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Big Mac
Jul 26, 2018 6:16:59 GMT
via mobile
Post by elshinare on Jul 26, 2018 6:16:59 GMT
I am curious how everyone else plays him, and how certain things work. One thing I rarely if ever use is primal shock. Today I used it, bit.my opponent questioned whether Kromac, champion of the Wurm's feat and primal add to the base strength of that attack or if it is base strength without any buffs, as well as if a warpwolf's warp strength would count.
The other question would be with lightning strike, if you get the benefit if you cast it AFTER you kill stuff.
Now on to play style. I have been trying to play him more aggressively, almost always up the board. going in and killing stuff. He seems like he needs more buffs, i.e. spiny growth, lightning strike, elusive than most other casters people play aggressive with. but also, he gets 1 attack...he has an open fist, can't he get a gauntlet or claws, SOMETHING. are there any other casters with only 1 attack? Wurmwood doesn't count, he is just a magical tree, unless they give us a Wurmwood 2 that becomes an Ent. His feat I tend to use as aggressive as possible, but sometimes I feel I should use it defensively, sometimes at the end of my turn 1 or 2 depending on the board.
What lists are you all playing him in? or at least experimenting. My group has all agreed to use the pathfinder changes as those are the only 90% sure coming out of CiD changes will happen.
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Post by streetpizza on Jul 26, 2018 9:35:34 GMT
I am curious how everyone else plays him, and how certain things work. One thing I rarely if ever use is primal shock. Today I used it, bit.my opponent questioned whether Kromac, champion of the Wurm's feat and primal add to the base strength of that attack or if it is base strength without any buffs, as well as if a warpwolf's warp strength would count. The other question would be with lightning strike, if you get the benefit if you cast it AFTER you kill stuff. are there any other casters with only 1 attack? Base strength means BASE strength. None of the buffs add to that. Yes you can that has been ruled on in MKIII as being different from MKII where you had to cast it first. Baldur1/2, Kaya1/2, Morvahna1 I'd give a list but I've never really liked what Kromac2 brings to the table so I don't play him.
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Big Mac
Jul 26, 2018 11:11:52 GMT
via mobile
Post by paradox on Jul 26, 2018 11:11:52 GMT
Theme: Call of the Wild 4 / 4 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army
Kromac, Champion of the Wurm - WB: +28 - Gorax Rager - PC: 7 (Battlegroup Points Used: 7) - Gorax Rager - PC: 7 (Battlegroup Points Used: 7) - Gorax Rager - PC: 7 (Battlegroup Points Used: 7) - Wild Argus - PC: 7 (Battlegroup Points Used: 7) - Wild Argus - PC: 7 - Wild Argus - PC: 7 - Wild Argus - PC: 7 - Argus Moonhound - PC: 6 - Scarsfell Griffon - PC: 8 - Warpwolf Stalker - PC: 19 - Ghetorix - PC: 21
Blackclad Wayfarer - PC: 0 Blackclad Wayfarer - PC: 0
Shifting Stones - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0 Shifting Stones - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0
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Post by redcathal on Jul 26, 2018 15:08:20 GMT
Theme: Call of the Wild 4 / 4 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army Kromac, Champion of the Wurm - WB: +28 - Gorax Rager - PC: 7 (Battlegroup Points Used: 7) - Gorax Rager - PC: 7 (Battlegroup Points Used: 7) - Gorax Rager - PC: 7 (Battlegroup Points Used: 7) - Wild Argus - PC: 7 (Battlegroup Points Used: 7) - Wild Argus - PC: 7 - Wild Argus - PC: 7 - Wild Argus - PC: 7 - Argus Moonhound - PC: 6 - Scarsfell Griffon - PC: 8 - Warpwolf Stalker - PC: 19 - Ghetorix - PC: 21 Blackclad Wayfarer - PC: 0 Blackclad Wayfarer - PC: 0 Shifting Stones - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0 Shifting Stones - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0 Why the three goraxes? I understand the spamming of the argi, bigger spread of the doppler barks but I've always found 2 primals more than enough to free up the caster?
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Big Mac
Jul 26, 2018 15:52:23 GMT
via mobile
Post by paradox on Jul 26, 2018 15:52:23 GMT
Theme: Call of the Wild 4 / 4 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army Kromac, Champion of the Wurm - WB: +28 - Gorax Rager - PC: 7 (Battlegroup Points Used: 7) - Gorax Rager - PC: 7 (Battlegroup Points Used: 7) - Gorax Rager - PC: 7 (Battlegroup Points Used: 7) - Wild Argus - PC: 7 (Battlegroup Points Used: 7) - Wild Argus - PC: 7 - Wild Argus - PC: 7 - Wild Argus - PC: 7 - Argus Moonhound - PC: 6 - Scarsfell Griffon - PC: 8 - Warpwolf Stalker - PC: 19 - Ghetorix - PC: 21 Blackclad Wayfarer - PC: 0 Blackclad Wayfarer - PC: 0 Shifting Stones - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0 Shifting Stones - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0 Why the three goraxes? I understand the spamming of the argi, bigger spread of the doppler barks but I've always found 2 primals more than enough to free up the caster? Spamming Primal, and possible 2nd waves. To be clear, the list aims to deliver Kromac, Gheto, or both. Everything else is utterly expendable. But feated, Primalled, combo-biting argus are lulzy on their own, too.
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Big Mac
Jul 27, 2018 7:09:08 GMT
via mobile
Post by LoS Jaden on Jul 27, 2018 7:09:08 GMT
Remind me tomorrow, I've got some thoughts.
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unded
Junior Strategist
Posts: 760
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Post by unded on Jul 27, 2018 8:13:37 GMT
So this isn't a very strong Mac2 list, but it's the most fun I've had playing him:
Mac2 Wilder Loki Ghetto Feral Woldwrath Wilder Blackclad Wayfarer
Obviously it trades poorly. What's fun is the ability to use the woldwrath's animus and toss out primal shocks with boosted attack rolls at POW 16 for 2 FURY. add in the wrath's boostable gun, and it's a surprising amount of high-pow ranged goodness that Mac is utilising before sending in scary beasts. a free upkeep of awakened spirit keeps Ghetto going nicely, and the feat gives you a surprisingly tanky set of wolves (the list is too small to expect to feat offensively, so defensive feat is expected)
It's not competitive, and it's out of theme, but it's really a lot of fun and worth messing around with.
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Big Mac
Jul 27, 2018 11:32:06 GMT
via mobile
Post by kuririnad on Jul 27, 2018 11:32:06 GMT
Have you considered swapping in the storm raptor and a stalker for WW and Look? Should have similar ranged presence and then you get to play in theme.
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unded
Junior Strategist
Posts: 760
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Post by unded on Jul 27, 2018 11:58:02 GMT
That's a really cool idea, Kuriri. Especially since the WW doesn't benefit from Mac's feat feat but the pigeon does. It's missing the POW 16 primal shock fun, but probably brings more than it takes away.
Unfortunately I don't own a lightning pigeon yet, so it's gonna have to be down to someone else to give it a whirl.
