Post by davycannonhound on Oct 4, 2017 22:10:15 GMT
Lately there's been a lot of discussion about our theme forces. Ravens got hit with a nerf as did Oracles, Children of the Dragon post-buff is still considered a bad theme by most (while I don't 100% agree, its structure makes absolutely zero sense). Primal Terrors mainly just suffers from a lack of models, which will remedy itself over time. So, I'm going to go over what I think the theme force is meant to work based off of the fluff description, and see if the current versions fit the bill. If not, I'll discuss themes.
Ravens of War
- When speed is of the essence and the servants of the dragon must strike with stealth, they rely upon the Ravens of War. A force of swift-moving striders and grotesques, these inhuman warriors can traverse any obstacle to deliver sudden death no matter where the enemy may hide. Able to respond quickly to unexpected dangers or to pursue a fleeing enemy, these highly mobile forces can be relied upon to move with such speed that the battle is decided before their prey realizes they are under attack.
So, based off of the fluff its pretty clear that this theme force is all about speed and agility. Lets look at what the theme force composition rules are:
Composition Rules:
Legion Warlocks
Non-character warbeasts with Flight
Non-character light warbeasts
Grotesque models/units
Strider models/units
Raptor models/units
Hellmouth units
Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion solos
Forsaken solos
Spell Martyr solos
Alright, makes sense. Most everything is speed 6 or over, with a couple of exceptions. The only thing that makes me scratch my head is the hellmouth. Since this force is meant to be fast, why would an immovable object be in it? If its meant to be that the hellmouth burrows under the ground way ahead of the army, then why would it stay immobile? Of course, thats not to bash the quality of the unit itself, it just doesn't fit the theme force. For now, I'll move onto benefits.
Benefits:
Benefits seem to be okay. As Striders and Grotesques are the main focus of the theme force, having the free points be based off of units makes sense. Enemy models losing Ambush makes sense as well. If this theme force is meant to be fast and catch the enemy by surprise, then having enemy models lose ambush makes perfect sense because the enemy wouldn't have had time to set up an ambush. Grotesque Raiders gaining ambush would also thematically makes sense. Again, catching the enemy by surprise.
So, how is this theme force? Well, out of the four theme forces Legion has, this one feels the most well constructed. All of its bonuses make sense, and mesh well with the composition rules. The only composition rule that I find out of place is the allowance of hellmouths. This wouldn't be so bad, if weren't overshadowed by the PREVIOUS version, which removed Advanced Deploy instead of Ambush, and did not include the hellmouth. In my mind, the enemy losing Advanced Deploy makes even more sense that them losing Ambush. After all, there could have been models elsewhere away from the main battle to deliver a hasty ambush. However models keeping advanced deploy has no merit as the theme force should move in before they have a chance to advance forward ahead of the rest of the army. The benefit of enemy models losing Ambush is not near as good as the benefit of models losing Advanced Deploy. Advanced Deploy models are far more common than Ambush models. In addition, most Ambush models have Advanced Deploy anyway. As such, I'd prefer the old version return. Thats... Really all there is to it. For more freedom in list construction, I would changed one of the benefit clauses to this:
This either/or benefit allows for more variety of list construction. Right now, the magic list construction is Max Raptors, Max Raiders, Blightblades. This allows for a perfect 40 pts. of units, and thus 2 free things. Banshees and Scouts are completely overlooked. Hellmouths do add some spice, however they're at such an awkward point cost (as are Banshees and Scouts) it hard to include them without either making room or losing a free card. The proposed change to the benefit clause allows for a more shooty go-to like Max Raptors, Max Banshees, Scouts. The hellmouth is still by its lonesome, however the other two models that actually make sense in the theme are more easily considered.
Children of the Dragon
- Reshaped by the dragon's power, the blighted Nyss serve as formidable fighters within Everblight's Legion. Utterly devoted to the Dragon, whole shards sometimes join battle together to enact their master's will. Such highly skilled and self-sufficient forces strike fast and hard with a combination of blade, claw, and bow. Supported by agile dragonspawn and powerful nephilim, these Nyss shards can strike anywhere the dragon directs them, moving unnoticed through enemy territory to secure objectives while outmaneuvering large armies.
So, like Ravens, this army is focused around speed, though in a slightly different sense. Nyss are fast and nimble, and similar dragonspawn can keep up with them. While the army may not catch the enemy by surprise, the army will be able to outmaneuver them on the battlefield. So, lets look at army composition rules.
