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Post by LoS Jaden on May 23, 2017 14:24:30 GMT
I liked the insight. Good job keeping each entry succinct but still informational. Just makes me want to hammer together a solid Tanith-Kromac1 pair. I figure since Tanith can be built for anything, she should be able to cover Kromac's weak spots. I figure she goes all-in on ranged, Kromac takes a beast brick with sentry stones and a couple wyrds to proc warpath. Ghetorix+ wayfarer + warpath can get one axe attack like 21" from where he started. I'm getting excited just thinking about a viable Kromac1... Could definitely be okay, although personally I'd be playing wurmwood and Kromac 1 - just my preference. Day 2 of my "State of the Faction" series, join me this time for my take on the Warbeasts of the Circle Orboros. druidsdice.blogspot.com/2017/05/state-of-faction-25-circle-warbeasts.html?m=0
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Post by macdaddy on May 23, 2017 15:00:53 GMT
Nice write up! I do want to say some things about your wold reviews though. I think that one caster makes wold guardians and woldwardens not horrible and that is baldur 2. In my bones list with him I have had lots of success running 2 of each as durable tanks and getting around pillow fisted attacks with lots of ganging up. Having said that I agree with them being horribly over costed and it never ceases to frustrate me that they are Fury 3. Mat 6 is bearable but they pay the warbeast tax and at best only have the output of a warjack with 3 focus at double the cost. I think all they need is a cost reduction (a significant one) Warden should be 14-15 points and guardian should be 15-16 and his animus needs to change as well.
Woldwatchers are a zero for me. Absolutely horrible in every way. Like they are that terrible that I wouldn't even rank them a 1. Horrible concept change and design changes.
As far as living beasts I do agree but I would put the pure blood at a solid 4. He is phenomenal and I believe hes the best all round of the non character wolves but he is definitely nowhere near S tier. I mostly say this because he is pillow fisted if he warps ghostly and his spray really need to be boosted in some way to do anything making him very fury hungry. Rat 5 means against anything Def 12 you need to hit your going to be boosting and Pow 14 means if you don't need to boost to hit you probably need to boost damage. I always end up running mine very hot and that can be taxing on a lot of our Fury 6 casters.
Thanks for your right up! Love all your content!
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Post by jisidro on May 23, 2017 16:37:40 GMT
Thx for the content!
I think we have to rate character warbeasts/warjacks seperatly: They are now the most exclusive models. To take them you ahve to play a specific caster or you are not in theme which is now a disadvantage. While Loki is awesome when we get a non-wold-only BG theme his inclusion outsider of Tanith will cost you 12+ pts (2xwayfarer+wilder) which is a lot even for his great abilities. Megalith is AWESOME but BoO loses a lot of steam when taken outside Baldur because you have to take wardens os spam lights/BEs...
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Post by LoS Jaden on May 24, 2017 1:08:08 GMT
Nice write up! I do want to say some things about your wold reviews though. I think that one caster makes wold guardians and woldwardens not horrible and that is baldur 2. In my bones list with him I have had lots of success running 2 of each as durable tanks and getting around pillow fisted attacks with lots of ganging up. Having said that I agree with them being horribly over costed and it never ceases to frustrate me that they are Fury 3. Mat 6 is bearable but they pay the warbeast tax and at best only have the output of a warjack with 3 focus at double the cost. I think all they need is a cost reduction (a significant one) Warden should be 14-15 points and guardian should be 15-16 and his animus needs to change as well. Woldwatchers are a zero for me. Absolutely horrible in every way. Like they are that terrible that I wouldn't even rank them a 1. Horrible concept change and design changes. As far as living beasts I do agree but I would put the pure blood at a solid 4. He is phenomenal and I believe hes the best all round of the non character wolves but he is definitely nowhere near S tier. I mostly say this because he is pillow fisted if he warps ghostly and his spray really need to be boosted in some way to do anything making him very fury hungry. Rat 5 means against anything Def 12 you need to hit your going to be boosting and Pow 14 means if you don't need to boost to hit you probably need to boost damage. I always end up running mine very hot and that can be taxing on a lot of our Fury 6 casters. Thanks for your right up! Love all your content! Wardens would have to be 13 points for me to consider taking them often, or 14 points and being Fury 4. Guardians...geeze I don't know what to say about these guys. Give them back Fury 4, give them back their old animus more or less, and then make them 14 points as well. I probably overvalue the pureblood, but he's just so...good XD Glad you're enjoying it, tomorrow the unit one comes out.
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Post by LoS Jaden on May 24, 2017 1:08:41 GMT
Thx for the content! I think we have to rate character warbeasts/warjacks seperatly: They are now the most exclusive models. To take them you ahve to play a specific caster or you are not in theme which is now a disadvantage. While Loki is awesome when we get a non-wold-only BG theme his inclusion outsider of Tanith will cost you 12+ pts (2xwayfarer+wilder) which is a lot even for his great abilities. Megalith is AWESOME but BoO loses a lot of steam when taken outside Baldur because you have to take wardens os spam lights/BEs... Yeah I really, really hate the theme lists right now to be honest. They're so incredibly stifling for list diversity, it makes me mad.
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Post by jisidro on May 24, 2017 11:57:51 GMT
Wardens would have to be 13 points for me to consider taking them often, or 14 points and being Fury 4. Guardians...geeze I don't know what to say about these guys. Give them back Fury 4, give them back their old animus more or less, and then make them 14 points as well.
You're not getting that.
Both have pathfinder and the no frenzy thing... FURY 3 is not even the factor it was before given that a lot of heavies have FURY 3 as well.
