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Post by welshhoppo on Sept 2, 2017 23:06:36 GMT
What about an AP attack that requires a 3" charge? If you convince pp to give Spriggans the Lance Special Rule I swear to god I'll beat you with Juggernauts in socks.
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Spriggans
Sept 2, 2017 23:32:02 GMT
via mobile
Post by jonnyboy on Sept 2, 2017 23:32:02 GMT
What about an AP attack that requires a 3" charge? If you convince pp to give Spriggans the Lance Special Rule I swear to god I'll beat you with Juggernauts in socks. Maybe not lance, but a star actions that stipulates a 3" charge is required. This would tone down some of the possibilities of a base pow 18 weapon with AP.
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Post by Havock on Sept 3, 2017 10:46:32 GMT
Just make it MAT7 with Brutal Charge if you want it to be lance-y.
AP 18 is not going to happen: Deleting heavies that trivially is bad.
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Spriggans
Sept 3, 2017 12:41:44 GMT
via mobile
Post by jonnyboy on Sept 3, 2017 12:41:44 GMT
Just make it MAT7 with Brutal Charge if you want it to be lance-y. AP 18 is not going to happen: Deleting heavies that trivially is bad. I with ya there, you also have to account for AP 21 with fury. They could potentially copy the angelius.
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Post by smoothcriminal on Sept 3, 2017 13:15:05 GMT
Angelius exists. Behemoth exists. There is nothing overpowered or out of ordinary about a special AP attack on an otherwise lacking jack for 19pts. I would rate AP attack on the same level as Tresher attack and plenty of premium heavies have those. In fact I'd take even a Tresher attack on Spriggan, though it wouldn't make much sense thematically. I dunno dude. A a program with AP under malakov1 and recline is 20. With s2 and boundless charge it would threaten a lot! And have a lot of potential damage! Juggy under Malakov on S2 feat turn can murder a heavy or two just as well. For 7pts less. Conquest or Behemoth can do ridiculous amounts of damage on S2 feat turn, but that doesn't seem to impress anyone in the meta. Just make it MAT7 with Brutal Charge if you want it to be lance-y. It will still be below Juggy in terms of offensive output.
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Post by Armchair Warrior on Sept 3, 2017 20:15:08 GMT
@havoc, I agree with smoothcriminal . Your proposal is uber meh on an 18 or 19 point heavy. The Angelius exists at 17 points and has routine access to Fury. Our faction is *supposed* to hit hard. It's what we do. If we're going to pay 18 points for a beat stick heavy it needs to be *more than* 1.5 times as effective as a Juggernaut. I say more than since... ... you're losing 34 boxes ... 2 initials and a free power up focus ... board control So, yeah, it's good but then the Spriggan has a *reason* to get put on the table. Let's look at the math. I'm making this easy and assuming auto hits against an ARM 20 opponent with boundless charge up som3 purchased attacks. Juggernaut charges. Boosted charge, fist, 3 more pow 19 attacks. 29.5 damage. Spriggan charges. Boosted star action charge. Loses 2nd initial. 3 more pow 18s. 33.5 damage. But you get a half of one more Juggernaut which, even without a charge, is 7 more damage, so 36.5 total. Really, it's good it at 18 points is not gonna change the meta.
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Post by BarbeChenue on Sept 3, 2017 22:53:16 GMT
The Spriggan is ridiculously expensive for a non-character 'jack. It makes me angry just to think about it (but then again, I'm easily angered).
I could go on a long, long rant about our many suboptimal warjacks (Drago, Beast 09, Decimator, Demolisher, Torch, etc.), but I'll just say this: if everyone is complaining we use the same warjacks all the time, there's a pretty damn good reason.
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Post by Havock on Sept 4, 2017 1:29:29 GMT
@havoc, I agree with smoothcriminal . Your proposal is uber meh on an 18 or 19 point heavy. The Angelius exists at 17 points and has routine access to Fury. Our faction is *supposed* to hit hard. It's what we do. If we're going to pay 18 points for a beat stick heavy it needs to be *more than* 1.5 times as effective as a Juggernaut. I say more than since... I don't intend for it to remain that expensive. Unless it gets Shield Guard or something for more swiss-knife-y-ness. It's kind of "what do you want the Spriggan to be?" It's always been the premium priced can-do 'jack. But that can change, imho, you have these two options: - Leave him roughly as is and drop him down to 15 points. - Leave his points roughly as is and make it worth it, and I'd rather make him weird than just another derpy beatstick (even with AP charge, do we need a 19 point Juggernaut?) Tack on Shield Guard, beat back on his shield, MAT7, brutal charge. If he is a 19 point jankmachine I'm fine with that, as long as that means you spend looking more at the back of his card than the front.
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