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Post by lordvader on Aug 16, 2017 16:07:04 GMT
So, I've been playing since mk2 and never put her on the table at all... I was looking for some advice on how to build for her at 75 points (without owning any Hellmouths, only 1 unit of Swordsmen, and no warlords - my wife and I prefer to not proxy if we can help it).
Thanks much :-)
Vader
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thelat
Junior Strategist
Posts: 480 
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Post by thelat on Aug 16, 2017 16:55:21 GMT
She has a really good spell list. The feat, not so much. I think the best way to run the feat is by running Blight Wasps up to hard targets to enable swordsman to get 5d6 on the charge.
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Post by lordvader on Aug 16, 2017 17:28:03 GMT
She has a really good spell list. The feat, not so much. I think the best way to run the feat is by running Blight Wasps up to hard targets to enable swordsman to get 5d6 on the charge. Hmm, I've never really had much success with the wasps, even with Abby2 or Thagrosh2. Does she have any other fun interactions or combos? Should she stay melded for most/all of the game, or should she use Belphagor as an arc node? I'm also kinda looking for things like general tactics for her. |
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Post by ForEver_Blight on Aug 16, 2017 17:28:46 GMT
truthfully, if you truly have never played her before... I'd tell you to come up with your own idea and put it on the table. Failure is a valuable educator.
Basic tips. 2" reach warbeasts (Soldier, Bloodseer, Scythean, Angelius, even stingers) will help enable the feat. Swordsmen are fantastic but you have to keep them alive. Ashen veil is the only way she has and it's no guarantee. Hex Hunters under Ashen veil will grant them stealth. With Bayal they can help swordsmen hit.
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Post by davycannonhound on Aug 16, 2017 18:14:44 GMT
Bethayne herself (including while flesh melded) can benefit from the feat. With Invocation of Flesh up, she'll hit pretty hard. You'll want a teraph (ranged threat, GREAT target for blood thorn), a raek or two (tagging things' back arcs for more room up front for units), a pack of blight wasps for cheap enablers, and maybe a nephilim swordsmen or two. While slow, ogrun have a 2" melee reach to help with finding landing zones on the feat, as do legionnaires. Swordsmen will hit a lot harder than those two options, but at the price of less range on their melee. Even with belphegor as an arc node, you'll want a couple of spell martyrs for arcing while flesh melded.
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thelat
Junior Strategist
Posts: 480
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Post by thelat on Aug 16, 2017 19:25:42 GMT
Blood Thorn goes very well on the Strider Scouts and Blighted Nyss Archers. Cloak Of Ash fits perfectly on the Hex Hunters, as it gives them stealth and raises their defense in melee to 16 against living. Bring a couple spare arc nodes in case you're keeping Bethayne safe in Belphagor. That will generally solve infantry problems. From there, it's up to you to figure out how you're going to crack armor. Disintegrate helps.
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Post by cainuslupus on Aug 16, 2017 22:05:56 GMT
I believe Ravens is good tier for her. Having access to Wasps and Stealth units/solos is probably more reluable than 5d6 Swordsmen flanking Soldiers.
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Post by lordvader on Aug 16, 2017 22:46:52 GMT
Sweet. I appreciate the replies. I hadn't really looked at RoW as a theme for her, either... was mostly looking at the OoA one instead. I may play around with that theme and see what weirdness I can come up with.
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Post by cainuslupus on Aug 17, 2017 10:34:11 GMT
Sweet. I appreciate the replies. I hadn't really looked at RoW as a theme for her, either... was mostly looking at the OoA one instead. I may play around with that theme and see what weirdness I can come up with. If you plan to built in RoW I would look at: - Wasps as Feat enablers - Raptors - Scouts to apply Blood Thorn - Blightblades - Raiders - Deathstalkers (Mat9 Weaponmasters). Raptors + Raiders + BB = 2 free solos. |
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bward
Junior Strategist
Posts: 184
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Post by bward on Aug 17, 2017 15:09:06 GMT
I can't remember where... but I swear Pagani said she will be getting a complete overhaul in CID when they do Ogrun (in the next 1-2 months). Now that is no reason to not play her now, but seeing what they did to Kraye/Madrak1, she may be totally different (for the better) when this is all said and done.
