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Post by sand20go on Apr 21, 2017 22:44:58 GMT
Trying to put the last pieces of the puzzle together. To Fun Carraige or not to Fun Carriage. Bringing lots of Juggers for the second wave. Thoughts?
(Sadly I don't own 9 rockets or I would DEFINATELY have them in the list) ;-)
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Post by harrysan on Apr 22, 2017 2:37:41 GMT
I'm playing in a tourney tomorrow and I'm bringing Vlad1 + 12 rockets in WG Kommand and Karchev + 8 jacks in Jaws because I apparently want my friends to hate me. I'll report on my findings, nothing quite like running 2 lists for the first time in a tournament. How hard could it be? Rockets shoot stuff until it's done. Easy peasy.
Also putting together that many Rifle Corps and Rocketeers was certainly instant karmic punishment. The WGRC kit is probably one of the worst.
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Post by tesoe on Apr 22, 2017 2:42:11 GMT
I was thinking along the same lines the other day. I came up with the below list while mulling it over. Unfortunately I haven't played enough MK3 to really say if it's all that good or not. Also not sure if it would just be better being run by Vlad2 or Irusk2. It's so hard to tell with Vlad1. He's damn good, but a total one trick pony.
Theme: Winter Guard Kommand
3 / 3 Free Cards 73 / 75 Army
Vladimir Tzepesci, The Dark Prince - WJ: +28
- Grolar - PC: 18 (Battlegroup Points Used: 18)
- Juggernaut - PC: 12 (Battlegroup Points Used: 10)
Winter Guard Gun Carriage - PC: 18
Winter Guard Gun Carriage - PC: 18
Kovnik Jozef Grigorovich - PC: 4
Winter Guard Artillery Kapitan - PC: 3
Winter Guard Artillery Kapitan - PC: 0
Winter Guard Rifle Corps - Leader & 5 Grunts: 8
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
Winter Guard Rifle Corps - Leader & 5 Grunts: 8
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
Winter Guard Mortar Crew - Gunner & Grunt: 0
Winter Guard Mortar Crew - Gunner & Grunt: 0
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Post by Netherby on Apr 22, 2017 4:07:54 GMT
I don't think the crazy Vlad1 rocket spam lists you see around are actually all that good.
Don't forget that WGI+CA are also a very good unit under Vlad1.
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wendan
Junior Strategist
Posts: 785 
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Post by wendan on Apr 22, 2017 10:09:00 GMT
Having seen them in action, I think they're really good. They certainly seem to vex a lot of players.
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Post by harrysan on Apr 26, 2017 0:31:45 GMT
So unfortunately it was only a 3 round tournament and I got the bye the last round so I could dip out with the TO and go to dinner. The two games I did get to play, I had to drop my Karchev Jaws list for both. Which worked well, but no rockets hit the table.  |
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Post by GumbaFish on Apr 26, 2017 0:37:37 GMT
I'm playing in a tourney tomorrow and I'm bringing Vlad1 + 12 rockets in WG Kommand and Karchev + 8 jacks in Jaws because I apparently want my friends to hate me. I'll report on my findings, nothing quite like running 2 lists for the first time in a tournament. How hard could it be? Rockets shoot stuff until it's done. Easy peasy. Also putting together that many Rifle Corps and Rocketeers was certainly instant karmic punishment. The WGRC kit is probably one of the worst. I hear that. I decided I didn't want to run 3 min units of WGRC but did want to run 2 so I just ordered 2 metal grunts and the rocket pack from the PP store instead of having to assemble any more plastic guys! |
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Post by Armchair Warrior on Apr 26, 2017 1:54:18 GMT
I've run this list before and really liked it, although I've yet to "need' the Spriggan tech. I'm sure as soon as I drop the Spriggan from the list I will need the tech. I'm looking forward to seeing what happens in the CID to the Gun carraige.
My only problem with this list is closing myself out...
