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Post by withengar on May 23, 2017 22:35:53 GMT
After having played the warspears at the beginning of m Mk3, i was so disappointed that i will not be bringing them on the table any time soon unfortunately.
So tomorrow i will be bringing this list versus retri,i do not know yet the caster. War Room Army
Legion of Everblight - Kallus2
Theme: Oracles of Annihilation 4 / 4 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army
Bunker - Steamroller Objective
Kallus, Devastation of Everblight - WB: +28 - Angelius - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 17) - Angelius - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 11) - Scythean - PC: 18 - Seraph - PC: 14 - Naga Nightlurker - PC: 8 - Nephilim Bolt Thrower - PC: 11 - Raek - PC: 8 - Raek - PC: 8
The Forsaken - PC: 0 The Forsaken - PC: 0 Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion - PC: 0 Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion - PC: 0 Blighted Nyss Shepherd - PC: 1 Spell Martyr - PC: 1
THEME: Oracles of Annihilation
Pure use of overrun to trade accordingly till I can open up space for assassination. No one can hide from 20"-24" threat unless they are shooting,then again that is not what im planning to dropping the list into.
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Post by ForEver_Blight on May 24, 2017 12:35:52 GMT
I'm a bit mad; I'm pondering and pouring over Kallus 2's design and have come to the conclusion that he really isn't designed to work in faction or in theme. At least as far as I can try and work out getting his feat to be meaningful.
Problem one is we have no continuous fire guns on non-characters. Problem two is that his spells require him to be either within 10 or 12" (or spellmartyr but I've still had boosted brand of fire miss and thus there goes the spell martyr). Problem three is that only a Raek can actually out pace the rest of his 12" ctrl enough to apply field marshal's fire effect. But if a Raek could charge or leap to it, an Angel could already charge it without the feat. Lastly; Overrun, while great, is still restricted by pitiful control range.
I really want to use him for an anti-gunline rush. To deal with things like Chargers, gun bunnies, stormwalls, etc... (I know there have to be harsher gun platforms but those are the constants I see). But if I can't reliably trigger his feat, then I can't effectively out threat the guns. Overrun is great, but a mass +3" is better than moving only 2 models. So the only thing I've really thought would work well would be croak raiders. But that means you can't play in theme. Azrael and Zuriel are both options (one being greater than the other) but again; out of theme. Ravens would be cute but then you have even less options.
So I'm really just annoyed that we're given a really impressive end goal, that [in faction] lacks the required tools to achieve. It's starting to be the case with a lot of things; we're missing key features that would make something we have, *actually* powerful. Which is that how you achieve "balance", give something a lot of power and then remove the linchpin that makes it work? (Mainly I'm ticked off with Lylyth 2 being a ball of contradiction and mediocrity)
Anyway, I just don't think I can get Kallus 2 to work for that specific purpose. Or I bite the bullet and put Azrael or Proteus in the list and try to play to janky movement Circle *cough* I mean shenanigans.
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Post by withengar on May 24, 2017 20:21:18 GMT
My list can be seen above, and here is the list i played against.
Lord Arcanist Ossyan - WJ: +28 - Manticore - PC: 14 (Battlegroup Points Used: 14) - Manticore - PC: 14 (Battlegroup Points Used: 14) - Manticore - PC: 14
Fane Knight Skeryth Issyen - PC: 0 Houseguard Thane - PC: 4 Houseguard Thane - PC: 4 Ghost Sniper - PC: 3 Ghost Sniper - PC: 3
Houseguard Halberdiers - Leader & 9 Grunts: 13 - Houseguard Halberdier Officer & Standard - Officer & Standard: 4 - Soulless Escort - PC: 1 Stormfall Archers - Leader & 3 Grunts: 9 - Soulless Escort - PC: 1 Stormfall Archers - Leader & 3 Grunts: 9 - Soulless Escort - PC: 1 Heavy Rifle Team - Leader & Grunt: 4 - Soulless Escort - PC: 1 Heavy Rifle Team - Leader & Grunt: 4
THEME: Defenders of Ios
Played on the new scenarios, don't remember which one but it was the second one with two rectangular zones and two circles and two objectives. Also terrain was placed like in CID, and i noticed that legion has a very nice advantage because of more terrain and nicely placed.