About the Guardian: there are lot of SPD 4 heavies and they see play. The difference is they have the support we don't have (Choir, boundless, Enrage, etc...)... He needs a decente animus (Flesh of Clay preferably), lose shield guard back to the watcher and clamjack like abilities. That or straight hitting power...
Stoneshaper was a lost opportunity for a +2 STR that would have thye wolds in play without suddenly hitting very hard.
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Post by ispyypsi on May 24, 2017 13:17:44 GMT
Yeah why they took his animus and replaced it with one that requires movement spd to use is beyond me. I don't play any other hordes factions but do they have beasts that share animus? We got feral and gorax, guardian and ripper I'd even say shadowhorn since beatback is kinda the same.
I feel like Loki does a better job at being a guardian that the stonepile does. What if he gained a no KD animus (too bad watcher) and gained roadblock? Probably not since we could replace our cloudwall/forestwall with a real wall, ha ha. Sorry to get all CID in here, I'm looking forward to reading about skinwalkers, bloodtrackers, reeves and, our tarpit being good/ok and everyone else sucking because of guns and jacks.
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Post by jisidro on May 24, 2017 14:44:35 GMT
As long as they chage the animus I'm happy, tbh flesh of clay is something that never was OP on circle and wouldn't be now.
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Post by jisidro on May 24, 2017 15:50:06 GMT
OMG, the units!!!!!!!
I have to give you a HUGE THUMBS UP for 0.0 on Blood Pack. I hope someone at PP reads this. It's so right. The reduced range, the assault because A&B is gone... it's a mess a bad mess.
I have to disagree with the Ravager texto (not with the score). What you said is all true BUT on the theme they are 7 guys for 16pts, even with crap defensive stats you can get there with care and attention. The POW 13 is a major bummer and not really justified for the circle shocktroops... They got described as THE OFFENSIVE medium base unit and they lost AD, pwerful/brutal and gained ARM/Tought... mmm, something is going over my head. That said, if you don't want to play the theme, don't buy them.
Skinwalkers: These guys where never hard to kill in mk2 and they aren't now. I played them a lot in mk2 with Morv2 and they never held a zone forever, they died got a few charges because they had the +2 SPD when damaged and got feated on. Now they durdle and get feated for the mini-feat. They get to MAT 8 and POW 14 which is more than out offensive troops but they lost pathfinder... No idea why.
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Post by streetpizza on May 24, 2017 18:29:00 GMT
Sadly charles your series is just reinforcing my decision to play protectorate for the near future. I was so in love with what circle did in MKII that the transition to MKIII for this faction has just killed my enthusiasm for it. So little diversity in model capabilities and a gutting of the feel of the faction was just too much.
Here's hoping that trolls get the next round of review and then us and legion following close behind.
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Post by macdaddy on May 24, 2017 19:36:43 GMT
Sadly charles your series is just reinforcing my decision to play protectorate for the near future. I was so in love with what circle did in MKII that the transition to MKIII for this faction has just killed my enthusiasm for it. So little diversity in model capabilities and a gutting of the feel of the faction was just too much. Here's hoping that trolls get the next round of review and then us and legion following close behind. Honestly outside of Mohsar I've been incredibly bored with the faction too and am switching to protectorate for a while. I feel like there are so many "must haves" to function and so much of our stuff just doesn't compare to other factions options. The faction diversity and freedom I feel in protectorate really has me hooked right now. Hopefully a CID will change my perspective. P.S I have not given up on Mohsar He is still my #1 ;D
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Post by ispyypsi on May 25, 2017 0:33:38 GMT
Something about circle must attract menoth players. I stopped playing menoth in mk2 for circle, mk3 has been alright but it is getting old. I might go back since power up makes it so people don't laugh at me when i drop amon now lol.
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Post by LoS Jaden on May 25, 2017 5:29:31 GMT
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Post by LoS Jaden on May 25, 2017 5:31:35 GMT
Sadly charles your series is just reinforcing my decision to play protectorate for the near future. I was so in love with what circle did in MKII that the transition to MKIII for this faction has just killed my enthusiasm for it. So little diversity in model capabilities and a gutting of the feel of the faction was just too much. Here's hoping that trolls get the next round of review and then us and legion following close behind. Yeah sorry man, I'm in the same boat. I freaking love Circle, but as it stands I am also enjoying Protectorate a lot more than Circle. Mostly this is just me getting my thoughts out there, generating some discussion, and hopefully some of the PP staff will take note. It will also give us a place to start from for CID if we ever get one.
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Post by LoS Jaden on May 25, 2017 5:33:03 GMT
OMG, the units!!!!!!! I have to give you a HUGE THUMBS UP for 0.0 on Blood Pack. I hope someone at PP reads this. It's so right. The reduced range, the assault because A&B is gone... it's a mess a bad mess. I have to disagree with the Ravager texto (not with the score). What you said is all true BUT on the theme they are 7 guys for 16pts, even with crap defensive stats you can get there with care and attention. The POW 13 is a major bummer and not really justified for the circle shocktroops... They got described as THE OFFENSIVE medium base unit and they lost AD, pwerful/brutal and gained ARM/Tought... mmm, something is going over my head. That said, if you don't want to play the theme, don't buy them. Skinwalkers: These guys where never hard to kill in mk2 and they aren't now. I played them a lot in mk2 with Morv2 and they never held a zone forever, they died got a few charges because they had the +2 SPD when damaged and got feated on. Now they durdle and get feated for the mini-feat. They get to MAT 8 and POW 14 which is more than out offensive troops but they lost pathfinder... No idea why. Yeah I stopped...really caring about the unit review halfway through. Every single one was just another "hey look, it's this really awful thing and I haven't played it but twice in Mark 3 because it's horrible" and they all started to blur. Definitely don't disagree with your points though.
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