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Big Mac
Jul 27, 2018 14:02:42 GMT
via mobile
Post by macdaddy on Jul 27, 2018 14:02:42 GMT
elshinare PF alone on our heavies makes him an instant consideration. Kromac2 has one unique thing going for him that none of our other casters can boast. He is literally a heavy. In statline and output. On Feat Turn, with 3 corpses and charfe he will do about 31 Damage to an Arm 19 Heavy without even needing to spend a Fury. In addition he has a really beefy defensive statline at 14/18 with 19 Boxes. Easily becoming 14/20 with spiny growth or 14/22 on Feat Turn with SG. This makes him stronger as the game goes on. As you trade peices, your opponent runs out of ways to deal with your caster. Forcing an attrition and scenario game. His best spell IMO is carnage. Making him Mat 10, or making most of our beasts Mat8. Meaning we don’t need primal to deal with def 13/14 heavies. His feat allows you to alpha hard. Giving your entire BG +2 Str and Arm. Making our warpwolves and Satyrs pretty darn durable. I think, currently, he is really strong with a Storm raptor. Vengeful makes it scary to approach, and Carnage +feat fixes a lot of its native issues. He particularly likes heavies over lights, because his feat synergises better with our heavies. I currently run him with this list: Big Mac: CotW -4 Wild Argi -2 Goraxes -ghetorix -2 Stalkers 2 Stones 2 Wayfarers Gobber bellows crew It’s a fun list and hits like a train. The Argi help deliver the 3 Heavies and also hit pretty hard with feat. 2 Argi should kill your average heavy with primal and feat. Especially with a free charge. Kromac himself sits at Def 16 Arm 20 most of the game being really really hard to assassinate. He’s a fun caster, I would prefer to swap awakened spirit as it’s very quickly becoming a dead spell on him (literally only use it on Goraxes now because Spiny growth is free for Gheto in call) Particularly for either a threat extender or Stat Buff. But honestly, once CiD comes he’s gonna be great. Here is my CiD changes list with him: Big Mac: CotW -Ghetorix -2 Ferals -2 Stalkers -Gnarlhorn 2 Stones 2 Wayfarers Swamp Gobbers Think about this: Ferals with PF are amazing. Under feat and primal you do not need to warp strength meaning you can warp either speed, or Arm. Warp speed, and the feral now threats 12” (14 with HM) that’s an 1” further than a stalker. Warp Arm and he sits at 14/20 having just murdered a heavy. I’m realy excited for post CiD Big Mac.
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Post by LoS Jaden on Jul 27, 2018 19:57:13 GMT
I am curious how everyone else plays him, and how certain things work. One thing I rarely if ever use is primal shock. Today I used it, bit.my opponent questioned whether Kromac, champion of the Wurm's feat and primal add to the base strength of that attack or if it is base strength without any buffs, as well as if a warpwolf's warp strength would count. The other question would be with lightning strike, if you get the benefit if you cast it AFTER you kill stuff. Now on to play style. I have been trying to play him more aggressively, almost always up the board. going in and killing stuff. He seems like he needs more buffs, i.e. spiny growth, lightning strike, elusive than most other casters people play aggressive with. but also, he gets 1 attack...he has an open fist, can't he get a gauntlet or claws, SOMETHING. are there any other casters with only 1 attack? Wurmwood doesn't count, he is just a magical tree, unless they give us a Wurmwood 2 that becomes an Ent. His feat I tend to use as aggressive as possible, but sometimes I feel I should use it defensively, sometimes at the end of my turn 1 or 2 depending on the board. What lists are you all playing him in? or at least experimenting. My group has all agreed to use the pathfinder changes as those are the only 90% sure coming out of CiD changes will happen. To address your number of attacks issue, most of the Circle have only one attack. Kaya 1 Kaya 2 Kaya 3 Baldur 1 Baldur 2 Mohsar Tanith Una 2 Krueger 1 Krueger 2 Morvahna 1 Other big beater Warnouns tend to have one attack as well such as: Butcher 1/2 Madrak 1/2 Durst etc. Kromac wants desperately to leverage his feat offensively. This means playing Warbeasts with good threat ranges, and for me that has always meant playing the Storm Raptor with him for a few reasons. Native 12 inch threat is really big, and the bird has flight as well which allowed it to handle rough terrain where other things couldn't. A pretty decent gun is good for infantry clear as well as banging something up for your Stalker or Kromac to kill and Sprint out. Carnage fixes the MAT issues, and Vengeful makes Warjacks coming into him really bad. For CID purposes, I have been testing this: Kromac (Call of the Wild) - Storm Raptor - Stalker - Feral - Shadowhorn - Shadowhorn Blackclad (free) Blackclad (free) Lord of the Feast (free) Shifting Stones Farrow Valkyries My inclusion of the Valkyries is to enable your army to weather a turn or two of shooting before engaging. The Bird and potentially the Feral can come in and absolutely blend 2-3 heavies under Feat and potentially Primal, while the Shadowhorns control the Scenario and keep your opponents casters consistently honest. They also let you trade up really nicely as occasionally beatback or two handed throws let you trade them for way more expensive heavies. With 3 initials, they also clear infantry reasonably well. Final plug for the Shadowhorn - they're going to be insanely hard to dislodge from scenarios now. DEF 15 vs. charges and elusive on top of that means they'll live against most infantry charges and heavies will have less attacks because they'll be forced to boost.
