May 30, 2017 22:23:58 GMT
Hmm, that does sound encouraging. Exciting though, seems like there will be lots of different variations to test.
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Deller
Junior Strategist
I’m on a Boat
Posts: 605
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Post by Deller on May 31, 2017 0:41:19 GMT
I'm not a fan of Asphyxious2 as a pair for Deneghra1 Ghost Fleet. The Deneghra Fleet's biggest weakness is mass RFP and Asphyxious2 doesn't cover that at all. In fact playing him into mass RFP likely means you either don't get a feat or have to spend time killing your own models to feat back later, and unlike in Mark2 we can't charge friendly models so spending time killing friendly models means whatever is doing the killing is walking extremely slowly. Personally if I'm going to pair Deneghra Fleet with Dark Host I'd rather it be run by someone who isn't reliant on recursion like Asphyxious1, Terminus, or Coven.
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Post by Gamingdevil on May 31, 2017 9:39:36 GMT
Sorry, just now saw this message. It's down to 15pt for Knights and 16pt for Warriors as of the last CID update before it ended. While things CAN change between the end of the CID and official release, I doubt they will. I don't think that is true, because if it was, that would mean they do nothing with the final week of feedback as well as their own internal testing. Remember, we only got the final test rules, at the start of the last week, we don't know what conclusions they draw from that week. It's a little annoying to have the point totals a little odd for the purpose of free models, but it's probably not worth changing them for that reason alone. It's also not as tight on points as the ghost fleet, which needs to be very careful with which models are taken. I really do hope they see that as a valid reason. 9/15 and 10/16 lends itself perfectly to 9+15+16 for exactly 40 points. I don't really see a reason to take a second unit of Knights in most lists, especially a minimum one, where I do see a reason for Warriors. But that might just be idle hope and not how the devs think. If everything stays as-is, I'm actually planning on running the following two armies> Deneghra1 Ghost Fleet 3 min units of Revenants with Rengrave, max Blackbanes, Pistol Wraith, Hellslinger, Machine Wraiths, and a Wraith Engine. Add in a couple arc nodes and an Inflictor to hit exact battlegroup points. Asphyxious2 Dark Host Haven't settled on the mix of banes, but it will have a Wraith Engine and an absurd number of clouds. Everything can hide except the WE which mostly makes the Banes absurdly hard to kill. I'm pretty sure that in the final incarnation, Wraith Engine only counted towards free points in Dark Host, so it's impossible to get all that stuff in a Ghost Fleet list (exactly 60 points of Revenants + 15 for WE + 3 free solos) I wouldn't play Asphyxious 2 with a Wraith Engine either, he has plenty of protection from shooting already, especially with the free clouds and would prefer more infantry over an extra source of Dark Shroud.
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Kavrae
Junior Strategist
Posts: 182
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Post by Kavrae on May 31, 2017 12:13:00 GMT
That is a good point Deller . While I did have a lot of success against shooting lists with Asphyxious2, I am opening myself up to an RFP problem. Since the Ghost Fleet is set, I'll look around and see what other caster I want to run the Dark Host with. So far the list is down to: Deneghra3, Asphyxious3, Goreshade2, Scaverous, and Skarre1. I pulled up my Ghost Fleet list in War Room. Warwitch Deneghra (WJ +28) Theme: Ghost Fleet Inflictor - PC: 13 Defiler - PC: 8 Nightwretch - PC: 7 Wraith Engine - PC: 15 Captain Rengrave - PC: 0 Hellslinger Phantom - PC: 0 Pistol Wraith - PC: 0 Revenant Crew of the Atrementous - Leader & 5 Grunts: 9 Revenant Crew Rifleman - PC: 2 Revenant Crew Rifleman - PC: 2 Revenant Crew Rifleman - PC: 2 Revenant Crew of the Atrementous - Leader & 5 Grunts: 9 Revenant Crew Rifleman - PC: 2 Revenant Crew Rifleman - PC: 2 Revenant Crew Rifleman - PC: 2 Revenant Crew of the Atrementous - Leader & 5 Grunts: 9 Revenant Crew Rifleman - PC: 2 Revenant Crew Rifleman - PC: 2 Blackbane's Ghost Raiders - Blackbane & 9 Grunts: 17 Apparently I didn't have any Machine Wraiths in this one.