Composition rules:
Legion Warlocks
Lesser warbeasts
Non - character Nephilim warbeasts
Azreal
Zuriel
Blighted Nyss models/units
Incubi Solos
Spell Martyr solos
Succubus Solos
Well, seems pretty straightforward. The selection of warbeasts certainly fit the bill of agile, though there is a curious lack of raeks, blightwasps, afflictors, and naga nightlurkers. Those warbeasts seem like they would be able to keep up with the Nyss just fine as well. Azreal and Zuriel, while welcome, don’t make a whole lot of sense beyond the fact that they’re Nephilim. Lets take a look at benefits.
Benefits:
Okay… Lets see here. “For every 25 points of Legion warbeasts in this army, you can add one Legion command attachment or one small based Legion solo to the army free of cost.” I thought this theme was about the Nyss shards? “Nephilim warbeasts in this army gain Unyielding.” Why? Isn’t this theme force about maneuverability? How does “toughing it out” make sense in light of that? Also, again, why a focus on warbeasts for a theme about the Nyss? “You gain +1 to your starting roll for the game.” Well, alright. That kinda makes sense. Its a little boring, but it works.
I’m just going to dive right into suggestions, both for composition rules and benefits. Here is my version, that fluff-wise makes more sense.
Composition rules:
Legion Warlocks
Lesser warbeasts
Non - character Nephilim warbeasts
Non - character light warbeasts
Warbeast packs
Blighted Nyss models/units
Incubi Solos
Spell Martyr solos
Succubus Solos
Benefits:
This version completely flips the theme on its head and turns it into movement shenanigans 101. Which, given the fluff, makes sense. This theme force is all about out-maneuvering your opponent’s army, not trying to somehow tough it out (unyielding). So, the +1 to the starting roll, while kinda thematic, was traded for reposition in the same style of Oracles’ mirage. Unyielding was traded for dodge - a much more apt ability for maneuverability, I think. My version loses Azreal and Zuriel, however it gains the naga night lurker, raek, teraph, and blight wasps. In addition, lesser warbeasts can now be a free piece, if you so desire.
I also wanted to address something I’ve seen flying around this theme force: the addition of the Blightbringer. Yes, it brings strong support for infantry, however its buffs don’t really pair well with the nyss. In addition, the Blightbringer is the exact opposite of maneuverability (the fluff focus of this theme force).
Oracle of Annihilation
- There is great power buried alongside the relics of the past, and the arcanists who serve the dragon are well versed in the history of the ancient world, receiving necessary knowledge directly from Everblight himself. These arcanists scour the ruins of lost civilizations, seeking to recover the useful artifacts from their sacred places to aid Everblight’s cause. When met with resistance, they combine fighting skill and specialized arcane knowledge to best their opponents, and the flesh and blood of fallen foes are quickly harvested and brought to the spawning vessels, there to lend further strength to Everblight’s legion.
So, this is our magic theme force. This theme force is meant to depict how Legion goes about finding useful artifacts and such, researches them, etc. etc.
NERDS!!!! (not really)
So, that in mind, lets take a look at the composition rules.
Composition rules:
Legion warlocks
Non-character warbeasts
Models/units with Magic Ability
Spawning Vessel units
Beast Mistress solos
Blighted Nyss Shepherd solos
Spell Martyr solos
Alright, works for me. No restrictions on warbeasts, and everything else has to use a form of magic. Makes sense so far, lets look at bonuses.
Benefits:
“For every 30 points of Legion warbeasts and Legion battle engines in this army, you can add one Legion command attachment or Legion solo to the army free of cost.” So, I’ve seen people pseudo-complain about this benefit. Their main complaint is the fact that the free points bonus isn’t logically built. However, I digress. The throne is clearly all magicy, so that fits. The warbeasts that people say don’t make sense have animi. What are animi? “Dormant, arcane spells.” Sounds like magic to me. So, free points benefit makes sense. The next benefit grants mirage. Well, mirage is a teleport. Teleports can be magic or tech based depending on the scenario, however mirage is obviously magic based for a number of reasons. Finally, you have things starting with upkeeps on them. Given how much magic is going around, that seems to work.
However, there’s a lack of benefit for spawning vessels. The reason I point this out is because of this statement: “and the flesh and blood of fallen foes are quickly harvested and brought to the spawning vessels, there to lend further strength to Everblight’s legion.” Given this statement, it seems like a benefit should be given to spawning vessels, right? Sure, there’s mirage, but thats not spawning vessel specific. Here’s a couple of ideas:
This benefit is based off of the adjective “quickly” in the fluff blurb. When I read that I imagined other models besides the grunts running around grabbing corpses. As such, thats where the extra range idea came in.
