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Post by smoothcriminal on Aug 25, 2017 16:17:15 GMT
I would play her out of theme for 6. Khador had a long standing problem of not having cheap Faction Shield Guard. Well now we have one and it even gives your out of theme Uhlans/Pikes a +1 to hit.
I think the introduction of Shield Guard leaves us with: no arcnodes, no caster-independent grievous, no caster-independent rfp as the only big meta problems for Khador.
Also don't overvalue the "unkillable" thing. I saw plenty of how similar Menoth dudes work while we tested the exemplar theme. It's worse that it looks on paper, just kill the model with Resolve last. Sure, she'll be ultimate jammer with no sleeping + crit knockdown + long pike (and under I2 you can run her reaaaally far under Solid ground), but don't expect her to live more than a turn in this role.
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Post by khador0932 on Aug 25, 2017 17:03:44 GMT
I think the introduction of Shield Guard leaves us with: no arcnodes, no caster-independent grievous, no caster-independent rfp as the only big meta problems for Khador. I agree with everything else you said, but I'd also like to add "magic weapons" to this list. And if anyone tries to get me to play winds of winter vs ghost fleet I'll throttle them. Maybe when Denny's feat doesn't turn off * attacks and charges, and their Rifles don't ignore the concealment on the outriders.
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Post by smoothcriminal on Aug 25, 2017 18:55:38 GMT
Wolves of winter, duh. I doubt Denny can safely use her pulse feat on ponies that threat from 19" away, they both have 19" so unless she's in front of her army ponies will get a turn of spraying something. And only 1" difference between rifles and ponies threat doesn't make it easy for rifles anymore.
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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Aug 25, 2017 19:10:26 GMT
Wolves of winter, duh. I doubt Denny can safely use her pulse feat on ponies that threat from 19" away, they both have 19" so unless she's in front of her army ponies will get a turn of spraying something. And only 1" difference between rifles and ponies threat doesn't make it easy for rifles anymore. No she outright disables special attacks. They would be utterly neutured in a literal sense.
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Post by khador0932 on Aug 25, 2017 19:17:30 GMT
Wolves of winter, duh. I doubt Denny can safely use her pulse feat on ponies that threat from 19" away, they both have 19" so unless she's in front of her army ponies will get a turn of spraying something. And only 1" difference between rifles and ponies threat doesn't make it easy for rifles anymore. There is very little reason for her not to be in front of her army. It isn't difficult for her to camp through a single round of unboosted pow 12 dmg rolls. Also Denny's feat threatens 21.
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Post by khador0932 on Aug 25, 2017 19:17:57 GMT
Wolves of winter, duh. I doubt Denny can safely use her pulse feat on ponies that threat from 19" away, they both have 19" so unless she's in front of her army ponies will get a turn of spraying something. And only 1" difference between rifles and ponies threat doesn't make it easy for rifles anymore. No she outright disables special attacks. They would be utterly neutured in a literal sense. I think Zerkova2's feat allows you to cast spells without making a *attack.
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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Aug 25, 2017 19:21:33 GMT
No she outright disables special attacks. They would be utterly neutured in a literal sense. I think Zerkova2's feat allows you to cast spells without making a *attack. Thats kinda a last ditch sputter when your everything else is neutered as well. I dont see any "true potential" for Z2 at all.
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Post by khador0932 on Aug 25, 2017 19:49:17 GMT
I think Zerkova2's feat allows you to cast spells without making a *attack. Thats kinda a last ditch sputter when your everything else is neutered as well. I dont see any "true potential" for Z2 at all. I agree. I don't see how Winds of Winter is ever our Ghost Fleet answer. I would like some kind of solo like Cryx just got (now they have 2 models that give magic weapons....) that can hopefully let us deal with Incorporeal from within our good themes.
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Post by Netherby on Aug 25, 2017 19:57:12 GMT
She is only fine at 6 points if you think Eyriss is fine at 7 points or that MoW Kovnik is totally worth 5 points... Or that Koldun Lord, totally worth 4 points right?
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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Aug 25, 2017 20:06:41 GMT
She is only fine at 6 points if you think Eyriss is fine at 7 points or that MoW Kovnik is totally worth 5 points... Or that Koldun Lord, totally worth 4 points right? So what cost do you think Solos should have?
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Post by smoothcriminal on Aug 26, 2017 1:35:33 GMT
No she outright disables special attacks. They would be utterly neutured in a literal sense. She disables only what she catches in a feat. Just position ponies outside 19" from her and she'll never catch them before they have a turn of spraying. She is only fine at 6 points if you think Eyriss is fine at 7 points or that MoW Kovnik is totally worth 5 points... Or that Koldun Lord, totally worth 4 points right? I think Bokur is fine at 5 points an she's like a Bokur that gives fangs +1 to hit on top.
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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Aug 26, 2017 1:41:39 GMT
No she outright disables special attacks. They would be utterly neutured in a literal sense. She disables only what she catches in a feat. Just position ponies outside 19" from her and she'll never catch them before they have a turn of spraying Um. She has a Feat Range of 14 Inches. Then she can move for 7 inches. Which is 21. Then she can also fail a charge at 24. Or feat then run (I believe) at 28. Sorry. Even with low effort, she outthreatens the ponies and seriously outthreatens them if she wants to.
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Post by ankiseth on Aug 26, 2017 2:53:53 GMT
Um. She has a Feat Range of 14 Inches. Then she can move for 7 inches. Which is 21. Then she can also fail a charge at 24. Or feat then run (I believe) at 28. Sorry. Even with low effort, she outthreatens the ponies and seriously outthreatens them if she wants to. Most of this is wrong. You can't feat and run on same turn. And her feat is a pulse, not an aura, so she can't feat and then fail a charge to extend the range.
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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Aug 26, 2017 3:10:57 GMT
[Most of this is wrong. You can't feat and run on same turn. And her feat is a pulse, not an aura, so she can't feat and then fail a charge to extend the range. Correct. But her regular threat range is still 21. And that's still massive.
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Post by thebuoyancyofwater on Aug 26, 2017 8:23:43 GMT
Outriders with Zerkova2 threat 26 currently. Against a stealthed model, Aiyana threats 20 with Kiss, and Zerkova can tag a stealthed model with her stationary spell through an outrider arc node from 23 away from where her arc node starts the turn. These threat ranges are all potentially going to increase by 2 if the theme keeps the apparation bonus.
Cheers, Dave
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