npe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 221
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Post by npe on Aug 9, 2017 15:25:03 GMT
So, what lists have you guys been playing? I've been practicing: Sturgis2 (+31) - Deathripper - 6 - Inflictor - 13 - Inflictor - 13 - Reaper - 13 Satyxis Raiders - 16 - Sea Witch - 3 Blood Witches - 13 - Blood Hag - 4 Ragman - 4 Aiakos - 4 - Stalker - Stalker If you can try Sturgis out in Dark Host with two Desecrators. I really enjoy him there.
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Kavrae
Junior Strategist
Posts: 182
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Post by Kavrae on Aug 9, 2017 15:55:42 GMT
Just won a local game with a hodgepodge list of things I have that aren't stuck on the painting table or in a box. Crushed his Croe's Cutthroats with my Bane Riders (impact attack alone took out 4 of them). Satyxis jammed up his 5 or 6 warjacks for a turn, until they got threshed by a Mangler. Wraith Engine kept the Banes alive; seriously, most things lived by 1 or 2 points of damage. Deneghra popped Feat to tie the jacks up even more. Won on scenario. It was a weird game.
Warwitch Deneghra Theme: None Defiler Nightwretch Inflictor Wraith Engine Bane Riders Max Unit Bane Warriors Max Unit + UA Satyxis Raiders Max Unit + UA
Next I'm going to try out a Skarre1 + double WE Dark Host list that someone suggested.
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Post by tesoe on Aug 9, 2017 16:14:01 GMT
So, what lists have you guys been playing? I've been practicing: Sturgis2 (+31) - Deathripper - 6 - Inflictor - 13 - Inflictor - 13 - Reaper - 13 Satyxis Raiders - 16 - Sea Witch - 3 Blood Witches - 13 - Blood Hag - 4 Ragman - 4 Aiakos - 4 - Stalker - Stalker If you can try Sturgis out in Dark Host with two Desecrators. I really enjoy him there. Why Sturgis? I'm not really seeing what he brings to the list besides being a sorta super bane himself. Which admittedly is pretty thematic.
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Post by tiberius on Aug 9, 2017 18:42:39 GMT
I personally think Sturgis is a good caster for Dark Host, banes hunt and eat most heavies (even more so with parasite) and Sturgis's feat destroys most infantry and feats his jacks to do even more. Boosted well placed scathers sound pretty scary to a bunch of grouped up stuff. At least that is what I am seeing.
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npe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 221
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Post by npe on Aug 9, 2017 18:52:22 GMT
If you can try Sturgis out in Dark Host with two Desecrators. I really enjoy him there. Why Sturgis? I'm not really seeing what he brings to the list besides being a sorta super bane himself. Which admittedly is pretty thematic. Sturgis2 doesn't have ghost walk, so ghostly is great with him. Occultation gives you more flexibility with how you use prowl and his feat lets you get threat extension and potentially deal with stuff that your non magic weapons don't help with. Personally he loves the wraith engine (arm 19 with parasite out) and Darragh. He can also hide around the clouds. tldr; He's got a tool kit that fits very nice with Dark Host.
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npe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 221
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Post by npe on Aug 9, 2017 18:52:59 GMT
I personally think Sturgis is a good caster for Dark Host, banes hunt and eat most heavies (even more so with parasite) and Sturgis's feat destroys most infantry and feats his jacks to do even more. Boosted well placed scathers sound pretty scary to a bunch of grouped up stuff. At least that is what I am seeing. I dragged a bunch of strider scouts and nightstalkers into a scather the other day. It was glorious.
