Zuriel & Heavy Nephilim(Minus Azrael)

Zuriel has only found a home in my Twins lists since MK3, although I do like the idea of him with Fyanna2 for high DEF and overtake synergies, or with Kallus2 for Overrun assassination angles. His animus, I think, is undoubtedly not great for an 18 pt character heavy that can be knocked down.


I've tried cooking up some cute lists featuring Zuriel paired with a few Soldiers under a warlock who can buff damage, but in my experience "cute" doesn't work particularly well in Legion, because the powerful lists out there are not cute - they merely crush you under their awesome power. And attempting to eschew a faction weakness through fragile circumstantial interactions hasn't turned out well for me (as you may have surmised).



The combat heavy gap between 13 and 16 points is a real and impactful problem in Legion (you can count the Seraph if you like, but I'm categorizing it as primarily utility). I'm hoping that there's a heavy Nephilim kit on the horizon that will fill at least two of those holes.



From a design perspective, Nephilim have revolved around battle synergies, having things like Overtake, Shield Guard, Precision Strike, Quick Work, Assault, Snipe, Telemetry, and the like - they want to be up there, in the action, and although they are a little inefficient in attrition, we tend to soak some point inflation for circumstantial benefits.



Nephilim are our only beasts that use weapons, so I think that affords some flexibility in their design. Some example concepts for heavies that I could see working include: A Nephilim with dual morning stars that has Combo Smite, a claymore-swinging heavy soldier with Righteous Vengeance, a two-handed axe wielding maniac with brutal charge and cleave, some serious naginata action with Defensive Strike, and one with a bat'leth-looking-thing that has leap and Berserk (how terrifying would that be from the perspective of a foot soldier?). PS-wise, I think at least 15 is necessary for a heavy, with 16 being in a much better place - although its role and circumstantial benefits could push that between 15 and 17.


There's a lot of room for things like Leadership [Nephilim] to help with fury issues, or a healing AOE of some sort, although I'd honestly rather have something that doesn't encourage spamming them. I'm also really intrigued to see more stuff along the lines of the Bloodseer - tapping into the magic that Nephilim seem able to harness; maybe that's where we'll finally get our character heavy for Vayl with Legion's equivalent of the Woldwrath's animus (Druid's Wrath), or just a regular heavy with Legion's version of Purifying Prayer (Brennos), Earth Magic (Bradigus), or Geomancy (Woldwarden - actually, I'm voting for that). 


I'd also dig a light Nephilim with a net and trident, similar to the Buccanneer. I could also see a light or heavy with a fairly massive bow (think Orcs in LotR) that has a higher rate of fire, but maybe relegated to POW 12 or 13. I've really, really been feeling the lack of higher RoF hand cannons in Legion - I'm looking at you, Woldwyrd!

Interesting that you rate Zuriel as an auto-include with the twins, whiskie.

I can never justify him with the twins - even with a dual bond, the fact that the twins have no damage buff makes his pillow-fistedness an immediate disqualification for me. I find my twins lists very tight on points, and they certainly don't have enough fat for a pillow-fisted 18-point utility beast.

-und_ed

I really like the model and wanted to play him with Fyanna as a swap for second Angelius. Maybe not optimal but working, tested 2-3 times and I liked it. Throw him with fury on 2 jacks and cut cortexes. He is easier to kill than serpentine warbeast but still nice.
But then... themes happened. And choice changed from Zuriel vs Angelius and spell martyr to Zuries vs Angelius, spell martyr and 18 free points..

I will be working on twins soon so maybe there. But so far i liked the Blighbringer bulid from unded and he can't fit there.


Ooooor:
When time for crazy test happen: 
conflictchamber.com/#ba1b_-0tfdfuaKaOeKbbbbbbbecob9bkbl



Legion Army - 75 / 75 points

[Theme] Oracles of Annihilation



(Saeryn 2 & Rhyas 2) Saeryn & Rhyas, Talons of Everblight [+24]

- Blightbringer [38]

- Nephilim Protector [10]

- Seraph [14]

- Zuriel [18]

Blighted Nyss Shepherd [1]

Blighted Nyss Shepherd [1]

Blighted Nyss Shepherd [1]

Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion [0(6)]

Spell Martyr [1]

The Forsaken [0(4)]

Blighted Nyss Hex Hunters (max) [15]

- Bayal, Hound of Everblight [0(6)]


Version 2: min hexhunters and BFS

I really like Zuriel with Thagrosh2. He is a swiss army knife of a beast, Manifest destiny tips the balance for one rounding a heavy in most instances, precision strike allows you to cripple key weapons on multiple jacks/beasts, he can rinse infantry with a combo of 2" melee and (if you judge it right) 2x Sprays. 6" plus flight really helps him get out of dodge on feat turn and Mat8 means he rarely needs to boost, making him super fury efficient.

I wrote about my Thags 2 list in the tactics thread started by Lanz, I play a 50pt variant where I will drop Typhon in preference for Big Z.

I like Zuriel, always ran him when I played Saeryn. His Animus isn't good enough. It should be: Evasion. Duration one round or until removed. Target games Dodge, When target is about to be knocked down, may instead remove this spell, ending its effect and stopping the model being knocked down.

He would have to be knocked down twice at least then, and would give our casters a buff really worth casting.

I want to see Legion get any kind of budget heavy that could be reasonably called a Beat Stick. Something akin to a Juggernaut or Nomad. No bells and whistles. Just High P+S and Low Point cost. I do love the Neraph but its really a light warbeast on a large base. I don't expect us to get anything like a Nomad for 11 points (because Fury mechanic) but something with PS17+ for 12-14pts would be a dream come true.

This dream heavy could be a heavy Nephilim, a new beast on the carni chassis, or something else new. I don't care.