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Post by hocestbellum on Oct 13, 2021 14:23:40 GMT
Some rumours from The Meta podcast (which I did not listen to so this is second hand) where they had Faye on:
- Behemoth will be 20 points, gain Powerful Attack on all weapons, and will be part of Armoured Corps - Black Ivan will be 16 points, will lose Evasion and Point Blank, and gain Dual Attack - Old Witch 1 will gain 6 WJP
I'm also hearing talk that Open Fire (Malakov2) will be reduced to 1 cost
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Post by michael on Oct 13, 2021 18:01:00 GMT
I ain’t got time to bleed, or listen to podcasts. So I appreciate that somebody else condensed an hour of chatter to 18 seconds of reading. Thanks!
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Post by Havock on Oct 13, 2021 22:11:54 GMT
Copypaste from discord:
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Post by Soul Samurai on Oct 14, 2021 4:18:20 GMT
Open Fire being 1 focus is nice; I like the ability but found it hard to afford; and often hard to justify 2 focus for 1 unboostable attack.
Cheaper Black Ivan is good, but that still doesn't sound like enough - especially since losing Point Blank makes him worse in melee (especially against infantry). I dunno.
Behemoth getting 5 points cheaper and gaining an extra rule kind of blows my mind. If he's not too powerful now, then what does that mean? Was he OK when he came out but the game has had a ton of power creep since then, or was he just seriously underpowered before - in which case how did that happen? Anyway, I'm glad he's a lot more affordable now, and while Powerful Attack in melee doesn't increase his damage output against typical heavies, it does makes him more versatile as it makes him much better against high DEF opponents (and is good for killing Warlocks for example). He was always a useful jack for Strakhov for his ability to trigger Overrun more reliably at range, but now he's even better since he's a more reliable 'caster assassin.
I'm a terrible judge of this sort of thing, but assuming none of the changes lead to OP models or combos, it looks like the changes are making weaker models more viable and just making things generally more playable without breaking the game? I hope?
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Post by Havock on Oct 14, 2021 11:40:43 GMT
That seems to be the case, yes. It's a case of shaving off a little from the top and adding a little to the bottom; more in-depth rebalancing will happen later focusing on less models at the same time. Faye does seem to have a better idea of what the game needs and straight up acknowledges they dropped the ball regarding balancing earlier on (and not "there's bound to be some variety because there's a ton of shit" but actual "some stuff was just way too good.") so I have confidence the game will become better. ie. new management good.
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Post by michael on Oct 14, 2021 19:23:56 GMT
Point Blank on an AOE gun was cute.
Sure, I was probably the only person who ever used it and who knew the rules for how it worked*, but hey, what's that matter?
* Nothing is funnier than when you miss and your melee attack deviates. Everybody gets suuuuper confused, but rationalizing it is comedy gold!
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Post by MacGuffin on Oct 15, 2021 0:20:31 GMT
That seems to be the case, yes. It's a case of shaving off a little from the top and adding a little to the bottom; more in-depth rebalancing will happen later focusing on less models at the same time. Faye does seem to have a better idea of what the game needs and straight up acknowledges they dropped the ball regarding balancing earlier on (and not "there's bound to be some variety because there's a ton of shit" but actual "some stuff was just way too good.") so I have confidence the game will become better. ie. new management good. I strongly agree with your assessment. Faye's tone fills me with confidence in the upcoming rule changes. I was especially impressed with her candor regarding past mistakes, her sense of how point values correspond to rules, and her humility regarding the potential for error. Her tone contrasts sharply with the tone we saw from prior devs ("playtested for years") at the beginning of MK3.
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Post by Soul Samurai on Oct 15, 2021 6:08:09 GMT
That seems to be the case, yes. It's a case of shaving off a little from the top and adding a little to the bottom; more in-depth rebalancing will happen later focusing on less models at the same time. Faye does seem to have a better idea of what the game needs and straight up acknowledges they dropped the ball regarding balancing earlier on (and not "there's bound to be some variety because there's a ton of shit" but actual "some stuff was just way too good.") so I have confidence the game will become better. ie. new management good.
That's reassuring. Perhaps I'll actually get MAT 7 Spriggans after all... fingers crossed...
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Post by Soul Samurai on Oct 15, 2021 6:24:43 GMT
Point Blank on an AOE gun was cute. Sure, I was probably the only person who ever used it and who knew the rules for how it worked*, but hey, what's that matter? I think I used it once? Pretty sure I put Black Ivan in my list specifically because he was bad (it's a thing that I do sometimes); either that or I misread his rules. * Nothing is funnier than when you miss and your melee attack deviates. Everybody gets suuuuper confused, but rationalizing it is comedy gold! I mean, it deviates half an inch at most? Clearly Black Ivan was shooting around their feet to make them dance. Makes perfect sense.
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Post by Havock on Oct 15, 2021 13:19:10 GMT
I miss Mk2's Black Ivan, where he was DEF12 and actually synergized with that dodge thing he had if you put him with a Superiority caster.
DEF14 ARM20 with dodge was pretty obnoxious to deal with, even if the jack itself wasn't too hot; made for a decent scenario piece.
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Post by Soul Samurai on Oct 15, 2021 16:03:33 GMT
Agreed. I used to run him with Strakhov sometimes, the DEF14 Dodge combo was a nice little thing to have.
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Post by droopingpuppy on Oct 16, 2021 17:32:33 GMT
Yeah Open Fire really deserves for COST 1. Usually an unboosted ranged attack of a warjack/warbeast is not so scary. Against heavies sometimes even two unboosted shots are weaker than one shot with a boosted damage roll. Yes Open Fire also allows to put the AOE and it can do something out of its own activation so you may had some tactical advantage for this, but COST 2 is still too much.
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Post by Soul Samurai on Oct 16, 2021 19:16:22 GMT
I remember Open Fire was first being tested at 1 focus, and then they raised it to two. And someone (I don't remember who), said that was too much, but I said it felt OK to me since it was similar to Jackhammer but had more range and worked on ranged attacks as well. That was before I actually tried it; after playing Andy2 I still like the spell at 2 focus, but it's very hard to cast and feels like it should cost just 1.
Maybe some day I'll learn to stop judging models without playing them/against them.
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Post by michael on Oct 16, 2021 22:04:13 GMT
I remember Open Fire was first being tested at 1 focus, and then they raised it to two. And someone (I don't remember who), said that was too much, but I said it felt OK to me since it was similar to Jackhammer but had more range and worked on ranged attacks as well. That was before I actually tried it; after playing Andy2 I still like the spell at 2 focus, but it's very hard to cast and feels like it should cost just 1. Maybe some day I'll learn to stop judging models without playing them/against them. If it makes you feel any better, I also said Open Fire cost too much during the Armored Corps CID too. Nobody noticed because a dozen trolls were busy shouting conspiracy theories about how Suppression Tankers could assassinate any caster in their DZ during the first turn, and citing Venusian hypermath to prove (“prove”) that SPD 4 Shield Wall Shocktroopers could contest zones/flags 20” away by the second turn. :-P
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Post by Armchair Warrior on Oct 17, 2021 0:38:26 GMT
I thought Faye was great too. I love the change to Behemoth, and hope the Kraken change means Victor and Conquest lose a couple of points.
The random thing she said that gives me the most hope? She said that casters were the most heavily reworked models in the game, and I can’t help but hope (like Charlie Brown staring down a football) that Butcher 2 and Sorscha 2 got reworked.
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