|
Post by smoothcriminal on Aug 18, 2017 23:08:49 GMT
Convergence nerf when?
|
|
isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
|
Post by isotope on Aug 18, 2017 23:11:16 GMT
Axis double TEP in theme is the most disgusting list to play into ever.
|
|
|
Post by skittles on Aug 18, 2017 23:24:32 GMT
Axis double TEP in theme is the most disgusting list to play into ever. Does that mean I can have my mk2 gaspy + Bile thralls back?
|
|
isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
|
Post by isotope on Aug 18, 2017 23:27:22 GMT
Axis double TEP in theme is the most disgusting list to play into ever. Does that mean I can have my mk2 gaspy + Bile thralls back? GTFO
|
|
|
Post by Big Fat Troll on Aug 19, 2017 1:39:24 GMT
Seriously? Dude, the tally is 14, 11, then 7, 7 and a nice slope downward that actually makes perfect sense, all things considered. That's 1st place with TWICE as many as 3rd place. They aren't just winning more, those are outliers, period. We can debate as to why, but not what.
Sure, maybe the Cryx and Cygnar players stateside are not as strong. That is at least theoretically possible. Or maybe different areas have differences in which factions are popular. If Meta A has twice as many Cygnar players as Meta B, then A will probably have more Cygnar wins, right? There are several possible explanations, but the data itself looks pretty clear.
|
|
|
Post by Aegis on Aug 19, 2017 2:18:37 GMT
On the UK and Norway side, I can confirm that Cygnar is abnormally popular since years.
Also, I doubt in the whole territory of the states there is not a single good Cygnar player (the idea itself is pretty offensive to all american cygnar players, that are quite a lot). At best, there could be a prevalence in the meta of lists that counter Cygnar, but not lack of good Cygnar players.
On the numbers, if Cygnar and Cryx were just one or two victories ahead it would be not statistically relevant at all. Being quite ahead of the third makes them "winning more" by a statistically relevant number, but still I wouldn't call winning a tournament every 5 "Dominating". They just win more often than other factions, a thing that can be analyzed and could imply being over the curve, but it doesn't strike me as a broken meta.
|
|
|
Post by jisidro on Aug 19, 2017 7:05:08 GMT
As expected?
|
|
Cyel
Junior Strategist
Posts: 685
|
Post by Cyel on Aug 19, 2017 15:57:33 GMT
Axis double TEP in theme is the most disgusting list to play into ever. Yeah, one of our players totally dominated a few last tournaments, including national championships with those lists. Apart from being a great player in his own right, those TEPs and Shield Guards feel quite unstoppable. I seriously can't think of a good match up with anything in my collection of PoM, even if I was trying to directly tailor against it. Compared to it, Denny's Ghost Fleet feels like a walk in the park and a normal game. tournykeeper.blob.core.windows.net/rosters/50a33db6-2fcb-4070-8bfa-e91821b4109b
|
|
|
Post by galiman on Aug 19, 2017 16:21:54 GMT
And not a single Minion representation 😢
|
|
isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
|
Post by isotope on Aug 20, 2017 4:13:04 GMT
Axis double TEP in theme is the most disgusting list to play into ever. Yeah, one of our players totally dominated a few last tournaments, including national championships with those lists. Apart from being a great player in his own right, those TEPs and Shield Guards feel quite unstoppable. I seriously can't think of a good match up with anything in my collection of PoM, even if I was trying to directly tailor against it. Compared to it, Denny's Ghost Fleet feels like a walk in the park and a normal game. tournykeeper.blob.core.windows.net/rosters/50a33db6-2fcb-4070-8bfa-e91821b4109bWith axis its just the combination of like everything thst makes it so crazy. Sac pawn shield guard counter charge plus his feat is crazy good. You cant drop guns into it he will shield guard it all, cant drop dudes into it he will spray them all dead, cant drop jacks into it he will feat on them and chew the up...
