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Post by Cryptix on May 17, 2017 0:04:55 GMT
I keep hearing this Caine 1 is a bad caster. So not true. Especially with SR17 and all these dude spam list themes. Walk up, kill 30 dudes, tp back, ace gives stealth. Then you got a 13-15" d6 slam depending on which attachment you bring and some pretty good upkeeps. I can do the same, more reliably, with other pieces such as Storm Lances. They are also less vulnerable to getting killed and losing you the game. Also, no player worth their salt is going to throw 30 non stealth infantry models at Caine 1 without a plan. His spells are ok, but are done better elsewhere in faction. So your argument that because you have another unit in faction who's job is to kill infantry in a faction that specializes in killing infantry, it sucks? Wow, no wonder all the Cygnar players in my circle suck.
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isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
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Post by isotope on May 17, 2017 0:08:53 GMT
I can do the same, more reliably, with other pieces such as Storm Lances. They are also less vulnerable to getting killed and losing you the game. Also, no player worth their salt is going to throw 30 non stealth infantry models at Caine 1 without a plan. His spells are ok, but are done better elsewhere in faction. So your argument that because you have another unit in faction who's job is to kill infantry in a faction that specializes in killing infantry, it sucks? Wow, no wonder all the Cygnar players in my circle suck. If you were capable of putting a coherent sentence together maybe I'd have the opportunity to respond. As to octavius... caine1 will be a beast in scenario in SR17.
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Post by Cryptix on May 17, 2017 0:19:49 GMT
So your argument that because you have another unit in faction who's job is to kill infantry in a faction that specializes in killing infantry, it sucks? Wow, no wonder all the Cygnar players in my circle suck. If you were capable of putting a coherent sentence together maybe I'd have the opportunity to respond. ...What? I'm supporting you. They say that Caine sucks because he can only kill infantry good and Stormlances do that anyway when literally one of the defining traits of your weapons is Electro-Leap and one of your most powerful casters makes electroleaps even better at killing things.
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Post by octaviusmaximus on May 17, 2017 1:03:32 GMT
So your argument that because you have another unit in faction who's job is to kill infantry in a faction that specializes in killing infantry, it sucks? Wow, no wonder all the Cygnar players in my circle suck. If you were capable of putting a coherent sentence together maybe I'd have the opportunity to respond. As to octavius... caine1 will be a beast in scenario in SR17. Not really, winning on scenario us hard. If you think a magical slam will win you scenario then may I point you to Haley 2 (dominate and tk), nemo 3 (force hammer) or siege (force hammer). I've played Caine 1 a few times, he's always disappointing because his tricks are easy to neuter and can be replicated elsewhere in faction on more reliable pieces. Caine 1 is bad, Sr 2017 isn't going to change that
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isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
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Post by isotope on May 17, 2017 1:03:33 GMT
If you were capable of putting a coherent sentence together maybe I'd have the opportunity to respond. ...What? I'm supporting you. They say that Caine sucks because he can only kill infantry good and Stormlances do that anyway when literally one of the defining traits of your weapons is Electro-Leap and one of your most powerful casters makes electroleaps even better at killing things. I couldnt tell what you were saying. It was a sloppy sentence. Also, theres no rule saying you cant take storm lances with caine1. Clear out 1-2 waves of infantry with eleaps then waot til turn 4-5 to feat( which is big enough to clear out an entire zone, slam a jack out pf the zone, then tp b2b with a flag and youre good to go.
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Post by octaviusmaximus on May 17, 2017 1:05:30 GMT
...What? I'm supporting you. They say that Caine sucks because he can only kill infantry good and Stormlances do that anyway when literally one of the defining traits of your weapons is Electro-Leap and one of your most powerful casters makes electroleaps even better at killing things. I couldnt tell what you were saying. It was a sloppy sentence. Also, theres no rule saying you cant take storm lances with caine1. Clear out 1-2 waves of infantry with eleaps then waot til turn 4-5 to feat( which is big enough to clear out an entire zone, slam a jack out pf the zone, then tp b2b with a flag and youre good to go. Kill all the infantry with storm lances, Caine 1 no longer has a feat, goes onto a flag and then dies anyway because 17/13 is bad
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isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
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Post by isotope on May 17, 2017 1:07:03 GMT
If you were capable of putting a coherent sentence together maybe I'd have the opportunity to respond. As to octavius... caine1 will be a beast in scenario in SR17. Not really, winning on scenario us hard. If you think a magical slam will win you scenario then may I point you to Haley 2 (dominate and tk), nemo 3 (force hammer) or siege (force hammer). I've played Caine 1 a few times, he's always disappointing because his tricks are easy to neuter and can be replicated elsewhere in faction on more reliable pieces. Caine 1 is bad, Sr 2017 isn't going to change that you are entitled to think that. But i disagree. Round zones that are perfectly sized for his feat only scorable by warrior models and the prevelance pf ghost fleat, etc... i guess onky time will tell.
