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Post by Gamingdevil on Apr 27, 2017 13:28:35 GMT
Well I am not sure what to think, at 15 pts and in theme, perhaps but compared to what other people were getting with their battle engines (38 - 40 boxes?) I am pretty let down. So we have the least amount of boxes, still the weakest in melee despite it being a melee engine, and lost the biggest buff that would have made it really desirable. +2 ARM probably wont be very significant relegated to vs ranged and magic attacks for undead only. If it protected warjacks, maybe. Then it would basically be a poor man's krielstone. But it needed more boxes than what it got. What was it? 24? And my trollkin warwagon rolls out with 38? Haha. Well, it's still Incorporeal which helps, though I was expecting a bit more as well. Maybe the CID will show it needs to be more like 28 or something. There are others that got stuck at 24 boxes though. |
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Post by wseraphim on Apr 27, 2017 13:55:31 GMT
Well, it's still Incorporeal which helps, though I was expecting a bit more as well. Maybe the CID will show it needs to be more like 28 or something. There are others that got stuck at 24 boxes though. "Others" - are really heavy shooting Convergence and RoS Engines, which were awesome even without any buffs. |
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Post by schostoppa1 on Apr 27, 2017 14:07:22 GMT
soles said that Infernal Machines is getting the wraith engine added as well. with death ward casters arm18 brute thrall shield walls could be useful.
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Post by far2casual on Apr 27, 2017 14:10:21 GMT
ARM16 shield guards*
Yes.
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Post by schostoppa1 on Apr 27, 2017 15:22:54 GMT
ya. i was stacking on +2arm from death ward from scavy or skarre2. not saying a min mechthrall unit with brutes is worthy of death ward. just pointing out the possible synergy. |
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Post by polymonith on Apr 27, 2017 16:14:31 GMT
Obviously need to test it out, but I really feel the change to unhallow is a worse than it was before. On paper I much rather have the old wraith engine. Not sure how much distance arm 14 over arm 12 is going to go. Immunity to blast damage was the real benefit. Banes warriors are just at the edge of benefiting from the buff, knights and riders are pushed into a good range.
Extra hit points are nice though.
I was really hoping for cleave to get replace by a more reliable attack generation.
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Post by MiNDmaZing on Apr 27, 2017 16:46:14 GMT
I think it needs more hitpoints 28 to 30 would be nice, cause its a melee BE and will easily be killed after it goes in to attack. In the cod forum it looks like jason soles is happy about it and they wont changed it, but why do they a cid? We will see.
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Post by Derpanger on Apr 28, 2017 5:41:22 GMT
+2 ARM with banes and brutes is pretty nice in my books. Bumping our shield guards to ARM 16 is pretty sweet.
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unded
Junior Strategist
Posts: 760 
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Post by unded on Apr 28, 2017 10:31:11 GMT
So... it's a good start, but I feel it's still not good enough to justify including.
The obvious synergy is with knights and riders, but unless you're taking both you gotta ask yourself do I want +2 ARM or just another unit?
I don't feel it does enough to justify its inclusion if it's costing an entire unit to get a small buff.
For reference, Cygnar brings a much stronger buff for just 4 points. (Arcane shield works against melee as well, is 1 ARM higher, and is not tied to to a short radius effect)
imo it needs to do more than just buff armour to justify its inclusion.
-und_ed
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Kavrae
Junior Strategist
Posts: 182
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Post by Kavrae on Apr 28, 2017 11:31:37 GMT
So... it's a good start, but I feel it's still not good enough to justify including. The obvious synergy is with knights and riders, but unless you're taking both you gotta ask yourself do I want +2 ARM or just another unit? I don't feel it does enough to justify its inclusion if it's costing an entire unit to get a small buff. For reference, Cygnar brings a much stronger buff for just 4 points. (Arcane shield works against melee as well, is 1 ARM higher, and is not tied to to a short radius effect) imo it needs to do more than just buff armour to justify its inclusion. -und_ed That's just it though.... it doesn't just buff armor. It also applied Dark Shroud, is stupidly fast for its base size, is incorporeal and (occasionally) creates Machine Wraiths. We have to pay for those abilities somehow. So do we just pretend those don't exist and treat them as "meh" bonuses while personal melee killing power and armor are the only things that matter? |
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Post by tiberius on Apr 28, 2017 12:03:51 GMT
I think I would buy into it more if the dark shroud were something that was stacked into the arm buff as the same ability (and would stack with dark shroud from other sources) therefore covering a larger area. So an aura of +2 arm to friendly and -2 ARM to enemy. I would definitely pay for that. Though you are right, creating machine wraiths - situational but powerful, incorporeal - matchup dependent but potentially very powerful, and mobile for its base size. All true statements.
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unded
Junior Strategist
Posts: 760
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Post by unded on Apr 28, 2017 12:27:57 GMT
If it's applying the dark shroud, it's dying the turn after.
That's a 15-point support piece dying, plus whatever you commit to kill the target. What are you killing that's worth that many points?
I like tiberius' suggestion of an aura of dark shroud. That would at least add an extra layer of utility that doesn't get it killed
-und_ed
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Kavrae
Junior Strategist
Posts: 182
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Post by Kavrae on Apr 28, 2017 12:59:18 GMT
I think I would buy into it more if the dark shroud were something that was stacked into the arm buff as the same ability (and would stack with dark shroud from other sources) therefore covering a larger area. So an aura of +2 arm to friendly and -2 ARM to enemy. I would definitely pay for that. Though you are right, creating machine wraiths - situational but powerful, incorporeal - matchup dependent but potentially very powerful, and mobile for its base size. All true statements. I like this idea. Then you could keep it in the back as a purely support oriented battle engine, without needing to decide on a time to do a suicide run with it. Though it will be a bit disappointing to have those large claws and not use them. |
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malachi
Baby's First Wargame
Posts: 3
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Post by malachi on Apr 28, 2017 14:54:09 GMT
What about Unhallowed giving undead models +2 ARM vs ranged/magic and Dark Shroud? That would still limit the ARM debuff for melee attacks, and not open up higher POW shooting without the target in melee bonus (except for models with Black Penny).
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Post by MiNDmaZing on Apr 28, 2017 20:03:53 GMT
That thing cries for collecting souls on some inches not only in melee too... this would be nice cause its a wraith!
give it our soul mechanic, with it it can buy attacks or give armor aura or darkshroud aura or the previous incorporal rule
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