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Post by labyrinth on Sept 9, 2017 4:45:42 GMT
Has Madrak2 still got any legs? If so what lists do you guys recommend, got Ragnor meat mountain as my other pairing. I've heard of a swarm of kriels being pretty hard to handle.
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ravenfire
Junior Strategist
Me Mulg me SMASSSSSHHHH
Posts: 244
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Madrak2
Sept 9, 2017 6:55:54 GMT
via mobile
Post by ravenfire on Sept 9, 2017 6:55:54 GMT
Hi,
My current iteration is:
Madrak Ironhide, World Ender - WB: +28 - Troll Bouncer - PC: 9 (Battlegroup Points Used: 9) - Dire Troll Bomber - PC: 19 (Battlegroup Points Used: 19)
Fell Caller Hero - PC: 0
Trollkin Fennblades - Leader & 9 Grunts: 15 - Trollkin Fennblade Officer & Drummer - Officer & Drummer: 5 Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes - Leader & 3 Grunts: 6 - Stone Scribe Elder - PC: 3 Trollkin Fennblades - Leader & 9 Grunts: 15 Trollkin Warders - Leader & 2 Grunts: 10 Trollkin Warders - Leader & 2 Grunts: 10 Kriel Warriors - Leader & 9 Grunts: 11
THEME: Band of heroes
Played this list this week against menoth. With a exemplar theme:
He had 2x knights and 2x cavalry and some other stuff.
The fennblades are great against cavalry since they are hard and suffer no mpact attack damage. The warders are there to deliver the fenns (not relevant in that game) The kriels are bodies for madrak.
I am still thinking if I should replace 1 unit of warder or all with champs
When the cid becomes available in normal play I am going to try out the following list:
Trollbloods Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Storm of the North (CID)
!!! Your army contains CID entries. !!! You are using a pre-release theme.
(Madrak 2) Madrak Ironhide, World Ender [+28] - Dire Troll Mauler [15] - Earthborn Dire Troll [14] Fell Caller Hero [0(5)] Fell Caller Hero [0(5)] Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes (min) [6] - Northkin Elder [0(3)] Northkin Bear Handle & Battle Bears [10] Northkin Bear Handle & Battle Bears [10] Northkin Raiders (max) [15] Northkin Raiders (max) [15] Hearthgut Hooch Hauler [18]
Raiders can be pow 13 semi weapon master under madrak and with aid of the fellcaller and hhh the can be mat 9, sure to get a quick work off.
I think I will replace one unit of bears in favor of the lookouts. Not to be more accurate with the raiders, but just to have a full unit in the enemies backlines sniping out solos and support.
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Post by Trollock on Sept 9, 2017 8:01:35 GMT
In short: yes he is still good. What is your definition of "meat mountain"? i find that the definition has slipped away from "i play double warders + champs so that POW 10 shooting does nothing" since the end of MK2 and can now mean basically anything Madrak 2 seems REALLY scary in the new SotN theme force, but BoH will be good too. Once the changes from CID to long riders go live, they will be VERY good with him for example. Raiders are good too and so are the bears and basically any infantry. you need basically only a couple of infantry/cavalry units with melee capability (even kriel warriors are great) and a fell caller or two and you will have a good list. Spending lots of points on the battle group is probably sub optimal even if he HAS some great warbeast support. the FURY 5 is holding him back quite a bit. I honestly think that a list with like 60 50-60 points of beasts and 40-50 points of infantry would be good, but the way themes are built you probably want to have 60+ points of infantry.
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Post by labyrinth on Sept 9, 2017 8:18:21 GMT
Ah my mistake Trollock, Its PoD theme
Ragnor Mountain King, 2 x Bouncers, 1 x Axer, 2 x Earthborns. Runebearer. 2 x Whelps (For free and contesting purposes) Min Krielstone with Elder.
I just love Madrak2 and would love him in my pairing, even though I dont mind dropping Ragnor pretty much into anything and having a game. I cant wait for the Longrider CID changes, I think Madrak2 in Storm of the North will definitely be best - Though band of heroes would be good for the RFP and +2 Deployment zone.
Have you guys thought of Fire Eaters with him in that theme instead of the bears? They usually get alpha and turning them into WMs when needed seems pretty good. Also what about the CID runebearer? Worth bringing?
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Post by Trollock on Sept 9, 2017 10:56:24 GMT
Then Madrak seems great for you. go for it The Fire Eaters are great and all, but making them weaponmasters is fairly low impact. Making Kriel Warriors weaponmasters has a huge impact. Same for longriders etc.
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Post by Big Fat Troll on Sept 9, 2017 12:33:43 GMT
So does Blood Fury give an additional die to impact attacks too? How about slams from the Riders?
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Madrak2
Sept 9, 2017 13:11:20 GMT
via mobile
Post by macdaddy on Sept 9, 2017 13:11:20 GMT
So does Blood Fury give an additional die to impact attacks too? How about slams from the Riders? Yes because blood Fury is not a strength buff. Toughalow are Pow 14 WM on the mount and Melee attack with blood Fury. Anyone think a big champ block would be worth it after CiD? Champs under blood Fury and Stone Strength (or Northkin Buff) will be able to remove multiple heavies a turn. On the charge 2 champs under Northkin buff and Blood Fury do 30 damage to a Khador jack...seems legit.
