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Fall CID
Dec 1, 2018 10:55:20 GMT
via mobile
Post by welshhoppo on Dec 1, 2018 10:55:20 GMT
If I go first. Normally I charge or boundless charge the witch up the board. So she sits on the 16-18 inch line, her aura then goes all the way back to the 34-36 inch line, which is only 2 inches out of the enemy deployment zone.
The trick is to not run the reavers full distance turn one. Just enough to charge anything that comes into any of the zones.
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Post by jonnyboy on Dec 1, 2018 15:49:41 GMT
Has anyone tested using the reaver UA for cloud walls? Just thought of it now, but they are the same defense and have sac pawn. This sounds pretty bonkers.
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Fall CID
Dec 1, 2018 16:38:44 GMT
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Post by Armchair Warrior on Dec 1, 2018 16:38:44 GMT
Has anyone tested using the reaver UA for cloud walls? Just thought of it now, but they are the same defense and have sac pawn. This sounds pretty bonkers. Shhhhh!
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Fall CID
Dec 1, 2018 17:30:55 GMT
via mobile
Post by auraco on Dec 1, 2018 17:30:55 GMT
Has anyone tested using the reaver UA for cloud walls? Just thought of it now, but they are the same defense and have sac pawn. This sounds pretty bonkers. That is actually a pretty good idea. Risky with stuff threathening in melee or blast, but there are clearly situations where it could be the best thing to do. Good thinking.
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Fall CID
Dec 2, 2018 14:44:12 GMT
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Post by macdaddy on Dec 2, 2018 14:44:12 GMT
Out of curiosity who are you referencing in trolls? Budhwackers? Because honestly when was the last time you say those lol A few years back actually. Its almost like you're incapable of wrapping your head around the fact that metas change and models you didnt see for awhile suddenly become useable or good again. A few years back we didn’t even have themes. I remember a cute/janky grim2 list that ran them. Even then it was designed as an assassination list. Bushwackers are widely considered to be pretty overcosted for what they do. Keep in mind they are rat4 meaning it takes a 3 man CRA to reliably hit doom reavers. Yes I’m capable of understanding how the meta changes. Remember when we were all afraid of gaspy 9 slayers abd Haley3? Well...we are not anymore thanks mostly to CiD. Are you actually capable of having discussion without attack people? Like honestly, where did the hostility come from?
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Post by Armchair Warrior on Dec 2, 2018 23:27:01 GMT
One of the reasons I like the old Khador forums on privateerpress.com, and like this one on lormahordes, is that folks put the salt in the cupboard and keep the vinegar in fridge. Let’s keep it civil, folks.
Please.
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Post by mcdermott on Dec 2, 2018 23:31:58 GMT
Or yknow, you could take em with gunnbjorn and just boost their attack rolls.
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Post by Cryptix on Dec 2, 2018 23:42:46 GMT
Enough talking about trolls. This is about the Fall CID, IE: the Wolves of Winter theme force and the changes made to it. If that discussion is complete, this thread can be locked.
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Post by mcdermott on Dec 3, 2018 2:14:08 GMT
Enough talking about trolls. This is about the Fall CID, IE: the Wolves of Winter theme force and the changes made to it. If that discussion is complete, this thread can be locked. Trolls are the tangent split off from the broader conversation of "RNG 14 shooting is probably the counter to Wolves Reaver spam" "RNG 14 shooting to deal with Wolves reaver spam isn't that common" "Yes it is look at all these factions with RNG14 shooting" "yeah but no one plays them" "because the meta hasn't shifted to include low arm single wound WM spam yet" "Hah you listed this one unit that never sees play cause rat 4" "yes but the faction has access to guided fire". Its still relevant to the CID and its fallout, macdaddy is just being upset because he's been aggressively wrong about the resources that counter these kinds of lists being readily available, just unused due to the mk3 meta up til this point.
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Post by onijet01 on Dec 3, 2018 3:20:38 GMT
mcdermott please calm down and think logically, as much as i hate to say this you seem to be mistaken.
Guided fire boosts the range attacks of models in the spellcasters battlegroup only. So in the case of the Pyg Bushwackers they are indeed only rat 4 base. Using their CRA they can reliable cause 3 doomreavers to make tough checks. Out of whom on average 2 die.
The fact is that into Wolves of Winter the largest trouble factions (in no order) will be.
Cygnar Retribution Menoth Crucible Guard Scorn Legion
For the range counter. Each faction has multible hard counters and reliable shooting and model removals. Legion is on the list due to its own ability to place outstanding ranged damage and rate of fire out.
We should be more polight in this forun and use logic in our opinions.
