Ragnor SotN

1. I'd drop the fell caller. you have a lot of pathfinder from other sources and the feat at least gives you the possibility of an accuracy buff.

2. Doomie3 might have a problem with grymkin because they have the anti-healing arcana, and Ragnar's feat might not be strong enough to overcome grymkin damage output. I know Kolgrima is the answer to everything these days.... but she could be the answer, since horgle might have trouble with shooting lists and control feats. Maybe Guunborne or Grissel 2 could fill that role as well

I would definitely NOT drop the Fell Caller. Fire Eaters don't have Pathfinder and while Relentless Charge is great there are plenty of times where charging isn't an option and you need to get them somewhere. Plus a charge of 8-9 inches is definitely not the same as a run of 10-12.  With your list I really don't like running Fire Eaters without a Pyre to light'em up.

Ragnor in SotN is ironically something I was also playing with a couple days ago (and then subsequently found your other thread).  I was looking at something like: 

conflictchamber.com/#c7201b_-0GfLjniU0hjq6G6T0li-6miZiZ



Trollbloods Army - 75 / 75 points

[Theme] Storm of the North



(Ragnor 1) Ragnor Skysplitter, The Runemaster [+30]

- Dire Troll Brawler [16]

- Rok [19]

- Troll Axer [10]

- Trollkin Runebearer [0(5)]

Fell Caller Hero [0(5)]

Horthol, Long Rider Hero [8]

Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes (max) [9]

- Northkin Elder [3]

Long Riders (max) [20]

Northkin Bear Handle & Battle Bears [10]

Northkin Bear Handle & Battle Bears [10]


I'm going with the idea that I can drop Pulverizer on something and hopefully leave it there for free the majority of the game.  I picked Long Riders and Bears because I wanted things that could maximize on surviving with the feat and still be dangerous.  Brawler can be Pow 19 with an 11 threat or 21 with a 10 inch threat.  Or I can send in Horthol at Pow 19.  Or maybe swap solos around and get Valka in there for some Pow 16 weaponmaster action?  Maybe swap Horthol for 2 Shamans (that's a frequent dilemma for me) if I'm lacking quantity of attacks?

or downgrade the bouncers and the axer to 3 bashers. pow 19 bashers is nothing . to sneeze at and now you have 5 points for your unit and 2 points for a feralgeist

the basher has native pathfinder and can benefit from the northkin elder for speed and thus mitigating the need for the axer.

or keep one bouncer and have 5 points for the unit.

On your third list there it looks like if you drop a Bouncer you can add a 2nd bear unit which lets you take Skaldi free and frees up 4 points. Mist Speaker, Lanyssa, Mauler to Rok... the world is your oyster.

I think if you are going Ragnor in SotN you should really be considering Brawlers and a balanced list. Something like.

Ragnor (SotN)
- Runebearer
- Rok
- Brawler
- Brawler
- Axer
Max Stone + NE
Battle Bears
Battle Bears
Min Longriders
Fell Caller Hero

Nothing in that list is easy to kill on feat turn more importantly the list out threats and alphas most other lists and then is unkillable for a turn.

I think it looks solid.

I really dislike Double Fire eaters without a Pyre Troll though I accept there are other people who disagree with that.

Been thinking about Ragnor and a similar battlegroup lately. I don´t think that a Axer is a good addition to Rök and/or Bashers simply due to the fact that you can´t have both animi on the same model. You either get Rush OR Primal, but not both. Therefore I question the need for an Axer.
That being said, you could drop the Brawler and the Axer and get one additional Basher as well as a Bomber which I think does more for the list. Or you could go with a Mauler, a Bouncer and some Swamp Gobbers instead which also would make your list better IMO.

The battlegroup I have in mind is:
Rök
2 Bashers
2 Winter Trolls

This battlegroup is even less expensive than yours but offers some nice synergies with the Northkin Elder. Though no damge buff for your beasts in melee. That´s what I really don´t like about Trolls right now: you have to decide
wether you go for more speed, +2 damage on warrior models and +2 to cold damage (basically limited to ranged weapons)
OR for +1 damage in melee on everything and some nice immunities as well as anti incorporeal.

If you take the above mentioned battlegroup with a Krielstone Elder you get a P+S 19 Basher under Ragnor, which is pretty fine.

Though the idea behind my thoughts is to get a new form of Meat Mountain. Trolls offer some respectable boxes/points ratios across the different models and the idea is
(1) to get as much boxes as possible
(2) to not neglect damage output (Primal heavily increases the damage output of your warbeasts)
(3) to play the long grindy game (because I do not think that there is a chance to alpha most opponents out there).

That´s why I think Ragnor is a good choice in SotN. He offers even more resillence, has a good toolbox and SotN offers access to Bearhandler & Bears as well as Long Riders which give you the best boxes/points ratio in all of Trollblood´s units: Long Riders are 2 boxes per point and Bears are 2.3 boxes per point (just as a comparison: Champions are roughly 1.6 boxes per point, are slower and offer less ARM).
*Sidenote: Fire Eaters are 2.14 boxes per point, but at ARM 13 they are easily one shotted and therefore can´t contribute to Meat Mountain, though they offer excellent offense, mobility and dude spam removal.

As a further comparison: Bashers are 3.14 boxes per point (best light, light warbeasts have a range of 2 boxes/point up to 3.14 boxes/point), Maulers are 2 boxes/point and Earthborns are roughly 2.3 boxes/point.

Comparing all those values leads to the fact that you either run PoD OR SotN with Bears and Long Riders if you´re heading towards BOXSPAM. The comparison above does not take into account that there are different ARM values (though Long Riders and Bears eventually offer the best ARM values when it comes down to units) which might have an impact on this comparison.

A downside of PoD IMO is the less effective board presence you can reach. SoTN with Bears and Long Riders offers much more maneuverability than PoD, is less reliant on Fury mechanic and offers possibility to spread out your forces.

Well, that´s it for now. I have to think about which warlock is the best for such a Meat Mountain (Madrak1 seems a real contender due to the fact that high DEF + high ARM + massed boxes = one hell to remove; though I don´t like to ride on the mainstream).

ZK

*Sidenote: the other list concept I´m heading towards is massed dude spam based on Fennblades, Kriel Warriors and/or Northkin Raiders. Oh, and there is that "I like to go second"-concept including Bears, Raiders and Fire Eaters in SotN OR Raiders, Fire Eaters and Bushwhackers in KC.

Sorry for that long post.