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isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
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Post by isotope on May 17, 2017 1:09:00 GMT
I couldnt tell what you were saying. It was a sloppy sentence. Also, theres no rule saying you cant take storm lances with caine1. Clear out 1-2 waves of infantry with eleaps then waot til turn 4-5 to feat( which is big enough to clear out an entire zone, slam a jack out pf the zone, then tp b2b with a flag and youre good to go. Kill all the infantry with storm lances, Caine 1 no longer has a feat, goes onto a flag and then dies anyway because 17/13 is bad Sigh... youre gonna make me get back into cygnar to prove you wrong arent you. Gonna have to wait for the trencher book for that my friend. Need my ww1 themed paint scheme to fit.
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Post by octaviusmaximus on May 17, 2017 1:12:38 GMT
Not really, winning on scenario us hard. If you think a magical slam will win you scenario then may I point you to Haley 2 (dominate and tk), nemo 3 (force hammer) or siege (force hammer). I've played Caine 1 a few times, he's always disappointing because his tricks are easy to neuter and can be replicated elsewhere in faction on more reliable pieces. Caine 1 is bad, Sr 2017 isn't going to change that you are entitled to think that. But i disagree. Round zones that are perfectly sized for his feat only scorable by warrior models and the prevelance pf ghost fleat, etc... i guess onky time will tell. Round zones are already perfectly sized for his feat. He can't risk moving up to them in most cases because he's too fragile. You have moved beyond the specific into platitudes because you have no concrete argument. Anything Caine can do can be replicated elsewhere in faction better. Caine 1 is bad, his tools are mediocre and his game plan is overly reliant on an enemy who doesn't threaten you back in any way. If your opponent brings a low threat, low defenses melee army then yeah, Caine might feel good. That doesn't mean he's the best for the job, play Kraye vs that same terrible army and watch rage quits happen as you will never Be in reprisal range. Put any of your good casters into that list and crush them while barely taking losses because storm lances,Storm strider, chargers and fireflies rip those sorts of armies apart as a matter for course.
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isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
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Post by isotope on May 17, 2017 1:25:22 GMT
you are entitled to think that. But i disagree. Round zones that are perfectly sized for his feat only scorable by warrior models and the prevelance pf ghost fleat, etc... i guess onky time will tell. Round zones are already perfectly sized for his feat. He can't risk moving up to them in most cases because he's too fragile. You have moved beyond the specific into platitudes because you have no concrete argument. Anything Caine can do can be replicated elsewhere in faction better. Caine 1 is bad, his tools are mediocre and his game plan is overly reliant on an enemy who doesn't threaten you back in any way. If your opponent brings a low threat, low defenses melee army then yeah, Caine might feel good. That doesn't mean he's the best for the job, play Kraye vs that same terrible army and watch rage quits happen as you will never Be in reprisal range. Put any of your good casters into that list and crush them while barely taking losses because storm lances,Storm strider, chargers and fireflies rip those sorts of armies apart as a matter for course. All hail the king of cygnar. The all knowing, all wise octavius. Any who speak against his ways shall be struck down!
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Post by octaviusmaximus on May 17, 2017 1:28:43 GMT
Round zones are already perfectly sized for his feat. He can't risk moving up to them in most cases because he's too fragile. You have moved beyond the specific into platitudes because you have no concrete argument. Anything Caine can do can be replicated elsewhere in faction better. Caine 1 is bad, his tools are mediocre and his game plan is overly reliant on an enemy who doesn't threaten you back in any way. If your opponent brings a low threat, low defenses melee army then yeah, Caine might feel good. That doesn't mean he's the best for the job, play Kraye vs that same terrible army and watch rage quits happen as you will never Be in reprisal range. Put any of your good casters into that list and crush them while barely taking losses because storm lances,Storm strider, chargers and fireflies rip those sorts of armies apart as a matter for course. All hail the king of cygnar. The all knowing, all wise octavius. Any who speak against his ways shall be struck down! More platitudes. So far your strategies have been easily replicable outside of Caine 1 while being better. Either come up with a good argument for why Caine 1 can *uniquely* destroy infantry and *uniquely* remove heavies from a zone which isn't riddled with holes or admit that you are wrong.
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isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
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Post by isotope on May 17, 2017 1:30:49 GMT
All hail the king of cygnar. The all knowing, all wise octavius. Any who speak against his ways shall be struck down! More platitudes. So far your strategies have been easily replicable outside of Caine 1 while being better. Either come up with a good argument for why Caine 1 can *uniquely* destroy infantry and *uniquely* remove heavies from a zone which isn't riddled with holes or admit that you are wrong. All hail the king of cygnar. The all knowing, all wise octavius. Any who speak against his ways shall be struck down!
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Post by Cryptix on May 17, 2017 1:34:39 GMT
Take the pissyfight to PMs. Or rather, just drop it. This thread is about H2, not who's the better Cygnar player.
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Post by octaviusmaximus on May 17, 2017 1:34:49 GMT
More platitudes. So far your strategies have been easily replicable outside of Caine 1 while being better. Either come up with a good argument for why Caine 1 can *uniquely* destroy infantry and *uniquely* remove heavies from a zone which isn't riddled with holes or admit that you are wrong. All hail the king of cygnar. The all knowing, all wise octavius. Any who speak against his ways shall be struck down! Reported for spamming.
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Post by Rowdy Dragon on May 17, 2017 1:35:33 GMT
OK I have my Tiffs with Octavius but he's clearly at least listing logic.
He is abrupt about his points, but he's making points. Hes stating what he believes but thats ALL that it can be. Does he have to say "I think" before he says anything?
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