Arcaux
Junior Strategist
Posts: 724 
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Post by Arcaux on Feb 21, 2018 14:46:49 GMT
Sorry if this is obvious to everyone, but I've started considering the skinner in my Madrak1 build.
Firstly my Madrak1 is mostly intended to be an anti hordes list. I specifically struggle with Grymkin, but over in the UK we're also seeing huge numbers of Circle and Minions as well.
With skinner has the following benefits specifically in the Grymkin matchup: - Hard to hit: Base DEF 13, 15 in Forests, 17 vs Beasts, 19 vs Beasts in forests, Madrak can push all these numbers up by 2 when in 12 of him (Which admittedly isn't always the case. - Prowl: means it's hard for their caster to kill, this can be countered by a Frightmare, but lists with a frightmare are generally the ones I'm less scared of. Remember they can't have Wraithbane and See in the Dark up at the same time, so your def is at least 15. - Ambush: this is very much scenario specific, but often my Madrak list has nothing to throw away early on in Spread the net, Recon2 and Stand off. Skinner can do and it isn't guaranteed they can remove him straight away. - Very good vs low armoured warbeasts. There are an abundance of things he can seriously damage nowadays from Rattlers, Frightmares, Gorehounds to Crabbit. He gets the job done and even if he doesn't he's unlikely to die to one with the retaliation.
So that's the theory. Anyone tried him out? did it work? |
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Post by Trollock on Feb 21, 2018 14:49:15 GMT
Duck works against ranged attacks too  |
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Post by macdaddy on Feb 21, 2018 16:21:36 GMT
Ill try to convince the Local troll player to run him with madrack 1 in our next game. Def 19 is legit for sure and he is Pow 10 double weapon master on the charge under stone right? He should probably eat legion and circle beasts.
The issue I would say for grymkin, is the glimmer imp + dreamer Manifest destiny may make your tech sad.
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Arcaux
Junior Strategist
Posts: 724
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Post by Arcaux on Feb 21, 2018 17:55:34 GMT
Ill try to convince the Local troll player to run him with madrack 1 in our next game. Def 19 is legit for sure and he is Pow 10 double weapon master on the charge under stone right? He should probably eat legion and circle beasts. The issue I would say for grymkin, is the glimmer imp + dreamer Manifest destiny may make your tech sad. I saw Glimmer Imps with King of Nothing this past weekend but not usually, I obviously understand that with their access to ADR it's possible they could switch them in. Even with Manifest Destiny Boosted 14's is hard work |
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Post by macdaddy on Feb 21, 2018 19:53:00 GMT
Arcaux that's fair. I just have a bad experience with relying on def to survive. My opponents always seem to get around it somehow. Would you ever run 2 skinners? Or just a single one?
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Post by grabsnikk on Feb 21, 2018 19:54:08 GMT
If you are building Madrak1 for Hordes then he could be a very interesting option, Def19 vs beasts should be lretty strong. The only problem with him in BOH that I can see is that he takes the spot of a free solo, which is usually better spent on either a Runebearer, Skaldi, Fell Caller or a Chronicler. Still worth testing though and it would be nice to see a list where he could work well.
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Arcaux
Junior Strategist
Posts: 724
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Post by Arcaux on Feb 21, 2018 21:22:03 GMT
If you are building Madrak1 for Hordes then he could be a very interesting option, Def19 vs beasts should be lretty strong. The only problem with him in BOH that I can see is that he takes the spot of a free solo, which is usually better spent on either a Runebearer, Skaldi, Fell Caller or a Chronicler. Still worth testing though and it would be nice to see a list where he could work well. He'd get the 3rd spot after runebearer and Fell caller who are mandatory. SSC has been underperforming and Skaldi is never worth the points even in SotN. |
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Post by grabsnikk on Feb 21, 2018 23:26:08 GMT
If you are building Madrak1 for Hordes then he could be a very interesting option, Def19 vs beasts should be lretty strong. The only problem with him in BOH that I can see is that he takes the spot of a free solo, which is usually better spent on either a Runebearer, Skaldi, Fell Caller or a Chronicler. Still worth testing though and it would be nice to see a list where he could work well. He'd get the 3rd spot after runebearer and Fell caller who are mandatory. SSC has been underperforming and Skaldi is never worth the points even in SotN. Okay that makes sense although I am curious about why you think Skaldi is not worth it? |
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Arcaux
Junior Strategist
Posts: 724
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Post by Arcaux on Feb 21, 2018 23:37:10 GMT
He'd get the 3rd spot after runebearer and Fell caller who are mandatory. SSC has been underperforming and Skaldi is never worth the points even in SotN. Okay that makes sense although I am curious about why you think Skaldi is not worth it? you're paying 5 points for the same offensive output as 1 champion, but you lose both attacks if you miss your first and 3 extra boxes. relentless charge is nice but not worth 5 points and overtake is barely ever worthwhile on 1 inch melee. |
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Post by grabsnikk on Feb 21, 2018 23:53:36 GMT
Okay that makes sense although I am curious about why you think Skaldi is not worth it? you're paying 5 points for the same offensive output as 1 champion, but you lose both attacks if you miss your first and 3 extra boxes. relentless charge is nice but not worth 5 points and overtake is barely ever worthwhile on 1 inch melee. Ok I can get behind that reasoning. |
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Post by Big Fat Troll on Feb 22, 2018 1:42:44 GMT
Grymkin are so weird that they have us playing the Skinner.
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bullwai
Baby's First Wargame
Posts: 1
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Post by bullwai on Feb 22, 2018 16:09:48 GMT
Skinner is not bad with Calandra.
+2 def, dodge and starcrossed are great with him.
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Post by macdaddy on Feb 22, 2018 16:22:17 GMT
Okay that makes sense although I am curious about why you think Skaldi is not worth it? you're paying 5 points for the same offensive output as 1 champion, but you lose both attacks if you miss your first and 3 extra boxes. relentless charge is nice but not worth 5 points and overtake is barely ever worthwhile on 1 inch melee. 5 points for extra sanguine bond damage, relentless charge, and immunity cold for the entire unit. Also +1 mat. Overtake is also useful for getting back into B2B if you need to kill heavy infantry or light beasts. Also, its really not 5 points for the special rules. Each champ costs 3.2 points in a max unit. o really your are only paying 1.8 points for relentless charge, 3 extra boxes, overtake, and immunity cold. Relentless charge also means you can fell call war cry and make the unit silly accurate and still benefit from pathfinder. IMO skaldi is for sure worth it. Especially if you are only running one unit of champs. |
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whydak
Junior Strategist
Posts: 288
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Post by whydak on Feb 22, 2018 21:55:03 GMT
How about gatorman husk? 3p minion solo with ambush. And very annoying?
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Arcaux
Junior Strategist
Posts: 724
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Post by Arcaux on Feb 22, 2018 22:01:22 GMT
How about gatorman husk? 3p minion solo with ambush. And very annoying? That Minions Solo spot is super valuable. I'd argue that Eilish or Mist Speaker would be better options that the husk. |
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