So, this benefit is more of a straight power grab. It still sorta fits if you go along with the thinking of other models besides the grunts helping grab corpses, however extra corpse tokens obviously doesn’t fit the “quickly” adjective.
This benefit is stolen from the primal terrors free hellmouth option. This is only because spawning vessels are specially mentioned in the fluff, nothing more.
Primal Terrors
- When the blighted ogrun tribes go to war, they do so with the blessings of Everblight by their side. Fighting with little regard for their personal safety, howling warbands descend upon their foes crazed by the prospect of spilling blood for their warchiefs and their korune, Thagrosh. Even mortal wounds suffered in battle do not deter them. Instead, such injuries goad them to drive deeper into the enemy’s heart to shed even more blood before they expire.
This is our ogrun theme, obviously. Nothing special mentioned here, just animalistic tactics and what not. Moving on.
Composition Rules:
Legion warlocks
Non-character warbeasts
Golab
Blighted Ogrun models/units
Blighted Rotwing units
Hellmouth units
Forsaken solos
Spell martyr solos
Okay, well, pretty good composition rules. Except… Half the roster isn’t even released. AND, some of that we don’t even know what they are yet!
Benefits
Free points for units. Given this is the ogrun theme, it makes sense. Free hellmouths are a bonus I didn’t expect, and frankly a good one. Warmongers gaining vengeance isn’t BAD per se, however it feels more like an attempt to buff a model than it is an actual theme bonus. It does fit with the fluff description to be sure, though if all ogrun units gained vengeance I certainly wouldn’t have known the difference. However, there is one thing I want to point out. Currently, this benefit clashes with the free points requirement a little bit. You see, there’s no “clean” unit combination that results in an even number of points like you can get in Ravens. The closest I’ve been able to come up with created a leftover 1 point. Not a huge deal to be sure, but really annoying when you want that extra spell martyr. This problem will hopefully (probably) be resolved with the release of the Chosen of Everblight, and whatever rotwings are supposed to be. Finally, there’s the deployment zone being extended by 2”. Certainly not a bad benefit at all, however I’m trying to understand the fluff for it. My best guess is, based off of the description of the ogrun being “crazed”, they’re essentially saying “MOVE FFS” resulting in them arriving on the battlefield five minutes earlier, letting them gain a couple of extra yards of ground. Other than that, its more than likely a compensation of how slow ogrun are and as a result the rest of the army will be.
Ravens of War
- When speed is of the essence and the servants of the dragon must strike with stealth, they rely upon the Ravens of War. A force of swift-moving striders and grotesques, these inhuman warriors can traverse any obstacle to deliver sudden death no matter where the enemy may hide. Able to respond quickly to unexpected dangers or to pursue a fleeing enemy, these highly mobile forces can be relied upon to move with such speed that the battle is decided before their prey realizes they are under attack.
So, based off of the fluff its pretty clear that this theme force is all about speed and agility. Lets look at what the theme force composition rules are:
Composition Rules:
Legion Warlocks
Non-character warbeasts with Flight
Non-character light warbeasts
Grotesque models/units
Strider models/units
Raptor models/units
Hellmouth units
Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion solos
Forsaken solos
Spell Martyr solos
Alright, makes sense. Most everything is speed 6 or over, with a couple of exceptions. The only thing that makes me scratch my head is the hellmouth. Since this force is meant to be fast, why would an immovable object be in it? If its meant to be that the hellmouth burrows under the ground way ahead of the army, then why would it stay immobile? Of course, thats not to bash the quality of the unit itself, it just doesn't fit the theme force. For now, I'll move onto benefits.
Benefits:
- This army can also include one Minion solo and one Minion unit that will work for Legion. These models can be included even if they have the Partisan [Legion] special rule. Minion units in this army can include attachments.
- For Every 20 points of Legion units in this army, you can add one Legion command attachment or small-based Legion solo to the army free of cost. Free models do not count toward the total point value of units in the army when calculating this bonus.
- Enemy models lose the Ambush special rule.
- One grotesque raider unit in this army gains Ambush. (You can choose not to deploy a unit with ambush at the start of the game. If it is not deployed normally, you can put it into play at the end of any of your Control Phases after your first turn. When you do, choose any table edge except the back of your opponent's deployment zone. Place all models in the unit with ambush in formation completely within 3" of the chosen table edge.)
