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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Jul 7, 2017 23:32:42 GMT
The Mad dog should be a trampeling maniac. It should run down models, and demand attention. Honestly if people REALLY don't want the Mad Dog being a melee threat, it could be repurposed to have Thrashing Blades or something. That way its better trampler but inept in melee.
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Post by gobber on Jul 8, 2017 4:52:32 GMT
Wait why are we giving free slam power attacks to a Jack that doesn't make slam power attacks? Combo smites are different; it'd still get the extra two inches but Marauders want to charge otherwise they lose out on aiming and a lot of damage potential (like 8 pow *and* 1 to 2 extra dice). Slam Power Attack=/=slammed; this one isn't fully thought out. Pretty sure Grand Slam would still give the +2" of slam, so... Right, I mentioned that. Still needlessly confusing for new players. If the marauder has to go up a point due to its defensive stats after the removal of siege weapon, I might suggest giving it heavy boiler instead. The +2 run distance would help it get in front of its fellow heavies and act as the sacrificial first wave. I'd value that way more than the funky +2 slam.
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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Jul 8, 2017 6:48:07 GMT
Tge maurader has nothing fluffeise about being s first wave sacrifice or having a heavy boiler like a kodiak.
At least grand slam or a similar type rule have relations to what the maurader actually is.
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Post by Swampmist on Jul 8, 2017 6:55:46 GMT
Grand slam would do 2 major things for the Marauder; 1.) Increase the potency of it's slam, which is already aim-able, by making it longer. this means that it can slam stuff with much more consistency, allowing for more options on the table 2.) It would allow a Marauder without a cortex to still do it's job by slamming for free, though it will still be less effective with the lack of aiming.
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Post by welshhoppo on Jul 8, 2017 10:22:19 GMT
How about for the zerkers.
*Cortex overload.*
-This model can spend cortex boxes as if they were focus. If you use this ability to remove the last cortex box, place a 5 inch aoe on this model. All models underneath suffer a pow14 blast damage hit.
Then remove this model from play.
Any good?
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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Jul 8, 2017 10:37:32 GMT
It's also good. I like it. It would make Overload more of a advantage than a disadvantage, so it could be priced at a higher price point reducing "Zerker" spam. It gives them more of a niche for casters who don't have the focus to spend as much.
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Post by octaviusmaximus on Jul 8, 2017 12:14:32 GMT
How about for the zerkers. *Cortex overload.* -This model can spend cortex boxes as if they were focus. If you use this ability to remove the last cortex box, place a 5 inch aoe on this model. All models underneath suffer a pow14 blast damage hit. Then remove this model from play. Any good? That does mean that a buffed berseker can make a *lot* of attacks. Not sure, might be too much.
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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Jul 8, 2017 12:46:27 GMT
How about for the zerkers. *Cortex overload.* -This model can spend cortex boxes as if they were focus. If you use this ability to remove the last cortex box, place a 5 inch aoe on this model. All models underneath suffer a pow14 blast damage hit. Then remove this model from play. Any good? That does mean that a buffed berseker can make a *lot* of attacks. Not sure, might be too much. Maybe limit it to the maintenance phase? During the maintenance phase it can burn cortex to get focus up to max?
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Post by welshhoppo on Jul 8, 2017 13:11:26 GMT
That sounds better to be honest.
But then obviously replace the explosion so it happens at the end of the turn.
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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Jul 8, 2017 14:05:29 GMT
That sounds better to be honest. But then obviously replace the explosion so it happens at the end of the turn. Its a good combo but then Jack Spam is replaced by super high quality and ultra deadly jack spam. Even if a berserker costs 14 points with that ability, under Vlad1 it's a free charge, and then 5 Pow 18-ish attacks by a singular one....But honestly, that doesn't sound that awful. Even spammed your getting 6 very fragile jacks at best. Honestly it could be balanced by "If the cortex is destroyed Period, the jack explodes". That way it has serious achilees heels.
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Post by welshhoppo on Jul 8, 2017 14:31:38 GMT
Probably too serious, 11 boxes til death is just bad.
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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Jul 8, 2017 14:43:14 GMT
Probably too serious, 11 boxes til death is just bad. You're probably right. I forgot it only had 2 cortex boxes. The question is what do the other cortexes gain instead of focus. The Rager doesn't Particularly care and neither does the mad dog. Maybe the Mad Dog gets +2 Speed for every cortex box destroyed? But how to structure that around the Rager? To represent deep devotion to the caster.
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Post by welshhoppo on Jul 8, 2017 15:36:26 GMT
Rager. - Hyper Protective. - Each time this models cortex is damaged by an enemy attack, it can make a full advance towards its battle group commander.
Mad Dog - Rabid. This model gains +1 strength against small based models for each damaged cortex box.
Then adjust points and stuff.
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Post by jonnyboy on Jul 11, 2017 0:29:45 GMT
I wasn't defending the Marauder so much as I was passive-aggressively expressing my extreme displeasure at this constant haggling over points coming from someone whose normal line of thought is that players should try to get better first and foremost. Especially when, when it comes to Cygnar, the argumentations seemingly are the reverse of those made against the Marauder. You're right. That was really passive aggressive. You seem to be taking this more personally than I am. It's taken me awhile to read through this thread, and im nearly there. But this post seems really flawed. I also might not he the best to argue this point, but... It's already been mentioned that a good amount of khador warcasters make up for a huge issue with khador warjacks, speed. It's been argued that the low speed is a big factor in khador jacks stat lines. Then it's been said that this is not fair because of casters abilities to mitigate their downside through spells, increasing their speed. Further arguing that this is overbearingly apparent on low cost models such as the marauder, and that they need to be changed/nerfed. When we bring up the freebooter and the mention of merc casters, the same argument could easily apply here. Freebooter - 9 pts spd/def/armor/boxes - 5/12/17/32 Marauder - 10 pts Spd/def/armor/boxes - 4/10/20/34 It sounds like there was an agreement that they do similar damage, both have strong damage potential and knockdown. Freebooter also has a huge speed advantage, jury rig and base speed! A big gripe are khador warcasters and their speeds buffs, but what about Bartolo Montador vs harkevich (he's been brought up a lot in this thread). Lets compare the jacks with a warcaster (again this is a complaint for why khador warjacks are not evenly priced) Freebooter - 9 pts - batten down the hatches spd/def/armor/boxes - 5(7)/10/20/32 Marauder - 10 pts - mobility Spd/def/armor/boxes - 6/10/20/34 Their stat lines look oddly similar now, favoring the freebooter, who is cheaper! What is the bias here? It seems that if anything the freebooter is s bit better than the marauder, cheaper, faster, can be just as tough, hits just as hard. Do warcasters come into play when we compare warjacks or not? As a final note, i don't know where i fully stand on the marauder. I might write up some change ideas to him later (and the juggernaut and berserker, as i think they are more interlocked than some believe). But i don't think a 1 point increase would be doom, albeit no other changes. Just my 2 cents, stay friendly!
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Post by Blargaliscious on Jul 11, 2017 2:57:49 GMT
You had to go and poke the bear, didn't you?
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