Ganso
Junior Strategist
Posts: 932
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Post by Ganso on Jan 8, 2019 21:24:31 GMT
Fact check: Butcher3 dropped at GenCon 2013. So there. don't know what the hell you are talking about
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shiver
Junior Strategist
Posts: 150
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Post by shiver on Jan 8, 2019 22:18:14 GMT
It is a fair question as to how well the inherent limitations of huge bases and the specific predators of them keep them in check when a battle engine is usually going to be straight up more powerful than a jack or especially a beast of the same cost, and they count toward freebies. But when entire themes see basically no play without their respective BE, that balance does seem a bit off. So... Marauder spam makes a comeback? Considering that Marauder Spam never existed... Sure why not? you arent serious are you? after mad dogs and Karchev got dumpster fired, marauder spam very much was a thing after they picked up their extra dice on huge based models rule. many lists didn't run 10, but seeing 5 or 6 in a list was very common.
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Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on Jan 8, 2019 22:23:28 GMT
I just wish PP would sort out their overseas distribution. Drillers have been unavailable in the UK for 6 months as the mold used to make them has broken and not yet been replaced. It's a pretty sad state of affairs when you cant even buy a companies product
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vlad
BattleBox Champ
Posts: 53
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Post by vlad on Jan 8, 2019 22:50:51 GMT
Considering that Marauder Spam never existed... Sure why not? you arent serious are you? after mad dogs and Karchev got dumpster fired, marauder spam very much was a thing after they picked up their extra dice on huge based models rule. many lists didn't run 10, but seeing 5 or 6 in a list was very common. Maybe it was very common where you play, but definitively not everywhere. Looking at the WTC 2017 (before the point cost revision) stats you have 121 Marauders for 36 players (72 lists), on average less than two Marauders per list. If you browse the lists you will see a few lists spamming 5+ of them, but most lists would have 0-3 - not what I’d call spam. I’d therefore say that Marauder spam was definitively not very common in general.
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Post by Charistoph on Jan 8, 2019 23:04:11 GMT
I just wish PP would sort out their overseas distribution. Drillers have been unavailable in the UK for 6 months as the mold used to make them has broken and not yet been replaced. It's a pretty sad state of affairs when you cant even buy a companies product Especially if you do Champions and so want to take advantage of an ADR which has a Theme you have no models in.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2019 6:57:14 GMT
I have been reading a lot of the comments in this thread and I just wanted to add my voice to this discussion. Overall I truly hope everything is ok with PP because I love the Iron Kingdoms. I don't think they are going under but I do think they are reforming to improve themselves as a company. I have read before that they are working on updating their website for starters which will be great seeing that they cut No Quarter and they will be adding a lot of the lore to the website. I was extremely sad to see No Quarter go but in the long run if it wasn't profitable for them I would rather them put those resources to something else. As for the talk about the MK3 release I don't see a huge problem. I feel like the release was pretty outstanding see that you don't even have to buy a book to play the game. Now this is coming from a person that does not get to play the game because I live to far away from anywhere to play but with that said I have been watching what PP has been doing with MK3. For a game that is so competitive it is constantly being tweaked which is fantastic. Every other game that I know of does not have the PUBLIC active development that this game provides. I am completely impressed by there efforts to bring this community a great game that is as balanced as possible. In my opinion we all need to give them our support because it is a game and setting that we love and continue to want to be apart of. We definitely need to hold them responsible for their mistakes but we also need to give credit where credit is due. Threads that are on facebook or on here just complaining about the state of the game all the time discourages new people from even trying out the game. No one wants to not be able to play because there is a lack of new players. The press gangers have been disbanded but if you play the game or even just have an interest in the lore we definitely need to make an effort to not disparage new people from trying it out.
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Post by Big Fat Troll on Jan 9, 2019 12:15:41 GMT
Has anyone ever weighed the rumored legal risk of keeping the Pressgangers against the certain harm done by disbanding them?
