|
Post by hocestbellum on Oct 11, 2018 15:35:09 GMT
I don't actually play CoC, I'm more of an interested bystander (if I ever get a second faction it's a fight between Convergence and Legion), but I'm not getting where it's competing? If you've got 60 points of units, that still leaves room for all four foundries and two Frustrum with an admittedly small amount of wiggle room.
The bigger problem to my mind would be two of the last three CIDs releasing models with 10" 'Screw you, Foundry' bubbles.
|
|
bundeez
Junior Strategist
Posts: 325
|
Post by bundeez on Oct 12, 2018 10:10:35 GMT
You are correct, it's fairly easy to squeeze 2 of them in a list, but that's not the problem.
The problem is CL. The troops don't hit hard enough or survive very well. So you are stuck with 1 tactical option left: Jam and hope you win on scenario before your army is attritioned down. That might succeed sometimes on spread the net or mirage, but more often than not (in my experience), you never reach that goal before time runs out or your dudes are gone.
The new solo doesn't help with that.
But yeah Direct Spirits kicks Enigma Foudnry right in the *****. Which is the only good thing about that theme, recursion. Without it? gg...
|
|
|
Post by hocestbellum on Oct 12, 2018 10:25:05 GMT
Pursuant to that: Couple more updates from the CID forum; they're looking at the Foundry too, or specifically Reconstruction. They are testing the current wording:
Reconstruction - During your Maintenance Phase you may remove one soul token from this model to return one destroyed medium-based friendly Faction construct Grunt to play, or remove up to three soul tokens from this model to return one destroyed small-based friendly Faction construct Grunt to play for each token removed. