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Post by sand20go on Aug 21, 2017 21:05:25 GMT
I honestly want just ONE benefit - Pathfinder on Man of War units. I mean we could get ridiculous stuff (prey on the bombers, vengenance on the shocks) but I just want to be able to take ALL the casters in bullpen without having to worry about the saxon tax/being slow as mud in a crowded SR 2017 environment.
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Post by smoothcriminal on Aug 21, 2017 21:28:01 GMT
I just want it to come out, it's been a year without mow theme. It can has zero abilities except solos for 20pt of mows and I will still play it and it probably would be good. They can revert mows to mk2 stats and themes and I would still play it.
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Post by thebuoyancyofwater on Aug 21, 2017 21:42:01 GMT
+2" deployment and MoW models gain Wall of Steel for me Then usual free stuff.
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Post by zerosequence on Aug 21, 2017 22:17:32 GMT
Man o war models gain Vengence.
Man o war units get 10 boxes each.
+2 deployment zone
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Post by BarbeChenue on Aug 22, 2017 1:26:19 GMT
I actually care more for the CID than the theme. MoWs, as of now, don't really do so well do they? Making an 'imba' theme only to make them somewhat playable doesn't interest me. The models have to stand on their own.
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Post by jonnyboy on Aug 22, 2017 1:34:42 GMT
I think shocktroopers are already pretty great and stand on their own. The demolition corps doesn't hold a position in the army, great bears do them better and the bombadiers are just very lack luster. I agree that they need to be fixed over a theme.
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Post by Cryptix on Aug 22, 2017 1:37:00 GMT
They're really easy fixes too.
Demo Corps get either Rapid Strike or that rule for extra damage vs constructs.
Bombadier get that weird error fixed where they're different than literally every other Bombard in the army.
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Post by Blargaliscious on Aug 22, 2017 3:13:58 GMT
I want the Demolition Corps and the Bombardiers to be good for their points without a Command Attachment, and then a CA for each that makes them great like the Shocktroopers.
I want the Assault Kommandos to be good for their points without a Command Attachment, and then a CA that makes them great.
Everything else is gravy...
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Post by borderprince on Aug 22, 2017 4:15:25 GMT
Agreed that the CiD will be more important than the theme itself.
For the theme: +2" Deployment seems likely and would be handy.
I don't think anything can be done to make MoW in general tougher (either increased ARM or boxes) - they are already tougher than other medium-based warriors (especially with repair).
Maybe something like small and medium-based casters and solos gain Wall of Steel [Man of War]
Possibly a boost to repair rolls to really keep the army going against lower pow attacks.
I'd quite like MoW models to gain access to Trample attacks to get that 'mini-warjack' feel.
For specific models: MoW Bombardiers - decide what they are for and rebuild for that. Are they for firing hard-hitting rockets? Probably Brutal Damage. Are they for crowd control? Up the AoE and/or add High Explosive, maybe change critical shred for Cleave (additional attack on kill).
I'd hope for crowd control, as this theme is going to be light on models.
MoW Demo Corps - Vengeance.
MoW Shocktroopers - I really like as is. With the Officer and Kovnik, they do really well as the impenetrable, immovable wall.
MoW Kovnik - do something about the Jack Marshal ability. Ditch it, or give a useful drive (Off Road [pathfinder + reposition] or Shield Guard would both be nice).
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kaos
Junior Strategist
Posts: 268
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Post by kaos on Aug 22, 2017 5:28:53 GMT
Demo corps with bombard stats would be interest8, they could cra for pow 19. Brutal damage even better, but I doubt they will ever give them a super accurate brutal damage shot at pow 17. Even if, thinking about it, it's what a standard heavy cygnar jack does usually.
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Post by droopingpuppy on Aug 22, 2017 6:23:17 GMT
Demo corps with bombard stats would be interest8, they could cra for pow 19. Brutal damage even better, but I doubt they will ever give them a super accurate brutal damage shot at pow 17. Even if, thinking about it, it's what a standard heavy cygnar jack does usually. Also it outclass anti armor Weapon Crew units as well. I don't think that give them Brutal Damage would happen - although their RNG is still inferior to them. What I can imagine is.... Man-o-War Kovnik: Give Tactician[Man-o-War] and Drive: Reposition[5"]. -I know that he is already good, but as a focal point of Man-o-War someone needs to have this. Also, Reposition on warjack means that your 50mm based warjack is no longer block the charge line of your Man-o-War after it charges the enemy. Man-o-War Bombadiers: Increase RNG of Grenade Cannon by 14. Give Gang. -Although Man-o-War Shocktrooper have the similar melee damage output, but their weapon has RNG 2 while Bombardiers have RNG 1, and the Shocktrooper have much higher ARM. So I think that it is fine to give them enough melee capability. RNG 14 would be a life quality buff. Man-o-War Demolition Corps: Give Tactical Flexiblity that has Rapid Strike, Fleet and Rise. -So, they can either hit harder, move faster, or don't neutralized by AOE knockdown effect. And for the theme.... what about Accumulator[Man-o-War] on the warjacks? Perhaps they are inspired by their smaller cousin side by side with them. Because 'Jack Marshal is quite usable if the marshaled warjack has one or more focus points, it also give a uses for Kovnik's 'Jack Marshal quality.
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Post by Soul Samurai on Aug 22, 2017 7:23:24 GMT
Man-o-War Kovnik: Give Tactician[Man-o-War] and Drive: Reposition[5"]. I don't think SPD 4 jacks will get Reposition [5]. Maybe Reposition [3], which I would love to see. I don't think that would be too powerful, even taking into account the Kodiak cloud? Man-o-War Bombadiers: Increase RNG of Grenade Cannon by 14. Give Gang. I would love to see a range increase for the Bombardiers. A slightly more conservative option could be to give the them the "Steam Pressure" rule from the mule, so they go up to RNG 14 if they aim; this way their overall threat range is the same, but they have a possibility of shooting models from outside of charge range. OR just give them Assault; both their threat range and their melee output would be buffed this way. And for the theme.... what about Accumulator[Man-o-War] on the warjacks? Sorry, I don't see this for thematic reasons and practical ones: the theme needs reasons to take MOW, not reasons to take more warjacks. So one thing that I would like to see is the Bombardier's melee weapon get buffed; it's a frikkin' chainsaw, it should have SOME sort of real advantage over the bog-standard halberds that the Shocktroopers are carrying. Higher P+S, maybe multiple attacks (that don't rely on crits) where each attack is more powerful than the last (to represent the chainsaw cutting deeper and deeper into the enemy), something.
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Post by thebuoyancyofwater on Aug 22, 2017 11:14:37 GMT
Man-o-War Kovnik: Give Tactician[Man-o-War] and Drive: Reposition[5"]. I don't think SPD 4 jacks will get Reposition [5]. Maybe Reposition [3], which I would love to see. I don't think that would be too powerful, even taking into account the Kodiak cloud? Given Harkevich has that as a field marshal ability, I'd say it's 1) not broken and 2) not likely to be the theme benefit. Cheers, Dave
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Post by Soul Samurai on Aug 22, 2017 11:21:46 GMT
Given Harkevich has that as a field marshal ability, I'd say it's 1) not broken and 2) not likely to be the theme benefit. Cheers, Dave Just because it's not broken with Hark doesn't mean it won't be broken with some other casters. Off the top of my head I can't think of any way that it would be though. I see what you mean about not being a theme benefit, for some reason I interpreted the original suggestion as just being a full-time change to the MOW Kovnik.
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Post by borderprince on Aug 22, 2017 12:19:59 GMT
I see what you mean about not being a theme benefit, for some reason I interpreted the original suggestion as just being a full-time change to the MOW Kovnik. Probably because it was! Chainsaw type weapons have two different benefits in game: Shred - bonus attack vs the target hit. Used on the Renegade and MoW Bombardiers Sustained Attack - subsequent attacks automatically hit. Used on the Decimator (and so Torch), Deathripper and Renegade Sustained Attack would be worthless on Bombardiers without continuing to have Shred (either automatically or as a critical). Could perhaps have Shred with Critical Sustained Attack. IK chainsaws at present don't seem to get more powerful, but they can be more accurate (which probably represents the cutting in place). Personally I'd rather have the Bombardier chainsaw as the zombie-horde thinning type (so not just multiple attacks against the same target), but I'll take what I can get. Would Dual Attack and/or Point Blank be worth considering for Bombardiers?
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