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Post by grotsnik on Sept 1, 2017 20:00:21 GMT
So, ive read through the post and was surprised with the denny2 optimism... is this working for you? My reassoning: 1. You can make biles out of mcthralls, ok its kinda nice, but those model cant attack,and biles are so slow, the problem of delivery is still their weakness, and its not that they are hard to kill or anything 2. Why denny 2? If you need a def debuff why not go denny 1? You apply -2def instantly, and -2spd that cant be shaken (along with all the other stats), if you purge infantry theyll die, purge beasts/heavies and will shake the shadow bind. I find it very hard to go denny2 over denny1, only thing I find going for her is hellmouth... and maybe shadowbind a battle engine thats too far to shoot when it activates. Really, given feats like sorscha's, kreoss', emorghoul's I dont see why denny cant get her old feat back (shakeable obviously)
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npe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 221
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Post by npe on Sept 1, 2017 20:32:52 GMT
So, ive read through the post and was surprised with the denny2 optimism... is this working for you? My reassoning: 1. You can make biles out of mcthralls, ok its kinda nice, but those model cant attack,and biles are so slow, the problem of delivery is still their weakness, and its not that they are hard to kill or anything 2. Why denny 2? If you need a def debuff why not go denny 1? You apply -2def instantly, and -2spd that cant be shaken (along with all the other stats), if you purge infantry theyll die, purge beasts/heavies and will shake the shadow bind. I find it very hard to go denny2 over denny1, only thing I find going for her is hellmouth... and maybe shadowbind a battle engine thats too far to shoot when it activates. Really, given feats like sorscha's, kreoss', emorghoul's I dont see why denny cant get her old feat back (shakeable obviously) 1. Biles hide behind the sepulcher and if necessary purge through it. 2. Denny2's feat is much longer ranged than Denny1's and Denny2 is much more survivable. Denny2's toolkit is also much better suited to winning in the ghost fleet mirror match as well.
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Post by grotsnik on Sept 1, 2017 21:03:52 GMT
Biles can hide behind a colossal yeah, you still have to go around it when you want to shoot, and so they have a very short threat, sure you can purge jam, you were able to do that before too. I conceed you can find some ways around to use them though. Denny2s feat makes no sense, hit infantry and you kill it, hit beasts/jacks they shake shadow bind, are there things that will suffer from it? Yeah, are those cases common enough to be worth a feat? I dont think so. (Im not saying I have the absolute truth, im just arguing why I think she is kinda UP compared to other choices, its in my best intrest to be proven wrong as I want to find reasons to play her)
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npe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 221
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Post by npe on Sept 1, 2017 21:24:59 GMT
Biles can hide behind a colossal yeah, you still have to go around it when you want to shoot, and so they have a very short threat, sure you can purge jam, you were able to do that before too. I conceed you can find some ways around to use them though. Denny2s feat makes no sense, hit infantry and you kill it, hit beasts/jacks they shake shadow bind, are there things that will suffer from it? Yeah, are those cases common enough to be worth a feat? I dont think so. (Im not saying I have the absolute truth, im just arguing why I think she is kinda UP compared to other choices, its in my best intrest to be proven wrong as I want to find reasons to play her) The difference is that your purges not only unjam the colossal they also take high def things that the colossal would struggle to hit (warpwolves/angeliuses) and make them tractable. I've played "hide your biles" with Infernal Machines with 3 casters now (Denny2, Morty2 and Agathia) and it's been very effective. The biles are safe, and prevent your opponent from jamming the sepulcher. I view blades of shadow as a free boost on the attack roll after the first hit. McThralls go up to mat 8 and become credible threats for taking out heavies. Wraith Engines go up to mat 10 and the Sepulcher to rat 8 which makes them credible assassination threats as well. Play a few games with it and I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.
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Deller
Junior Strategist
I’m on a Boat
Posts: 605
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Post by Deller on Sept 1, 2017 21:37:53 GMT
Deneghra2 niche is that she's really good for the mirror match. Marked for Death strips away most of Cryx's defensive buffs and Hellmouth churns infantry to death while RFPing them. If Cryx is getting big in your meta Deneghra2 is one of our best options for dealing with ourselves while also being able to play into other faction's infantry centric builds.
Yes, her feat is garbage. It's unlikely it'll ever accomplish much. Influence & Persuit are meh spells, and it's unlikely you'll cast them. The other 4 spells on her list make her playable into most of the field.
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npe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 221
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Post by npe on Sept 1, 2017 22:22:17 GMT
Deneghra2 niche is that she's really good for the mirror match. Marked for Death strips away most of Cryx's defensive buffs and Hellmouth churns infantry to death while RFPing them. If Cryx is getting big in your meta Deneghra2 is one of our best options for dealing with ourselves while also being able to play into other faction's infantry centric builds. Yes, her feat is garbage. It's unlikely it'll ever accomplish much. Influence & Persuit are meh spells, and it's unlikely you'll cast them. The other 4 spells on her list make her playable into most of the field. Her feat turns leviathans or sepulchers into very effective ranged assassins. It's (or the threat of it) has done what it's needed to in almost every game. It's not Mk2 level powerful, but it's not useless either.