Benefits seem to be okay. As Striders and Grotesques are the main focus of the theme force, having the free points be based off of units makes sense. Enemy models losing Ambush makes sense as well. If this theme force is meant to be fast and catch the enemy by surprise, then having enemy models lose ambush makes perfect sense because the enemy wouldn't have had time to set up an ambush. Grotesque Raiders gaining ambush would also thematically makes sense. Again, catching the enemy by surprise.
So, how is this theme force? Well, out of the four theme forces Legion has, this one feels the most well constructed. All of its bonuses make sense, and mesh well with the composition rules. The only composition rule that I find out of place is the allowance of hellmouths. This wouldn't be so bad, if weren't overshadowed by the PREVIOUS version, which removed Advanced Deploy instead of Ambush, and did not include the hellmouth. In my mind, the enemy losing Advanced Deploy makes even more sense that them losing Ambush. After all, there could have been models elsewhere away from the main battle to deliver a hasty ambush. However models keeping advanced deploy has no merit as the theme force should move in before they have a chance to advance forward ahead of the rest of the army. The benefit of enemy models losing Ambush is not near as good as the benefit of models losing Advanced Deploy. Advanced Deploy models are far more common than Ambush models. In addition, most Ambush models have Advanced Deploy anyway. As such, I'd prefer the old version return. Thats... Really all there is to it. For more freedom in list construction, I would changed one of the benefit clauses to this:
- One Grotesque Raider unit in this army gains Ambush. (You can choose not to deploy a unit with ambush at the start of the game. If it is not deployed normally, you can put it into play at the end of any of your Control Phases after your first turn. When you do, choose any table edge except the back of your opponent's deployment zone. Place all models in the unit with ambush in formation completely within 3" of the chosen table edge.) /OR/ One Grotesque Banshee unit in this army gains Advanced Deployment. (Models with advanced deployment are placed after your normal deployment and may be placed 6" further forward.)
This either/or benefit allows for more variety of list construction. Right now, the magic list construction is Max Raptors, Max Raiders, Blightblades. This allows for a perfect 40 pts. of units, and thus 2 free things. Banshees and Scouts are completely overlooked. Hellmouths do add some spice, however they're at such an awkward point cost (as are Banshees and Scouts) it hard to include them without either making room or losing a free card. The proposed change to the benefit clause allows for a more shooty go-to like Max Raptors, Max Banshees, Scouts. The hellmouth is still by its lonesome, however the other two models that actually make sense in the theme are more easily considered.
Children of the Dragon
- Reshaped by the dragon's power, the blighted Nyss serve as formidable fighters within Everblight's Legion. Utterly devoted to the Dragon, whole shards sometimes join battle together to enact their master's will. Such highly skilled and self-sufficient forces strike fast and hard with a combination of blade, claw, and bow. Supported by agile dragonspawn and powerful nephilim, these Nyss shards can strike anywhere the dragon directs them, moving unnoticed through enemy territory to secure objectives while outmaneuvering large armies.
So, like Ravens, this army is focused around speed, though in a slightly different sense. Nyss are fast and nimble, and similar dragonspawn can keep up with them. While the army may not catch the enemy by surprise, the army will be able to outmaneuver them on the battlefield. So, lets look at army composition rules.
Composition rules:
Legion Warlocks
Lesser warbeasts
Non - character Nephilim warbeasts
Azreal
Zuriel
Blighted Nyss models/units
Incubi Solos
Spell Martyr solos
Succubus Solos
Well, seems pretty straightforward. The selection of warbeasts certainly fit the bill of agile, though there is a curious lack of raeks, blightwasps, afflictors, and naga nightlurkers. Those warbeasts seem like they would be able to keep up with the Nyss just fine as well. Azreal and Zuriel, while welcome, don’t make a whole lot of sense beyond the fact that they’re Nephilim. Lets take a look at benefits.
Benefits:
- This army can also include one Minion solo and one Minion unit that will work for Legion. These models can be included even if they have the rule Partisan [Legion] special rule. Minion units in this army can included attachments.
- For every full 25 points of Legion warbeasts in this army, you can add one Legion command attachment or one small-based Legion solo to the army free of cost.
- Nephilim warbeasts in this army gain Unyielding. (While engaging an enemy model, a model with unyielding gains +2 ARM).