War Room Army
Khador - Vlad 1 Kommand
Theme: Winter Guard Kommand
2 / 2 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army
Vladimir Tzepesci, The Dark Prince - WJ: +28
- Destroyer - PC: 14 (Battlegroup Points Used: 14)
- Destroyer - PC: 14 (Battlegroup Points Used: 14)
- Spriggan - PC: 19
- Juggernaut - PC: 12
Kovnik Jozef Grigorovich - PC: 4
Winter Guard Infantry - Leader & 5 Grunts: 6
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
- Winter Guard Infantry Officer & Standard - Officer & Standard: 0
Winter Guard Rifle Corps - Leader & 5 Grunts: 8
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
Winter Guard Rifle Corps - Leader & 5 Grunts: 8
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
Winter Guard Field Gun Crew - Gunner & 2 Grunts: 0
THEME: Winter Guard Kommand
---
GENERATED : 04/25/2017 21:51:45
BUILD ID : 2037.17-02-13
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Post by Armchair Warrior on May 14, 2017 1:29:50 GMT
My latest Vlad 1 rocketspam list is posted here on the CID forum. link
This was my list. War Room Army Khador - Vlad 1 Kommand 4+GC Vladimir Tzepesci, The Dark Prince - WJ: +28 - Marauder - PC: 10 (Battlegroup Points Used: 10) - Marauder - PC: 10 (Battlegroup Points Used: 10) - Marauder - PC: 10 (Battlegroup Points Used: 8) - Juggernaut - PC: 12 Winter Guard Gun Carriage - PC: 18 Kovnik Jozef Grigorovich - PC: 4 Winter Guard Infantry - Leader & 5 Grunts: 6 - Winter Guard Infantry Officer & Standard - Officer & Standard: 0 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 Winter Guard Rifle Corps - Leader & 5 Grunts: 8 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 Winter Guard Rifle Corps - Leader & 5 Grunts: 8 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 Winter Guard Mortar Crew - Gunner & Grunt: 0 Winter Guard Mortar Crew - Gunner & Grunt: 0 THEME: Winter Guard Kommand --- OK, so I'm wrestling with a few questions. Please chime in. 1). How the heck can I effectively manage my clock? I've tried a Vlad 1 rocket list 3 times now, and...crap, the clock is my worst enemy. How do you do it? 2). I'm wondering if I should swap a WGRC for a WGI and drop a mortar crew for a 2nd free O&S, which I happen to own (unpainted...gotta do that). The WG are really all about the rockets, and the reposition is just golden (when you don't forget to use it). 3). I can't decide if I should just drop a whole unit and add more jacks. I am having trouble with the clock. Is this my answer or just a cop out? 4). Is this really the right pairing for my anchor which is Karchev under Jaws. I feel like I'm kinda buying time until OW2 is released. |
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Post by Netherby on May 14, 2017 3:43:32 GMT
Infantry and clock management is just more practice. I think it comes down to two things:
1) Moving them quickly. Have a good idea how you are going to move them before you start your turn and don't worry too much about perfect placement of each model. Just worry about putting the in range/ out of range of what ever.
2) Knowing when to make attacks. I think often there is little reason to make a large number of attacks. Make the important ones only. There is little point firing your rockets at infantry, missing and resolving 6-9 deviations. If you aren't clearing a zone or damaging an important model, just don't make the attacks. I think this is probably the number one biggest skill to master when running lots of models. You just have to learn what attacks to make and when to just put them all into a single CRA to save time.
As to your list the first thing I would do is switch to a full WGI. For one they are a good unit and for two you want a max unit to get the most out of Joe buffs. You could get the points for it either by dropping a rocket from each rifle squad or dropping a rifle squad entirely and taking another Marauder.
How are you finding the Mortar Crews? Because they are clock hungry units. I don't really like the Field Guns due to the shorter range combined with horribly slow movement. But the knock down is good and you still get your advance moves. Not firing the mortars if they have nothing particularly relevant to shoot might also help.
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Ganso
Junior Strategist
Posts: 932
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Post by Ganso on May 14, 2017 3:55:48 GMT
I went full rocket boat during kingdom con, 15 to be exact, and aside from that one guy that scooped after whining all game about how broken they are, non of my opponents had much problems with it.
I'll probably stick with six to nine rockets for the future and add more jacks.
Also, fun fact, if the fun carriage stays at 17 through CiD, two of them plus two artillery Kapitans would be 40 points, awesome how that lines up with WGK.
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zeffid
Junior Strategist
Posts: 163
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Post by zeffid on May 14, 2017 13:29:34 GMT
My list is very similar to what Armchair Warrior has posted (seems to be 1pt over the limit). I have a fgc instead of wgi attachment and then 4th marauder.
It plays well into some matches. I was able to play almost any Cygnar (achievement!!!). The Fun Carriage is definitely a boon there.
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Post by Armchair Warrior on May 14, 2017 19:01:33 GMT
Zeffid, my list is over the point limit with the current rules, but in the CID the gun carraige goes to 17 points...so there's my point.
Netherby, man you are spot on. I take too many attacks I just shouldn't take. I'm trying to do more CRAs and that helps but I still need more practice. I like your suggestion of maxing out one of my units...the easy answer is to swap the carraige for a Kodiak and maxing the WGI. In terms of deployment, that puts the WGI in the center with the longer range WGRC on each flank. Not a bad setup.
In term of the Mortars vs. Field Gun debate, I like the Mortars. I boundless charge them on turn one so they can charge 8". High explosive with S&P is just really good for taking out stuff -- POW 12+ blasts kill squishy support solos in the back. With the new objectives in SR 2017, you can give one of them magical attacks. It seems good. Their other job is to take follow up shots on knocked down beasts and jacks. If they've got nothing else to do I just shoot at the enemy objective.
I find Field Guns hard to use. They're slow and subject to line of sight issues. Sometimes I bring one instead of a Mortar, but I'm finding I like the double Mortar crew.
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zeffid
Junior Strategist
Posts: 163
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Post by zeffid on May 15, 2017 8:29:56 GMT
@armchair Warrior, sorry, I'm not following CID closely. A 1 point decrease in cost will let me upgrade WGI to more rifles - not even sure I want that as sometimes those two-man-CRA on POW 14 are very painful.
I like the mortars same like you do. I never have focus to bCharge them first turn though. But I always take one WGFieldGunCrew first. This is a premier piece to fight jacks in lategame. It is pretty reliable knowcking them down even engaged (RAT 9 aiming) and then all your small units just don't need that +2 bonus from Kovnik any more. I know you have marauders and fun carriage for KD, but both can be very tricky to apply on engaged troops.
A question to audience. How do you solve deployment puzzle?
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Post by smoothcriminal on May 15, 2017 15:28:58 GMT
I deploy caster, rockets, carriage and jacks forward, everything else behind them.
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