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Post by mcdermott on Dec 3, 2018 4:07:03 GMT
Oop, you are correct, I must have confused it with Deadeye. (as i've been thinking phaley ranged list pretty heavily as a counter)
And I'll be more polite, but in return maybe the expectation that people do at least a LITTLE looking into potential counters when a new list pops up rather than measuring it by whats played currently? Because when new things come around the meta has to shift, and most of the doom and gloom rhetoric is based in what is currently played rather than what used to wreck the hell out of these lists in mk2 and mk 1 (and surprise surprise it still does and basically none of the tools have disappeared). Also maybe don't pick the weakest possible example and stake a flag about how wrong that one is when you're arguing as though that minor victory proves all the strong examples incorrect.
Yeah reaver spam is going to suck for medium infantry (which people have complained about all through mk3) and low armor jack spam (which people have complained about all through mk3) but the existence of a functional light infantry wm spam means that low power shooting becomes a viable choice when you're picking list pairs again. The issue isn't that i'm not thinking logically, the issue is i was a little rude to someone who posted a pretty slanted CID test under the guise of lightly armored medium base infantry supposedly being the predator list vs doomreaver spam and i got a pair of spells mixed up.
(and alternatively, bushwhackers can use the CA which gives combined arms and lets them 2 man CRA with a reroll, as well as a high explosive AOE 4 dramatically upping their odds of hitting )
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Fall CID
Dec 3, 2018 12:16:28 GMT
via mobile
Post by onijet01 on Dec 3, 2018 12:16:28 GMT
mcdermott oh yah i agree. I may not the the best player (infact i lose alot due trying new ideas) but i do try to keep a steap ahead of the meta.
An example is over the last 3 months ive played cygnar's Sons of the Temple theme and nothing else. And suprisingly it works well into medium infantry or low model count lists. It also can work well into reiver spam by virtues of my two caster choices (tried both caine 1 and haley 1).
In khador is abilities stick at update i plan to run a vlad 1 list with 4 or 5 beserkers for cloud walls as on turn 1 they can easily screan my infantry thanks to vlads feat. And sings helps to get off the debuffs and augment damage further.
Alternitaly you can pop drop enemy models with scorca 1 as reavers make a cloud wall and they army strikes once stationary is applied to face. At def 15 (fog of war) she also makes eyeless sight and true sigh armies struggle to hit reliably without boosts at range
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Post by sand20go on Dec 3, 2018 21:26:23 GMT
Has anyone tested using the reaver UA for cloud walls? Just thought of it now, but they are the same defense and have sac pawn. This sounds pretty bonkers. That is some good tech!!! You ABSOLUTELY could run that with a variety of casters ;-)
QUick rule book question - what happens if you ALSO run it with Vlad1. Would Windwall around the thing which the sac pawn went to then Automiss?
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Post by hocestbellum on Dec 3, 2018 21:34:29 GMT
No, they are automatically hit by the transferred attack, and 'automatically hit' trumps 'automatically miss'
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Post by sand20go on Dec 3, 2018 22:11:02 GMT
Oop, you are correct, I must have confused it with Deadeye. (as i've been thinking phaley ranged list pretty heavily as a counter) And I'll be more polite, but in return maybe the expectation that people do at least a LITTLE looking into potential counters when a new list pops up rather than measuring it by whats played currently? Because when new things come around the meta has to shift, and most of the doom and gloom rhetoric is based in what is currently played rather than what used to wreck the hell out of these lists in mk2 and mk 1 (and surprise surprise it still does and basically none of the tools have disappeared). Also maybe don't pick the weakest possible example and stake a flag about how wrong that one is when you're arguing as though that minor victory proves all the strong examples incorrect. Yeah reaver spam is going to suck for medium infantry (which people have complained about all through mk3) and low armor jack spam (which people have complained about all through mk3) but the existence of a functional light infantry wm spam means that low power shooting becomes a viable choice when you're picking list pairs again. The issue isn't that i'm not thinking logically, the issue is i was a little rude to someone who posted a pretty slanted CID test under the guise of lightly armored medium base infantry supposedly being the predator list vs doomreaver spam and i got a pair of spells mixed up. (and alternatively, bushwhackers can use the CA which gives combined arms and lets them 2 man CRA with a reroll, as well as a high explosive AOE 4 dramatically upping their odds of hitting ) No doubt. I think the biggest issue for SOME (but not all) list pairings is whether the shooting can also handle AC. Now I refuse to spend a ton of brain power before everything drops (and I am REALLY thinking of a vlad1 list that plays out of theme that is designed as a "huge base hunter") but I think you will see a pretty viable list pairing of WoW as a glass cannon, with some anti-shooting tech for the approach, paired with something like Kozlov, Irusk1, perhaps even Sorscha2 to leverage IF shocktroopers and force you opponent to make a pretty awful choice.
(PS My own guess is that S2 is coming back with a vengeance as an AC caster - because SH Rifles are likely to "get good" and thus she would have a pretty sweet recursion removal tool in combo with IF Shocks.)
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