I lost the roll, but my opponent chose the side which did not really require pathfinder, only a pond in the middle,so i went first on the side with a forest and a pond.
Deployment: I deploy Kallus centrally, next to him the angeli and on the right,the Seraph next to Scythean,one Sorceress,a forsaken,a Raek and the spell martyr. On the left,the bolt thrower,naga,sorceress,forsaken and the shepherd. Ossyan deploys centrally next to the Fane Knight, Manticores around him,Halbediers on my left and the rest were separated,archers on both flanks etc.
1st turn: Everything runs forward staying outside of 23" of the stormfall archers, Angeli run 1" close to the central obstacle, granting +DEF against his shooting, and the right Raek moved a bit further,on a hill. His army just shuffles around, giving admonition to one of the manticores, quicken on the halbediers, and tried some shots on the right raek but misses. 2nd turn: I inform him that I believe i can manage a caster kill,so since its a friendly game and we don't want to end it there,we start using proxies to see how it goes. Overrun on the right raek, overrun on Scythean, and overrun on the bolt thrower. Right Raek jumps on some snipers, kills two, Angelius advances over the central obstruction. Bolt thrower shoots, second Angelius advances over the central obstacle too. Scythean gets slipstreamed and charges the halbediers,killing some but nothing important.First angelius repulses the dragoon,and charges Ossyan, receiving two free strikes from the halberdiers, taking around 4 damage i think, and dealing on the armor piercing attack around 12 damage. Second angelius charges,again receiving two free strikes,1-2 points of damage,and kills Ossyan with the armor piercing.
So here we decided to rewind the game,and we pretend he had the admonition on Ossyan. So on my turn,i killed the dragoon with the angelius, the scythean cleared most of the halbedierds, leaving only 3 alive, killed a sniper and an archer on the right flank with the raek,the bolt thrower had just missed on the dragoon and the naga had no target. The second Angelius simply hided behind the central obstruction. The left sorceress helped the raek to kill some halbedierds with her AOE and the right Sorceress, was sitting on a hill with the 8" no shooting aura, which proved to be really nice especially with a stealthy raek.
On his turn, he kills the scythean with the manticore,the angelius that killed the dragoon survived many attacks both from 2 shooting manticores and some attacks from the manticore which was attacking the scythean, with only 1 HP. He killed my right raek, the left raek survived all attacks from the stormfall archers who in the process killed one of their guys with the deviation(hue hue), and Ossyan was sitting on no focus,with admonition.
3rd turn: Seraph gets one shot, shoots Ossyan, flares him, boosts damage,deals a good amount, Bolt thrower advances, shoots Ossyan,kills him.
We talked about the scenarios a bit as well,i had scored only one point by then, and i dont really know how i could have managed to score more.Maybe if i focused on clearing the left zone,and only that. Then again Kallus threatens so deep with the Overrun, that on the second turn, if he had no shooting and i didnt have to stay that far back,i could have threatened even deeper. I really enjoyed it ,and overrun on the Scythean,allows it to thresher, and then move to another position to clear more infantry. I will be testing this list again on the future.
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Post by piedpiperwtf on May 25, 2017 0:41:37 GMT
My list can be seen above I like the list, keep in mind battle lusted forsaken, sorceress, and Kallus do considerable damage. Especially Kallus and the forsaken with their ability to buy attacks. Kallus's Mount also gets the extra dice to damage from lust and being Calvary his charge attacks are automatically boosted.
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Post by withengar on May 25, 2017 8:18:58 GMT
My list can be seen above I like the list, keep in mind battle lusted forsaken, sorceress, and Kallus do considerable damage. Especially Kallus and the forsaken with their ability to buy attacks. Kallus's Mount also gets the extra dice to damage from lust and being Calvary his charge attacks are automatically boosted. I had it in mind but i just didn't get the chance to use them. On turn two most of the beasts run hot so i had to ensure Kallus was safe from the manticores or whatever else was going to shoot him. But yeah they can do some work i'm pretty certain. Will certaintly play it again since the assassination potential is huge.