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Deller
Junior Strategist
I’m on a Boat
Posts: 605
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Post by Deller on May 31, 2017 15:05:35 GMT
Having read many of your reports your primary source of success with Asphyxious2 appears to be because of Cloud walls so I feel like Asphyxious1 or Coven would be good substitutions. Asphyxious1 has the same Cloud Wall tech, he just can't place it with pinpoint accuracy unless you're willing to sacrifice a few models, although Bane Knights B2B in a Wraith Engine Aura actually survive a BoC on average needing 9s to kill so there's always that. Coven have their Veil of Mists cloud so while they can only contribute a single extra cloud, it's at least AoE 4.
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Post by DakRamsin on May 31, 2017 18:28:45 GMT
Gaspy 1 feels a bit redundant since Scything Touch isn't going to do a whole lot in a list full of Banes, though I guess throwing it out on a B. Knight or a B. Rider with their range 2 could be pretty good. The Coven, by contrast, seems like they could really help with the delivery of the army. While all of the Banes are going to have prowl due to the theme bonus I can also see Occultation being a really nice utility spell if you need a unit to be somewhere where they can't hide, in addition to the awesomeness that is the Veil of Mists. Ghost Walk would pretty much be for your jacks since most (all?) of your infantry has ghostly / incorporeal already. Seems like all versions of this army get countered pretty hard by an eyeless sight gunline, though, at least on paper. With that in mind The Coven + a WE seem like the better option for delivery.
Bleh. I'm rambling. I hope that made a bit of sense and added a little to the conversation.
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Post by Gamingdevil on Jun 1, 2017 8:30:21 GMT
Having read many of your reports your primary source of success with Asphyxious2 appears to be because of Cloud walls so I feel like Asphyxious1 or Coven would be good substitutions. Asphyxious1 has the same Cloud Wall tech, he just can't place it with pinpoint accuracy unless you're willing to sacrifice a few models, although Bane Knights B2B in a Wraith Engine Aura actually survive a BoC on average needing 9s to kill so there's always that. Coven have their Veil of Mists cloud so while they can only contribute a single extra cloud, it's at least AoE 4. Gaspy 1 can use auto-recurring Revenant Crew for aiming clouds. Unfortunately he loses out on the extra clouds from Deathjack and a Spellslave in the Ghost Fleet theme. Hitting about 3 Bane Knights has a rather decent chance of killing at least one, so I don't think this is a very good idea. Could try in Infernal Machines, using Surgeons to recur the Mechanithralls you snipe out.
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pain
Baby's First Wargame
Posts: 5
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Post by pain on Jun 15, 2017 8:16:17 GMT
Infantry spam
https://conflictchamber.com/#c4201b_-0B0Z19191h1h2Ai22k2ki5i5hZh_hZh_hZh_
Cryx Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Dark Host
(Helleana 1, Morgaen 1 & Selene 1) The Witch Coven of Garlghast [+26] - Deathripper [6] - Deathripper [6] - Stalker [8] - Stalker [8] - Skarlock Thrall [4] Bane Lord Tartarus (CID) [0(6)] Machine Wraith [2] Machine Wraith [2] Bane Knights (CID) (max) [15] Bane Knights (CID) (max) [15] Bane Warriors (CID) (min) [10] - Bane Warrior Officer & Standard (CID) [0(5)] Bane Warriors (CID) (min) [10] - Bane Warrior Officer & Standard (CID) [0(5)] Bane Warriors (CID) (min) [10] - Bane Warrior Officer & Standard (CID) [5]
Decsecrators list
https://conflictchamber.com/#c4201b_-0B0Z193c3c1f2Ai22ki5hZh_hZh_hZh_
Cryx Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Dark Host
(Helleana 1, Morgaen 1 & Selene 1) The Witch Coven of Garlghast [+26] - Deathripper [6] - Desecrator [14] - Desecrator [14] - Nightwretch [7] - Skarlock Thrall [0(4)] Bane Lord Tartarus (CID) [0(6)] Machine Wraith [0(2)] Bane Knights (CID) (max) [15] Bane Warriors (CID) (min) [10] - Bane Warrior Officer & Standard (CID) [5] Bane Warriors (CID) (min) [10] - Bane Warrior Officer & Standard (CID) [5] Bane Warriors (CID) (min) [10] - Bane Warrior Officer & Standard (CID) [5]
Im still think that coven is best for lowspeed army because of feat. You also got aoe cloud to hide your banes. 3 min units base in both lists. That give you more activations and force your opponent to focus on killing single unit per turn. All you need - just carefull positioning of your attaches to trigger minifeat.
You also got occu to hide and CoS to matfix (since you got MA 9 on caster its not so hard to land it on major targets).
TBH i personally think that second list with desecrators much better. Feedback will be nice. Share your thoughts
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