- You gain +1 to your starting roll for the game.
Okay… Lets see here. “For every 25 points of Legion warbeasts in this army, you can add one Legion command attachment or one small based Legion solo to the army free of cost.” I thought this theme was about the Nyss shards? “Nephilim warbeasts in this army gain Unyielding.” Why? Isn’t this theme force about maneuverability? How does “toughing it out” make sense in light of that? Also, again, why a focus on warbeasts for a theme about the Nyss? “You gain +1 to your starting roll for the game.” Well, alright. That kinda makes sense. Its a little boring, but it works.
I’m just going to dive right into suggestions, both for composition rules and benefits. Here is my version, that fluff-wise makes more sense.
Composition rules:
Legion Warlocks
Lesser warbeasts
Non - character Nephilim warbeasts
Non - character light warbeasts
Warbeast packs
Blighted Nyss models/units
Incubi Solos
Spell Martyr solos
Succubus Solos
Benefits:
- This army can also include one Minion solo and one Minion unit that will work for Legion. These models can be included even if they have the rule Partisan [Legion] special rule. Minion units in this army can included attachments.
- For every 20 points of Legion units in this army, you can add one small based legion solo, one command attachment, or one lesser warbeast free of cost. Free models do not count toward the total point value of units in the army when calculating this bonus.
- At the beginning of each of your Control Phases, choose one non-warlock Legion unit to gain Reposition [3”] that turn. (At the end of an activation in which it did not run or fail a charge, a model with reposition [3”] can advance up to 3”, then its activation ends.)
- Legion light warbeasts in this army gain Dodge.
This version completely flips the theme on its head and turns it into movement shenanigans 101. Which, given the fluff, makes sense. This theme force is all about out-maneuvering your opponent’s army, not trying to somehow tough it out (unyielding). So, the +1 to the starting roll, while kinda thematic, was traded for reposition in the same style of Oracles’ mirage. Unyielding was traded for dodge - a much more apt ability for maneuverability, I think. My version loses Azreal and Zuriel, however it gains the naga night lurker, raek, teraph, and blight wasps. In addition, lesser warbeasts can now be a free piece, if you so desire.
I also wanted to address something I’ve seen flying around this theme force: the addition of the Blightbringer. Yes, it brings strong support for infantry, however its buffs don’t really pair well with the nyss. In addition, the Blightbringer is the exact opposite of maneuverability (the fluff focus of this theme force).
Oracle of Annihilation
- There is great power buried alongside the relics of the past, and the arcanists who serve the dragon are well versed in the history of the ancient world, receiving necessary knowledge directly from Everblight himself. These arcanists scour the ruins of lost civilizations, seeking to recover the useful artifacts from their sacred places to aid Everblight’s cause. When met with resistance, they combine fighting skill and specialized arcane knowledge to best their opponents, and the flesh and blood of fallen foes are quickly harvested and brought to the spawning vessels, there to lend further strength to Everblight’s legion.
So, this is our magic theme force. This theme force is meant to depict how Legion goes about finding useful artifacts and such, researches them, etc. etc.
NERDS!!!! (not really)
So, that in mind, lets take a look at the composition rules.
Composition rules:
Legion warlocks
Non-character warbeasts
Models/units with Magic Ability
Spawning Vessel units
Beast Mistress solos
Blighted Nyss Shepherd solos
Spell Martyr solos
Alright, works for me. No restrictions on warbeasts, and everything else has to use a form of magic. Makes sense so far, lets look at bonuses.
Benefits:
- This army can also included one Minion solo and one Minion unit that will work for Legion. These models can be included even if they have the Partisan [Legion] special rule. Minion units in this army can included attachments.
- For every full 30 points of Legion warbeasts and Legion battle engines in this army, you can add one Legion command attachment or Legion solo to the army free of cost.
- At the beginning of each of your Control Phases, choose one non-warlock Legion unit to gain Apparition that turn. (During your Control phase, place models with Apparition anywhere completely within 2” of their current locations. Only models in formation can be place.)
- Friendly models/units can begin the game affected by the upkeep spells of models in this army. These spells and their targets must be declared before either player deploys any models. Models in this army do not have to pay to upkeep their spells during your first turn of the game.
