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Post by elricaltovilla on Sept 10, 2017 14:04:32 GMT
Their base ARM should be 16 and they lose shield wall order, but get Wall of Steel, the thing where when they are B2B they get plus 2 ARM. Isn't that rule +2 DEF now? Or is that a different rule? You're thinking of Defensive Line, +2 DEF and no knockdown. Trollkin Champions have it.
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Post by Soul Samurai on Sept 10, 2017 14:16:04 GMT
Oh, right. I thought it was the rule itself that changed as Sword Knights used to get +2 ARM but now they get +2 DEF.
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Post by pyr0maniacal on Sept 10, 2017 16:43:58 GMT
Honestly, when I think Kommando, I think they should have Pathfinder, Camouflage or Stealth and some kind of satchel charge, lol. But Assault Kommandos should at least have some kind of tech for overrunning fixed positions/trenches/emplacements. Flamethrowers are a good start. Grenades, shotguns, automatic weapons.
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Post by tjhairball on Sept 10, 2017 16:58:14 GMT
Mine too - wasn't it something like "all models will be usable in a theme force by the end of the year"? If my memory's right, that menas there isn't time to add lots of new AK models to the game. I suppose they could have a theme force which at present only has one unit, with the intention to add more later.
| Jaws of the Wolf | Winter Guard Kommand | Legion of Steel | Armored Korps | Wolves of Winter | Winter Guard |
| Yes |
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| Man-o-War |
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| Yes |
| Iron Fang |
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| Yes | | | Greylords |
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| Yes | Widowmakers | Yes | Yes |
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| | Doomreavers |
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| | | Yes | Kayazy | Yes |
| | | | Assault Kommandos |
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| | | Kossites | Yes | | | | | Manhunters | Yes | |
| | | Mercenaries |
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| | Yes | Maybe? | Greylord Forgeseer | Yes |
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| Yes | Yes | Behemoth | Yes |
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| Kovnik Malakov | Yes | Yes |
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| Kapitan Valachev |
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| Maybe? |
Every theme force: War Dog, Mechaniks It does look like Assault Kommandos have been left out. It does seem like an oversight - the only other possible oversight being Valachev if they don't allow mercenary units into Wolves of Winter. I think "PP forgot" seems like the most likely explanation, agree Jaws of the Wolf seems the single most likely "grab bag" for them to throw it into. If they got tacked into another theme without getting a keyword update, that would be pretty terrible. If we do have a sixth theme in the pipe, Widowmakers seem likely suspects to flesh it out, but that's still really not enough for a functional infantry component. Hard to figure on what else would go in there - maybe some character warjacks ala Heavy Armor Battalion in Mk II? Mercenaries? Weapons crews?
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Post by tapecrawler on Sept 10, 2017 22:30:34 GMT
It is likely they forgot about them because it seems to take a special snowflake to run them nowadays. So they are not used and quickly dismissed by competitive players. Most people just think they're garbage for the points. I know I think they are missing something essential in both fluff and gameplay. They are supposed to be Khador's answer to Trenchers and I think with the improvements and new theme that they couldn't stand toe to toe with Trenchers if their (nonexistent) theme granted them 50 extra points . . .
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crimsyn
Junior Strategist
Posts: 389
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Post by crimsyn on Sept 10, 2017 22:41:51 GMT
I liked them with Strakhov1, and was playing them until a few months ago when thememachine became a big deal. I found that what they had a good game against, they had a really good game against. I played a game into Doomy3 with them and he was really sad, and there are some matchups where their tools and immunities end up being amazing. Though, if they were thrown in with Jaws, I might not mind them and could be able to recreate my old Strakhov lists...
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wags
Junior Strategist
Posts: 102
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Post by wags on Sept 11, 2017 0:21:41 GMT
I can't imagine they forgot about them. Considering that "every theme by the end of sept and every model in a theme" was their big take away from lock n load, it would be such an amateur mistake to forget about models in your game. I think it's more likely they are rewriting another theme to fit them in which is why we haven't heard about the Aks. I can see them existing in jaws or wgk to give those themes an armored infantry option.