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Post by ForEver_Blight on Aug 17, 2017 15:50:19 GMT
I can't remember where... but I swear Pagani said she will be getting a complete overhaul in CID when they do Ogrun (in the next 1-2 months). Now that is no reason to not play her now, but seeing what they did to Kraye/Madrak1, she may be totally different (for the better) when this is all said and done. [citation needed] please I've not heard anything of the sort and Bethayne has no hint as being related to Ogrun. Now that's not to say it's impossible. Kraye wasn't a trencher oriented caster but he got included. So maybe ? She's by no means bad right now. But again, a caster that stand up on infantry in a faction of middle-of-the-road infantry... Eitherway I've played her less than a handful of times and she's pretty capable. If I had to rate her it'd be a solid 7 out of 10. But I've main Kryssa so much I've gotten attached and Beth kind of sorta does a similar list as I already play with Kryssa. So it doesn't really grab my interest to often. But she makes a perfectly capable CotD caster. Soldiers and Bloodseers do wonders for her feat. Specifically the bloodseer; engaging models for Hex hunters to flank, then battle wizard to models in the effect of telemetry. It's amazing if you can get the right targets and positioning. Soldiers charge in and scalpel out movement (I know, how dare I not aim for the cortex) giving the flank models (in my case Legionnaires) easy hits and of course weapon master dmg rolls. Now something I did learn that changes her a TON that she could not do in MK2. You can drop OUT of Belphagor during maintenance. This is Huge! especially on feat turn if you want to optimize the work output. Belphagor can move into melee and take all of his attacks/boosts/powerattack/what have you then Beth can charge and get her flank bonus. Then meld at the end of her activation (clearing the fury from Belphagor). This gives her a good bit more capability and gives Belphagor something to do other than lose his activation for the rest of the game. It makes her such an active caster than I'm down right jealous that our other casters can't do anything nearly that cool. Now granted outside of feat turn she's not putting out a ton of damage, and often you want her to spam disintegration more than you want he to buy attacks. But you still it's not something to write off. Though once Golab comes out. Holy balls. Belphagor does w/e within 6" behind, Bethayne charges, kills a model, cast spells, Invocation of blood to walk back to Belphagor, Meld, cast sprint animus, walk away like a boss. You can move her 11" away from wherever she was doing work. For a non-cavalry model that's a long walk. |
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Post by rhonlore on Aug 17, 2017 16:27:38 GMT
Though once Golab comes out. Holy balls. Belphagor does w/e within 6" behind, Bethayne charges, kills a model, cast spells, Invocation of blood to walk back to Belphagor, Meld, cast sprint animus, walk away like a boss. You can move her 11" away from wherever she was doing work. For a non-cavalry model that's a long walk. I don't believe this will work. You essentially end your activation when you meld because Bethayne gets removed from the table. While you could cast sprint before melding, Belphagor didn't activate and kill anything. |
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Post by ForEver_Blight on Aug 17, 2017 16:35:15 GMT
Though once Golab comes out. Holy balls. Belphagor does w/e within 6" behind, Bethayne charges, kills a model, cast spells, Invocation of blood to walk back to Belphagor, Meld, cast sprint animus, walk away like a boss. You can move her 11" away from wherever she was doing work. For a non-cavalry model that's a long walk. I don't believe this will work. You essentially end your activation when you meld because Bethayne gets removed from the table. While you could cast sprint before melding, Belphagor didn't activate and kill anything. hmmm... I swear that melding doesn't immediately end her activation but I don't have that wall-o-text in front of me. But if that is the case, I don't think having Belphagor kill something would trigger it either, since his activation already ended. Crap. I've got to re-read that card. I was really hoping that was going to be a thing. We've been Cryx'd (the joke that "if you think something is cool, reread it, it doesn't work") |
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Post by ForEver_Blight on Aug 17, 2017 16:39:21 GMT
Online Card database, you are helpful!
4th sentence of Flesh Meld reads:
"Any effects on Bethayne when she melds are applied to Belphagor"
I think that means it "should" work. the animus would carry over. Also doesn't say it ends Bethayne's activation. Just specifies Belphagor cannot activate later that turn.
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bward
Junior Strategist
Posts: 184
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Post by bward on Aug 17, 2017 16:53:54 GMT
I can't remember where... but I swear Pagani said she will be getting a complete overhaul in CID when they do Ogrun (in the next 1-2 months). Now that is no reason to not play her now, but seeing what they did to Kraye/Madrak1, she may be totally different (for the better) when this is all said and done. [citation needed] please I've not heard anything of the sort and Bethayne has no hint as being related to Ogrun. Now that's not to say it's impossible. Kraye wasn't a trencher oriented caster but he got included. So maybe ? She's by no means bad right now. But again, a caster that stand up on infantry in a faction of middle-of-the-road infantry... Eitherway I've played her less than a handful of times and she's pretty capable. If I had to rate her it'd be a solid 7 out of 10. But I've main Kryssa so much I've gotten attached and Beth kind of sorta does a similar list as I already play with Kryssa. So it doesn't really grab my interest to often. But she makes a perfectly capable CotD caster. Soldiers and Bloodseers do wonders for her feat. Specifically the bloodseer; engaging models for Hex hunters to flank, then battle wizard to models in the effect of telemetry. It's amazing if you can get the right targets and positioning. Soldiers charge in and scalpel out movement (I know, how dare I not aim for the cortex) giving the flank models (in my case Legionnaires) easy hits and of course weapon master dmg rolls. Now something I did learn that changes her a TON that she could not do in MK2. You can drop OUT of Belphagor during maintenance. This is Huge! especially on feat turn if you want to optimize the work output. Belphagor can move into melee and take all of his attacks/boosts/powerattack/what have you then Beth can charge and get her flank bonus. Then meld at the end of her activation (clearing the fury from Belphagor). This gives her a good bit more capability and gives Belphagor something to do other than lose his activation for the rest of the game. It makes her such an active caster than I'm down right jealous that our other casters can't do anything nearly that cool. Now granted outside of feat turn she's not putting out a ton of damage, and often you want her to spam disintegration more than you want he to buy attacks. But you still it's not something to write off. Though once Golab comes out. Holy balls. Belphagor does w/e within 6" behind, Bethayne charges, kills a model, cast spells, Invocation of blood to walk back to Belphagor, Meld, cast sprint animus, walk away like a boss. You can move her 11" away from wherever she was doing work. For a non-cavalry model that's a long walk. Typically when someone leads off with "I can't remember where" it means they don't have the citation. But must have been FB since it wasn't here and that's my only other platform for legion discussion. Kraye wasn't a trencher and madrak1 wasn't northkin. CID is used as a platform to tune any model that isn't performing the way it was intended to. |
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