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A-Mo
Junior Strategist
Posts: 204
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Post by A-Mo on Sept 12, 2017 15:38:48 GMT
Just played two game of the following Maddy2 list. It was laughably terrible.
Maddy2 - Mauler - Earthborn Min Stone + UA Max Fenns + UA Max Champs + Skaldi Max Kriel Warriors x2
First game vs. Ret into Kaylisa with x2 halbs, x2 crickets, x2 hydra's and some other crap. Can't charge anything, rough terrain templates dropped all over my front lines, Mauler got shot of the board with no chance of reprisal and Halbs are just way better fennblades for cheaper cost. This games sucked!
2nd game vs. Cygnar's CID Kraye with a bunch of jacks, mainly 2 Centurions and an Ironclad. Parking the Centurions in front of anything relevant, made it so I couldn't engage anything in a meaningful way. Basically just got whittled down untill I couldn't keep any prescens in "spread the net" and just forfeited.
Back to the drawing board on list designs
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Post by macdaddy on Sept 12, 2017 15:51:47 GMT
To be fair kraye is bonkers and Retribution is full of Bull That list would do great into Vyross 2 or most jack spam don't you think? Champs and fens would obliterate gryphons.
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A-Mo
Junior Strategist
Posts: 204
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Post by A-Mo on Sept 12, 2017 16:19:13 GMT
In theory, it seems like it should run well into most things. I don't know if it's been bad luck lately, but every time I throw a troll list on the table it feels like I'm facing down the perfect hard counter.
Madrak 2 troop swarm - No charges for you!!! Gunny Pod list - Trivally jam you out of scenario Doomy3 Beast brick? Have some spread the net, mortality and grievous wounds.
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Post by macdaddy on Sept 12, 2017 17:30:44 GMT
In theory, it seems like it should run well into most things. I don't know if it's been bad luck lately, but every time I throw a troll list on the table it feels like I'm facing down the perfect hard counter. Madrak 2 troop swarm - No charges for you!!! Gunny Pod list - Trivally jam you out of scenario Doomy3 Beast brick? Have some spread the net, mortality and grievous wounds. Believe it or not, my local troll player has had a lot of success using runeshapers to stay in scenario with gunny Yeah Poor Doomy 3. He basically has to run gargs to get the most out of his feat :/ I can attest to how brutal a list like that madrack 2 list can be It kicks my butt all the time
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Post by Big Fat Troll on Sept 12, 2017 18:52:07 GMT
In theory, it seems like it should run well into most things. I don't know if it's been bad luck lately, but every time I throw a troll list on the table it feels like I'm facing down the perfect hard counter. Madrak 2 troop swarm - No charges for you!!! Gunny Pod list - Trivally jam you out of scenario Doomy3 Beast brick? Have some spread the net, mortality and grievous wounds. I get that a lot.
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Madrak2
Sept 13, 2017 2:03:30 GMT
via mobile
Post by grabsnikk on Sept 13, 2017 2:03:30 GMT
In theory, it seems like it should run well into most things. I don't know if it's been bad luck lately, but every time I throw a troll list on the table it feels like I'm facing down the perfect hard counter. Madrak 2 troop swarm - No charges for you!!! Gunny Pod list - Trivally jam you out of scenario Doomy3 Beast brick? Have some spread the net, mortality and grievous wounds. I get that a lot. I second that. Every time I build a list it seems that whatever I drop it into is a hard counter. Because of this I have started focussing on assassination lists.
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Post by Trollock on Sept 13, 2017 9:10:03 GMT
You should use 2 list format even for casual play. OR you could see playing in to a bad match up as good training. when i practice with a list I always play it in to "what ever". then you quickly notice what is a bad match up for it. when you come to a tournament and manage to drop the right list, things will go easier. it is like running with a weight belt for practice.
every list will have "counters". Saying that a list is bad because it does not beat X and Y is not very relevant, because it may well mop the floor with A, B and C. Your job then is to build a list that handles X and Y to pair with your list. Sure, if it turns out that 90% of all lists are X and Y, you probably want to focus on something else, but Madrak 2 is solid for sure and has lots of playable match ups out there.
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Post by Trollock on Sept 13, 2017 12:29:47 GMT
Maddy2 - Mauler - Earthborn Min Stone + UA Max Fenns + UA Max Champs + Skaldi Max Kriel Warriors x2 At a glance you simply can not play such a list with no Fell Caller. I love the fact that you have all that mass of bodies, but the Fell Caller is simply mandatory to make your things work. MAT 6 Fennblades are bad against everything. MAT 8 ones are way better against infantry. Terrain is a thing even if you are not up against crickets. Pathfinder will be needed to get where you need to go. In short. some thing needs to go away for you to have the support your list needs to function. Playing this type of list with no fell caller feels like playing a PoD beast brick with no kriel stone.
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