Not sure if a theme is enough to see them get play as they suffer from the generalist point tax. Too many rules drive their points up, but they don't really excel at damage or survivability and their special abilities are almost too niche. Though I really wouldn't mind them as a screening unit in jaws, little more robust than kayazy.
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Post by Cryptix on Sept 11, 2017 1:20:40 GMT
I still say they should get Pathfinder and Quickwork (and Gunfighter if they don't have it though I'm fairly certain they do) and the UA should give Hunter and have Mini-feat: Phantom Hunter
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Post by tapecrawler on Sept 11, 2017 3:07:25 GMT
What about an officer that grants snipe? That would be pretty cool and would almost make them able to trade shots with Trenchers. Trenchers still hold the advantage in range if they also have snipe. I started digging through both versions of War room and it was interesting to see how Trenchers and AK's have changed. AK cost twice what they did in MKII whereas Trenchers cost a third less comparatively. Both units cost 10/16 now (the same cost of a MOW Shocktrooper unit!) but AK's are still FA 2 while the Trenchers are FA U now. The most interesting thing to me that I hadn't noticed until today was that both AK's and Trenchers had RAT increase of 1 so both units are RAT 6 now. That I have to think about some more. (Don't get me started on my beloved Kossites, fierce warriors with a RAT of horse poo 4.) 😳
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kaos
Junior Strategist
Posts: 268
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Post by kaos on Sept 11, 2017 8:57:52 GMT
Their base ARM should be 16 and they lose shield wall order, but get Wall of Steel, the thing where when they are B2B they get plus 2 ARM. Isn't that rule +2 DEF now? Or is that a different rule? I think is +2 ARM when models are in base contact with heach other. So you can run and get the ARM bonus even without issuing orders.
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Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on Sept 11, 2017 9:29:14 GMT
I think they are in the same situation that Trencher Commandoes were in before the Gravediggers CID cycle:
1) They need a theme 2) They need a UA
They do have a very unique ability with their strangle gas grenades preventing healing on living models and even gargantuans, however they need a UA similar to the trencher commando one (repo 3, quick work and minifeat prey)
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Post by skathrex on Sept 11, 2017 12:10:45 GMT
It was my understanding that PP was going to include every model type in a theme force as part of the upcoming theme force reveal later this month. Mine too - wasn't it something like "all models will be usable in a theme force by the end of the year"? If my memory's right, that menas there isn't time to add lots of new AK models to the game. I suppose they could have a theme force which at present only has one unit, with the intention to add more later. Adding the MoW subtitle could work, but would be odd, as they clearly aren't MoW. Similarly Jaws, they don't quite fit - Jaws was meant to be irregulars clearing the way for jacks, but AKs are not irregulars. It could be rejigged as a more "black ops" theme, but that would be a bit of a change. Possibly giving a bond like ability to Strakhov 1 and/or 2, enabling a unit of AK to be taken whenever Strakhov is fielded? I could see that being a way around the issue and fits with Strakhov's role as their leader - there isn't really any other unit in Khador so closely associated with a single caster. None of this addresses their playability, but that's a different issue. I love that Idea of a Bond with Strakov1/2. Both can run them quite well. I like a lot of the other suggestions as well. The base Idea behind them should be excelling in WW1 Style Trench warfare. So I would like to maybe see the Gas aspect more. Could be a nice thing to have somehing like a corrosion mortar. That would help against Trenchers a lot. But there are a lot of small rules that would help them a lot.
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wendan
Junior Strategist
Posts: 785
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Post by wendan on Sept 11, 2017 12:19:20 GMT
On a 30 mm base!
Am I too late to make that joke?
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Post by leotherat on Sept 11, 2017 13:27:32 GMT
I'm afraid so.
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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Sept 11, 2017 13:42:43 GMT
I was gonna be harsher:
"ON A SHELF"
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