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Post by cainuslupus on May 25, 2017 8:47:58 GMT
I'm a bit mad; I'm pondering and pouring over Kallus 2's design and have come to the conclusion that he really isn't designed to work in faction or in theme. At least as far as I can try and work out getting his feat to be meaningful. Problem one is we have no continuous fire guns on non-characters. Problem two is that his spells require him to be either within 10 or 12" (or spellmartyr but I've still had boosted brand of fire miss and thus there goes the spell martyr). Problem three is that only a Raek can actually out pace the rest of his 12" ctrl enough to apply field marshal's fire effect. But if a Raek could charge or leap to it, an Angel could already charge it without the feat. Lastly; Overrun, while great, is still restricted by pitiful control range. I really want to use him for an anti-gunline rush. To deal with things like Chargers, gun bunnies, stormwalls, etc... (I know there have to be harsher gun platforms but those are the constants I see). But if I can't reliably trigger his feat, then I can't effectively out threat the guns. Overrun is great, but a mass +3" is better than moving only 2 models. So the only thing I've really thought would work well would be croak raiders. But that means you can't play in theme. Azrael and Zuriel are both options (one being greater than the other) but again; out of theme. Ravens would be cute but then you have even less options. So I'm really just annoyed that we're given a really impressive end goal, that [in faction] lacks the required tools to achieve. It's starting to be the case with a lot of things; we're missing key features that would make something we have, *actually* powerful. Which is that how you achieve "balance", give something a lot of power and then remove the linchpin that makes it work? (Mainly I'm ticked off with Lylyth 2 being a ball of contradiction and mediocrity) Anyway, I just don't think I can get Kallus 2 to work for that specific purpose. Or I bite the bullet and put Azrael or Proteus in the list and try to play to janky movement Circle *cough* I mean shenanigans. Shepherds can help you deliver beasts where you need them. Just run them where you need control. When it comes to feat, it looks like it was designed to work with old Ravagore animus, or we have some stuff around the corner. Right now Kallus2 seems all over the place.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on May 25, 2017 22:45:35 GMT
I honestly think a ogrun focused list will be very strong with him once we get our ogrun theme force. The only thing i think that those lists struggle with is setting things on fire for the feat. Double hellmouth will help, as sometimes tentacles will survive. I feel like the warmongers actually want the feat to help them reach their targets. Otherwise their threat range is pretty sad.
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Post by mallios on May 26, 2017 0:29:13 GMT
A theme allowing Ogrun may allow Minions, and a minimum unit of Croaks would certainly set things on fire for them.
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thelat
Junior Strategist
Posts: 480
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Post by thelat on Jun 12, 2017 22:31:14 GMT
I'd just like to chime in with this list I intend to run:
Legion of Everblight - Kallus2 Test Theme: No Theme Selected 75 / 75 Army Kallus, Devastation of Everblight - WB: +28 - Succubus - PC: 4 - Scythean - PC: 18 (Battlegroup Points Used: 18) - Scythean - PC: 18 (Battlegroup Points Used: 10) - Seraph - PC: 14 - Typhon - PC: 24 Blighted Nyss Shepherd - PC: 1 Blighted Nyss Shepherd - PC: 1 Blighted Nyss Shepherd - PC: 1 Spell Martyr - PC: 1 Blighted Nyss Swordsmen - Leader & 9 Grunts: 15 - Blighted Nyss Swordsmen Abbot & Champion - Abbot & Champion: 6
On paper, this gives Typhon 22" of non-linear threat on ranged attacks, or 18" of non-linear threat on melee. This ignores feat turn, because I know I'm going to have a hard time making that feat work for me.
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Whiskie
Junior Strategist
Posts: 288
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Post by Whiskie on Jun 13, 2017 2:35:42 GMT
Out of curiosity why the Swordsmen? Other than Typhon they're the only thing keeping you out of playing Oracles. What are you hoping that they'll achieve that Hex Hunters can't?
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thelat
Junior Strategist
Posts: 480
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Post by thelat on Jun 13, 2017 4:07:23 GMT
Out of curiosity why the Swordsmen? Other than Typhon they're the only thing keeping you out of playing Oracles. What are you hoping that they'll achieve that Hex Hunters can't? Battle Lust makes them a threat that can't be ignored. Between Cleave, Overtake, and dealing 7 damage on average to a Spriggan on a charge, they threaten a lot of things.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2017 0:52:53 GMT
can confirm battle lusted swordsmen are legit. i had 2 swordsmen take down a inverter from full.
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