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Post by grotsnik on Sept 1, 2017 22:57:44 GMT
Yes, her feat is garbage. It's unlikely it'll ever accomplish much. Influence & Persuit are meh spells, and it's unlikely you'll cast them. The other 4 spells on her list make her playable into most of the field. This is it, compared to denny1 you also get a def debuff, you also get an arm debuff and you also get venom so... is a thing of hellmouth vs a feat+ghost walk+scourge (yes I know curse of shadows is not the same as parasite and that marked for death is not the same as cripling grasp, but they are somewhat comparable IMO) Thats why I said that hellmouth is the only thing going for her (which is not to be underestimate), and yes, she might be more survivable, so... idk she just seems inferior to other choices IMO, still casting hellmouths us fun lol
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npe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 221
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Post by npe on Sept 1, 2017 23:38:31 GMT
Yes, her feat is garbage. It's unlikely it'll ever accomplish much. Influence & Persuit are meh spells, and it's unlikely you'll cast them. The other 4 spells on her list make her playable into most of the field. This is it, compared to denny1 you also get a def debuff, you also get an arm debuff and you also get venom so... is a thing of hellmouth vs a feat+ghost walk+scourge (yes I know curse of shadows is not the same as parasite and that marked for death is not the same as cripling grasp, but they are somewhat comparable IMO) Thats why I said that hellmouth is the only thing going for her (which is not to be underestimate), and yes, she might be more survivable, so... idk she just seems inferior to other choices IMO, still casting hellmouths us fun lol Until you play her you won't understand what she brings to the table. She's a lot of fun in Dark Host (double desecrators for feat application) and also in Infernal Machines (Sepulcher + 2 necrosurgeon recursipalooza). After a few games with both lists under your belt you'll have a much deeper feel for her kit.
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Deller
Junior Strategist
I’m on a Boat
Posts: 605
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Post by Deller on Sept 2, 2017 0:04:51 GMT
Yes, her feat is garbage. It's unlikely it'll ever accomplish much. Influence & Persuit are meh spells, and it's unlikely you'll cast them. The other 4 spells on her list make her playable into most of the field. This is it, compared to denny1 you also get a def debuff, you also get an arm debuff and you also get venom so... is a thing of hellmouth vs a feat+ghost walk+scourge (yes I know curse of shadows is not the same as parasite and that marked for death is not the same as cripling grasp, but they are somewhat comparable IMO) Thats why I said that hellmouth is the only thing going for her (which is not to be underestimate), and yes, she might be more survivable, so... idk she just seems inferior to other choices IMO, still casting hellmouths us fun lol It's garbage compared to every feat in the game. Deneghra2 niche is that she's really good for the mirror match. Marked for Death strips away most of Cryx's defensive buffs and Hellmouth churns infantry to death while RFPing them. If Cryx is getting big in your meta Deneghra2 is one of our best options for dealing with ourselves while also being able to play into other faction's infantry centric builds. Yes, her feat is garbage. It's unlikely it'll ever accomplish much. Influence & Persuit are meh spells, and it's unlikely you'll cast them. The other 4 spells on her list make her playable into most of the field. Her feat turns leviathans or sepulchers into very effective ranged assassins. It's (or the threat of it) has done what it's needed to in almost every game. It's not Mk2 level powerful, but it's not useless either. Web of Shadows is only good in a single situation and that is -3 defense during assassination runs. If that's not what you're doing you may as well never pop it because, yes, the threat of shadow bind is stronger then the effect itself. When a feat is better off never being used 99% of the time, it's a bad feat. Deneghra1&3 both bring Scourge & Goreshade3's feat applies Stationary both of which are much better at assassination especially in the context of their full ability load out. You want to Shoot people to death with jacks you can just bring Skarre2 who has Black Spot & Future Sight, Mortenebra1 with Tune Up, Sac Lamb, & Feat Rerolls, and Soon Skarre3 with Guided Fire. We have many more casters who do a better job of turning our ranged jacks into assassins. It's not a good reason to play Deneghra2. Deneghra2's only selling points are Curse of Shadows, Hellmouth, Marked for Death, Venom, & Wraith Walker and the fact that 3/5 of those are absolutely devastating into the Cryx mirror.
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