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Post by Aegis on Apr 17, 2018 10:29:40 GMT
Yes, good change. Everything that helps his personal contribution is great for me.
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Post by cygnarstronk on Apr 17, 2018 13:26:41 GMT
Now we are talking about combat solo. In HM he can be 17 away from everything he shot at, boosting attacks as needed. He sounds also good a threatening far targets with boosted shots for spot removal. I personally am not crazy for spirit door, spell's cost is too high for me, but sounds decent.
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Post by geo67 on Apr 17, 2018 14:29:55 GMT
PPS_Soles: Nice, now shooting into deployment top of 1 zone is officially considered ok... I thought with Kraye and Heavy Metal with a Defender you could reach the enemy zone top of turn 1? Defender 7 + 2 + 5 + 16 = 30, or a hunter 7 + 2 + 6 + 6 + 14 = 35? Then Repo 3" back?
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Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on Apr 17, 2018 14:33:35 GMT
PPS_Soles: Nice, now shooting into deployment top of 1 zone is officially considered ok... I thought with Kraye and Heavy Metal with a Defender you could reach the enemy zone top of turn 1? Defender 7 + 2 + 5 + 16 = 30, or a hunter 7 + 2 + 6 + 6 + 14 = 35? Then Repo 3" back? Hunters have lost AD.
edit, 30" will still be 8" short of the opponents deployment zone
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Post by droopingpuppy on Apr 17, 2018 14:46:15 GMT
Do we need for a combat solo? I don't think so. Our guns are pretty good at scalpel out the exposed enemy key models already. Also even for some guns we have some solos with a gun or two already. So why we are bothered to use a 5 point solo that is also a weak spot of at least 8 points model and perhaps a node for an upkeep spell? I don't think that it is a good idea to expose them, as you keep your own caster at all cost.
I don't think that it is a good idea to expect combat solo role for a model with Battlegroup Controller. Well, you may throw away its warjack then throw him, and Focus Manipulation makes them fights better, but... at what cost?
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Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on Apr 17, 2018 15:00:59 GMT
Do we need for a combat solo? I don't think so. Our guns are pretty good at scalpel out the exposed enemy key models already. Also even for some guns we have some solos with a gun or two already. So why we are bothered to use a 5 point solo that is also a weak spot of at least 8 points model and perhaps a node for an upkeep spell? I don't think that it is a good idea to expose them, as you keep your own caster at all cost. I don't think that it is a good idea to expect combat solo role for a model with Battlegroup Controller. Well, you may throw away its warjack then throw him, and Focus Manipulation makes them fights better, but... at what cost? Sons already has very good combat solos it's true, but in Heavy Metal Caine has pretty much no competition, Harlan and Pendrake?
Snipe as a runeshot and repo3 will help Caine contribute while staying relatively safe, as well as supporting with FFE. Plus he can take Ace who is the king of spot removal, True Sight and Trick Shot are even more valuable now we cannot just fry stealth/high def models with lightning.
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Post by ForEver_Blight on Apr 17, 2018 15:24:58 GMT
Great... Just another model for Anyssa to chase down. 21 > 17
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Post by gobber on Apr 17, 2018 17:43:44 GMT
Great... Just another model for Anyssa to chase down. 21 > 17 FWIW I ran the numbers through buyorboost and camping 2 gives Caine0 an 82.1% chance to survive Annyssa with Prey; 75.3% if she manages to aim.
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Post by ForEver_Blight on Apr 17, 2018 18:13:52 GMT
Great... Just another model for Anyssa to chase down. 21 > 17 FWIW I ran the numbers through buyorboost and camping 2 gives Caine0 an 82.1% chance to survive Annyssa with Prey; 75.3% if she manages to aim. Caine0 OP. Please nerf. [/sarcasm]
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Post by cygnarstronk on Apr 17, 2018 23:38:19 GMT
I think that with snipe and repo he is pretty safe in HM. Also thinking about it he is probably getting 1 or 2 free focus for your caster, maybe even more with AOE attacks OR he is boosting solo/unboostable shots (GMCAs would love FFE hotswap, they start threatening casters). I think that between providing +2d6 damage each turn and being able of killing 2/4 enemy models each activation he looks solid. Still would have been a golden spot in gravediggers with either the blockhouse or juicy CRAs, or the express teams even. Storm division FFE on a storm gunner would have been funny too.
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Post by octaviusmaximus on Apr 18, 2018 7:53:08 GMT
Caine0 seems very bad to me. FFE is mediocre, output is mediocre, defences are mediocre, ability to run a jack is mediocre.
Cygnar remains a faction with 0 playable Caine's.
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Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on Apr 18, 2018 8:13:13 GMT
Caine0 seems very bad to me. FFE is mediocre, output is mediocre, defences are mediocre, ability to run a jack is mediocre. Cygnar remains a faction with 0 playable Caine's. you are never pleased with anything, so this latest assessment is of no surprise
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Post by Soul Samurai on Apr 18, 2018 8:45:46 GMT
ability to run a jack is mediocre How much does it cost to cast Spirit Door right now? Can he fully load a jack, send it in, then teleport it back to him, while still putting out two RNG 14 shots and repositioning back afterwards?
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Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on Apr 18, 2018 8:59:37 GMT
ability to run a jack is mediocre How much does it cost to cast Spirit Door right now? Can he fully load a jack, send it in, then teleport it back to him, while still putting out two RNG 14 shots and repositioning back afterwards? don't bother engaging, as I said above, Octavius thinks everything is terrible
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whydak
Junior Strategist
Posts: 288
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Post by whydak on Apr 18, 2018 9:07:48 GMT
How much does it cost to cast Spirit Door right now? Can he fully load a jack, send it in, then teleport it back to him, while still putting out two RNG 14 shots and repositioning back afterwards? don't bother engaging, as I said above, Octavius thinks everything is terrible Not true.Other factions stuff was considered quite OP in previous CIDs
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