“For every 30 points of Legion warbeasts and Legion battle engines in this army, you can add one Legion command attachment or Legion solo to the army free of cost.” So, I’ve seen people pseudo-complain about this benefit. Their main complaint is the fact that the free points bonus isn’t logically built. However, I digress. The throne is clearly all magicy, so that fits. The warbeasts that people say don’t make sense have animi. What are animi? “Dormant, arcane spells.” Sounds like magic to me. So, free points benefit makes sense. The next benefit grants mirage. Well, mirage is a teleport. Teleports can be magic or tech based depending on the scenario, however mirage is obviously magic based for a number of reasons. Finally, you have things starting with upkeeps on them. Given how much magic is going around, that seems to work.
However, there’s a lack of benefit for spawning vessels. The reason I point this out is because of this statement: “and the flesh and blood of fallen foes are quickly harvested and brought to the spawning vessels, there to lend further strength to Everblight’s legion.” Given this statement, it seems like a benefit should be given to spawning vessels, right? Sure, there’s mirage, but thats not spawning vessel specific. Here’s a couple of ideas:
- Spawning vessels in this army gain +3” on their recycle range.
This benefit is based off of the adjective “quickly” in the fluff blurb. When I read that I imagined other models besides the grunts running around grabbing corpses. As such, thats where the extra range idea came in.
- Spawning vessels in this army can hold an extra 3 corpse tokens.
So, this benefit is more of a straight power grab. It still sorta fits if you go along with the thinking of other models besides the grunts helping grab corpses, however extra corpse tokens obviously doesn’t fit the “quickly” adjective.
- For every full 30 points of Legion warbeasts and Legion battle engines in this army, you can add one Legion command attachment, Legion solo, or Spawning Vessel unit to the army free of cost.
This benefit is stolen from the primal terrors free hellmouth option. This is only because spawning vessels are specially mentioned in the fluff, nothing more.
Primal Terrors
- When the blighted ogrun tribes go to war, they do so with the blessings of Everblight by their side. Fighting with little regard for their personal safety, howling warbands descend upon their foes crazed by the prospect of spilling blood for their warchiefs and their korune, Thagrosh. Even mortal wounds suffered in battle do not deter them. Instead, such injuries goad them to drive deeper into the enemy’s heart to shed even more blood before they expire.
This is our ogrun theme, obviously. Nothing special mentioned here, just animalistic tactics and what not. Moving on.
Composition Rules:
Legion warlocks
Non-character warbeasts
Golab
Blighted Ogrun models/units
Blighted Rotwing units
Hellmouth units
Forsaken solos
Spell martyr solos
Okay, well, pretty good composition rules. Except… Half the roster isn’t even released. AND, some of that we don’t even know what they are yet!
Benefits
- This army can also included one Minion solo and one Minion unit that will work for Legion. These models can be included even if they have the Partisan [Legion] special rule. Minion units in this army can also include attachments.
- For every full 20 points of Legion units in this army, you can add one Hellmouth unit, one Blighted Ogrun command attachment, or one medium-based Blighted Ogrun solo to the army free of cost. Free models do not count toward the total point value of Blighted Ogrun models/units in the army when calculating this bonus.
- Blighted Ogrun Warmonger units in this army gain Vengeance. (During your Maintenance Phase, if one or more models in a unit with Vengeance were damage by enemy attacks during the last round, each model in the unit can advance up to 3” and make one basic melee attack).
- Your deployment zone is extended 2” forward.
Free points for units. Given this is the ogrun theme, it makes sense. Free hellmouths are a bonus I didn’t expect, and frankly a good one. Warmongers gaining vengeance isn’t BAD per se, however it feels more like an attempt to buff a model than it is an actual theme bonus. It does fit with the fluff description to be sure, though if all ogrun units gained vengeance I certainly wouldn’t have known the difference. However, there is one thing I want to point out. Currently, this benefit clashes with the free points requirement a little bit. You see, there’s no “clean” unit combination that results in an even number of points like you can get in Ravens. The closest I’ve been able to come up with created a leftover 1 point. Not a huge deal to be sure, but really annoying when you want that extra spell martyr. This problem will hopefully (probably) be resolved with the release of the Chosen of Everblight, and whatever rotwings are supposed to be. Finally, there’s the deployment zone being extended by 2”. Certainly not a bad benefit at all, however I’m trying to understand the fluff for it. My best guess is, based off of the description of the ogrun being “crazed”, they’re essentially saying “MOVE FFS” resulting in them arriving on the battlefield five minutes earlier, letting them gain a couple of extra yards of ground. Other than that, its more than likely a compensation of how slow ogrun are and as a result the rest of the army will be.