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Big Mac
Jul 28, 2018 7:05:00 GMT
via mobile
Post by Trollock on Jul 28, 2018 7:05:00 GMT
macdaddyDo you really think that warping non-strength and rely on primal is a good idea. I get that you want the alpha and that you can kilk a heavy BUT what happens if the opponent just ignores the feral a round and feed it a cheap model, since it will do nothing the next round? In my experience they can often get even or higher on atttrition by ignoring the pieces that will fenzy and focus on other things for a round. If they angle the frenzy target a bit they can then get to the teliable back strikes on it too, and it will warp strength when it frenzies so when they actually try and kill the thing it will be effectively 12/16 rather than 14/20... This is why i HATE primal for heavies (from playing trolls. Havent put living circle beasts on the table yet...)
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unded
Junior Strategist
Posts: 760
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Post by unded on Jul 28, 2018 10:03:25 GMT
While you are correct, Trollock (it's always better to work without Primal if you can), the important point is that you have options. If you need to extra speed you can warp that for the alpha, while still getting the job done under Primal. If you're going in under feat, you can warp ARM and suddenly you have a 14/20 Feral to tank with (cleearly I'd only do this if I have a big alpha - it's a bad idea if you're just sending in a long-range wolf bullet)
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Big Mac
Jul 28, 2018 12:40:17 GMT
via mobile
Post by macdaddy on Jul 28, 2018 12:40:17 GMT
macdaddyDo you really think that warping non-strength and rely on primal is a good idea. I get that you want the alpha and that you can kilk a heavy BUT what happens if the opponent just ignores the feral a round and feed it a cheap model, since it will do nothing the next round? In my experience they can often get even or higher on atttrition by ignoring the pieces that will fenzy and focus on other things for a round. If they angle the frenzy target a bit they can then get to the teliable back strikes on it too, and it will warp strength when it frenzies so when they actually try and kill the thing it will be effectively 12/16 rather than 14/20... This is why i HATE primal for heavies (from playing trolls. Havent put living circle beasts on the table yet...) Depends on where you shove the feral. If you primal a heavy make sure you chuck it into a really annoying spot that really punishes your opponent for ignoring it. Block a charge lane, contest a flag, be really close to a caster, engage a second heavy. There’s ways you can force your opponent to kill the primalled beast. Typically if an opponent goes out of his way to ignore a primalled heavy and you make sure your positionings correct he will struggle to do much else. So yes, primal sucks, but you have to learn how to mitigate it. For example, in CotW, you can primal a stalker, kill a heavy, then sprint into a really awful position for your opponent. Then you have to deal with a 14/19 heavy before anything else. Feral can do similar, you just have to apply him properly on the charge.
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Post by elshinare on Jul 28, 2018 15:48:52 GMT
Ended up playing this last night. screwed up a few rules such as transferring and Wild-Aggression, which I would probably have lost, but opponent was pretty sure I would have come back no matter what
War Room Army
Circle Orboros - New Army
Theme: Call of the Wild 4 / 4 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army
Kromac, Champion of the Wurm - WB: +28 - Ghetorix - PC: 21 (Battlegroup Points Used: 21) - Pureblood Warpwolf - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 7) - Rip Horn Satyr - PC: 14 - Wild Argus - PC: 7 - Wild Argus - PC: 7 - Wild Argus - PC: 7 - Wild Argus - PC: 7 - Gorax Rager - PC: 7 - Gorax Rager - PC: 7 - Gorax Rager - PC: 7
Blackclad Wayfarer - PC: 0 Lord of the Feast - PC: 0
Shifting Stones - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0 - Stone Keeper - PC: 2 Shifting Stones - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0
THEME: Call of the Wild ---
GENERATED : 07/28/2018 08:37:09 BUILD ID : 2065.18-05-07
From memory played against
Haley2 Defender Stormwall Stormstrider Cain 0 Charger Journeyman with Thorn Field Mechaniks
I will say that a primaled dog can get work done under feat turn, especially under hot dice. Average dice being pow 16s under feat a pow 20 for combo strike can eat a strider. Ghetorix essentially soloed the stormwall The entire game I forgot my Wayfarer, as in didn't even have him out of my case...
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