regleant
Junior Strategist
Sometimes things go right
Posts: 267
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Post by regleant on Aug 12, 2017 10:25:35 GMT
OMFG my entire meta keeps whining how this model is OP. I point out that I need to take a 5 point unit to make it optimal or rely on mistakes from my opponent (I got 1 opponent to make a Free Strike against it). But man, is this how Cryx and Cygnar players feel? Should I just learn to gain nutrition from their whining?
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Post by wkm on Aug 13, 2017 2:19:49 GMT
OMFG my entire meta keeps whining how this model is OP. I point out that I need to take a 5 point unit to make it optimal or rely on mistakes from my opponent (I got 1 opponent to make a Free Strike against it). But man, is this how Cryx and Cygnar players feel? Should I just learn to gain nutrition from their whining? I don't play Skorne but I'd get used to it. It's a very strong model perhaps even one of the best in the faction and one of the best battle engines. PP also seemed to want BE to have a presence about them and when everything goes right they can feel very overpowered. Take my factions BE (Legion) against the right infantry it'll just make half my opponents army disappear which can seem very overpowered (even been told that on most such occasions when that happens). I don't think the turtle engine is that overpowered if at all. Though haven played against it fairly often I will admit to sometimes thinking it was overpowered in the heat of the moment and I've heard most your arguments though they often bother me more than the model it's self. From my observations turtle boy doesn't need a full load of tokens 2-3 is enough to do it's job anything more is gravy and I've never felt very sorry about having to take a 5 point unit that you would have been taking regardless of whether you were playing the desert tortoise or not.
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regleant
Junior Strategist
Sometimes things go right
Posts: 267
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Post by regleant on Aug 13, 2017 3:42:43 GMT
Well, no. The Beast Handlers are there to manage beasts... if you want to manage the Ani as well, you need a dedicated unit, or maintain some tight positioning. Also, it can only ever have 3 tokens.
And I keep hearing how it can "kill a heavy" and "higher damage output than a heavy", but if you do the math, Gladiator will kill a Khador heavy, where Ani will fall short... yet is 2 points more.
Note, I think it's fully worth its points and very versatile. It's just not as good as the whining implies.
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Post by toconut on Aug 13, 2017 7:07:15 GMT
Get used to it. The sad part is that I quit cygnar because people always complained about how unfair my faction was and now I'm getting in the same spot with skorne. I'm hearing more and more things like "this is the result of a bunch of cries" or "if you cry enough you'll get broken pieces"...after the rework every model a bit competitive is broken because of our whining: Makeda 2, Shaman, BE, Reivers, Rasheth...
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skormedlover87
Junior Strategist
Desperately searching for days off to game...
Posts: 517
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Post by skormedlover87 on Aug 13, 2017 18:23:26 GMT
Pp didn't fix Skorne because we were whiners. They did it because they weren't selling models. If it were due to internet screams, more factions would have been "fixed".
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Post by sardonicartery on Aug 16, 2017 19:33:00 GMT
Pp didn't fix Skorne because we were whiners. They did it because they weren't selling models. If it were due to internet screams, more factions would have been "fixed". True, I remember seeing pics of several conventions: the Skorne pile was left high when everything else was in demand. And the tax for the battle engine is the extoller, not beast handlers.
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regleant
Junior Strategist
Sometimes things go right
Posts: 267
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Post by regleant on Aug 17, 2017 2:52:33 GMT
And the tax for the battle engine is the extoller, not beast handlers. Explain? I feel like I'm missing something
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zich
Junior Strategist
Posts: 690
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Post by zich on Aug 17, 2017 8:08:00 GMT
Eyeless sighted magical guns are great.
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Post by sardonicartery on Aug 18, 2017 16:46:00 GMT
And the tax for the battle engine is the extoller, not beast handlers. Explain? I feel like I'm missing something You could make an argument for beast handlers as a derp turtle tax, but like the journeyman warcaster in Cygnar or the choir in Menoth, you were bringing them in every list anyway. You want the extoller to shoot stealth, get magical weapons to shoot the Cryx battle engine, etc.
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Post by toconut on Aug 18, 2017 23:59:10 GMT
I played the SA without both pieces and I'm not entirely sure it has such thing as "tax". Depending on the role you want for it, you could run without all of those models. Its shooting is good enough in winds to be without pgbh (you very rarely charge, when you do you can damage it yourself with support or models that have nothing to do if you are not already damaged by the opponent) and most of the time you don't need extollers. If you're not planning to take on cryx or circle you'll be fine 90% of your games.
An argument can be made that it's much better with those models around, and I agree with this statement, but I don't think they're mandatory. For example, the new theme lacks an extoller and it can affect certain matchups, but you can tune your list to cover that weakness (example: hexeris2 if you need magical weapons,or a fast high accuracy model to prey wolves/stones like an Archidon under X2).
That said, I currently run WoD with SA and full package, so I believe is totally worth it. Note though that I have a big battlegroup that benefits from condition and the extoller has great synergy with slingers (one can shoot off stealth at 16" with rat6 and a reroll) and cannons/rasheth to ignore concealment. I wouldn't take them if they only had synergy with the BE.
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