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Post by michael on Jan 9, 2019 13:42:50 GMT
I have been reading a lot of the comments in this thread and I just wanted to add my voice to this discussion. Overall I truly hope everything is ok with PP because I love the Iron Kingdoms. I don't think they are going under but I do think they are reforming to improve themselves as a company. I have read before that they are working on updating their website for starters which will be great seeing that they cut No Quarter and they will be adding a lot of the lore to the website. I was extremely sad to see No Quarter go but in the long run if it wasn't profitable for them I would rather them put those resources to something else. As for the talk about the MK3 release I don't see a huge problem. I feel like the release was pretty outstanding see that you don't even have to buy a book to play the game. Now this is coming from a person that does not get to play the game because I live to far away from anywhere to play but with that said I have been watching what PP has been doing with MK3. For a game that is so competitive it is constantly being tweaked which is fantastic. Every other game that I know of does not have the PUBLIC active development that this game provides. I am completely impressed by there efforts to bring this community a great game that is as balanced as possible. In my opinion we all need to give them our support because it is a game and setting that we love and continue to want to be apart of. We definitely need to hold them responsible for their mistakes but we also need to give credit where credit is due. Threads that are on facebook or on here just complaining about the state of the game all the time discourages new people from even trying out the game. No one wants to not be able to play because there is a lack of new players. The press gangers have been disbanded but if you play the game or even just have an interest in the lore we definitely need to make an effort to not disparage new people from trying it out. Everything is OK.
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Post by Korianneder on Jan 9, 2019 14:53:59 GMT
Has anyone ever weighed the rumored legal risk of keeping the Pressgangers against the certain harm done by disbanding them? I'd imagine that the legal risk is much worse when a big company like wotc disbands their dnd volunteer program a few months prior. Last I heard the class action lawsuit by some magic judges is still going through the courts. Just fighting a case like that can be very expensive over the years even if you end up winning it. Better to avoid it entirely.
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Post by elladan52 on Jan 9, 2019 15:05:27 GMT
Has anyone ever weighed the rumored legal risk of keeping the Pressgangers against the certain harm done by disbanding them? I'd imagine that the legal risk is much worse when a big company like wotc disbands their dnd volunteer program a few months prior. Last I heard the class action lawsuit by some magic judges is still going through the courts. Just fighting a case like that can be very expensive over the years even if you end up winning it. Better to avoid it entirely. Yeah, the legal risk is tremendous either way - win or lose, there will be a massive expense that would likely bankrupt a company like PP. Compare that to cutting an already expensive and bloated program and it is a no brainer.
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Post by michael on Jan 9, 2019 15:09:09 GMT
Has anyone ever weighed the rumored legal risk of keeping the Pressgangers against the certain harm done by disbanding them? Yes. Privateer did that. But seriously; how would you expect anybody but Privateer to be able to perform such an analysis? Only they have the full data. In a nutshell, however: Privateer was potentially exposed to litigation for not complying with labor laws in potentially any random municipality in the U.S. That’s simply too much for a small company to deal with.
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unded
Junior Strategist
Posts: 760
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Post by unded on Jan 9, 2019 15:31:50 GMT
Oddly enough, the best thing that could happen (for the PG program) is for WotC to win their lawsuit. If they set a nice big precedent, then the risk of liability decreases substantially. The fact that it's still ongoing litigation does not bode well for an unmitigated win, however.
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Post by slaughtersun on Jan 9, 2019 15:38:33 GMT
I also recall that not only was the possible legal issue but also that the program just bacame too much to handle for a small company...
Rumours that some people were playing the PP system were also in the air at the time...
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unded
Junior Strategist
Posts: 760
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Post by unded on Jan 9, 2019 15:47:40 GMT
I mean, they seemed to manage it well enough, and the marketing impetus of it surely paid for whatever management time it consumed.
As for folks gaming the system, I really doubt they were getting gamed hard enough to actually impact their bottom line, so the worst it does is bruise someone's ego.
Really the big issue had to be the legal liability (for which I have full sympathy - it's the kind of unexpected liability that could sink a small company).
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Post by sand20go on Jan 9, 2019 15:50:28 GMT
Has anyone ever weighed the rumored legal risk of keeping the Pressgangers against the certain harm done by disbanding them? Yes. Privateer did that. But seriously; how would you expect anybody but Privateer to be able to perform such an analysis? Only they have the full data. In a nutshell, however: Privateer was potentially exposed to litigation for not complying with labor laws in potentially any random municipality in the U.S. That’s simply too much for a small company to deal with. +1. Now I do think they have dropped the ball on figuring out a REPLACEMENT way of incenting community building The least legally fraught mechanism would have been to incent retailers with discounts, exclusives, training ect. That is FULLY in the swim lane. Host a tournament with above X participants who provide an email and you fill out a form to try to put a small barrier to lying - get a discount on your next order or a credit back from PP after your next order from distributor. But as I think I noted in another thread on PP - a HUGE gap in their publically announced corporate structure is the lack of a marketing executive. This is NOT rocket science. But it is about being honest about the game you have built, its core market, the way it grows, and how you as a company can support it. (Total aside - you knew they had a problem when some mensa candidate thought the MK3 video with the happy couple and baby in the sling with the $1300 gaming table was the image of the core WM/H player ;-)
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