|
|
|
Post by ashurbanipal on Aug 20, 2017 11:29:23 GMT
Axis double TEP in theme is the most disgusting list to play into ever. Yeah, one of our players totally dominated a few last tournaments, including national championships with those lists. Apart from being a great player in his own right, those TEPs and Shield Guards feel quite unstoppable. I seriously can't think of a good match up with anything in my collection of PoM, even if I was trying to directly tailor against it. Compared to it, Denny's Ghost Fleet feels like a walk in the park and a normal game. tournykeeper.blob.core.windows.net/rosters/50a33db6-2fcb-4070-8bfa-e91821b4109bThe common High Reclaimer lists can play into it, as Hand of Fate-Idrians doing single shots on a preyed TEP will eat up your Shield Guards pretty fast, Cleansers are not interested in them anyway. If you played the match a couple of times you will learn how to position your troopers so that a single TEP Spray can get only 1-2, tough from the piper also helps. Cleansers and feated Knights Exemplar threat your TEPs all the time, Vengers are a problem also if the HR player knows what he's doing. Wall of thorns can't protect all angles. Idrians can try to take out some sac-pawn-servitors before the Cleansers start shooting. I did a lot of practice games with my Axis list against my local PoM player and since he realized these things he wins easily. Durst is also playable against Axis, not sure about Malekus. Axis Theme 2x TEP IS horribly strong for sure, but the fact that not many people know the matchup well contributes to the list's sucess aswell.
|
|
Arcaux
Junior Strategist
Posts: 724
|
Post by Arcaux on Aug 21, 2017 9:28:04 GMT
Exactly what I'm saying. Don't take just the tournament that support your opinion. Are Cygnar and Cryx winning more than others? Sure. Are they absolutely dominating every tournament? No (about 3 tournament on 5 are won by factions that aren't Cygnar or Cryx, with all factions but trolls getting some wins). A tournament result only tells up to a certain amount on info and "proves" nothing, on both sides, but if you want to use it for data, then use all data available not just the one that supports your thesis. Also, UK and Norway in particular are country that historically always had an huge Cygnar over-rappresentation, and that always hosted some of the best Cygnar players in the world (since MK2), so examinating data only from those countries isn't very telling. I Specifically said that I was looking at the 4 big tournaments that have been held in the UK since MK3 started, because that's where I play. If I was to go to a European event it would be Clogcon, because that's the big one so from my perspective Cygnar are winning literally everything.
Also where has this line about the UK having historical Cygnar over representation come from?
Lets look at the 2 years before hand to show that this is very much a Mk3 phenomenon:
UK Nationals 2014 Jamie Perkins (Khador) Blood and Oil 2014: Bret Wilkie (Circle) SmogCon 2015: Robin Maukish (Circle) Welsh Masters 2015: Matt Goligher (Legion) Uk Nationals 2015: Al Johnstone (Cygnar) Blood and Oil 2015: Ed Smith (Cryx) Smog Con 2016: Pat Dunsford (Cygnar) Welsh Masters 2016: Richard Beech (Khador)
Doesn't support your statement about the UK being very Cygnar Heavy in MK2.
That said, maybe they were going but not quite winning. Let's take a look at the English WTC Teams They would be a good representation of top players in the Uk right?
England WTC 2014: Cygnar 1/10 England WTC 2015: Cygnar 1/10 England WTC 2016: Cygnar 2/15
Not even 1 a team. If England had as many strong Cygnar players as you say then you'd expect at least one a team, right?
Just out of interest I ran the same thing for Sweden team:
Sweden WTC 2014: Cygnar 1/10 Sweden WTC 2015: Cygnar 0/10 Sweden WTC 2016: Cygnar 2/15
I'll admit I know almost nothing about their meta so there could be extenuating circumstances such as all the Cygnar players coming down with a mystery illness.
|
|
BlackOgrunBoardingParty
Guest
|
Post by BlackOgrunBoardingParty on Aug 21, 2017 13:10:02 GMT
First place on Discount games, on 2017 without Team Tournament :
Khador : 4 Cryx : 8 Cygnar : 10 Mercenaries : 1 Scyrah : 2 Circle : 4 Legion : 3 Cyriss : 1 Menoth : 1
We need more data, but Cygnar and Cryx are above The curve.
|
|
isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
|
Post by isotope on Aug 21, 2017 13:21:16 GMT
First place on Discount games, on 2017 without Team Tournament : Khador : 4 Cryx : 8 Cygnar : 10 Mercenaries : 1 Scyrah : 2 Circle : 4 Legion : 3 Cyriss : 1 Menoth : 1 We need more data, but Cygnar and Cryx are above The curve. But without stats like what % of the field of all those tournaments was represented by cygnar and cryx none of that matters. That doesn't even put in the stat you cant account for and thats the player skill. It's never going to be easy to prove a faction is too strong from any stats.
|
|
|
Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on Aug 21, 2017 13:30:52 GMT
America has always been behind the curve compared to the UK and Europe when it comes to competitive play, especially with regards to Cygnar. Lets see if they do any better at the WTC this year, or whether they are always going to be 6 months behind us.
#shotsfired
|
|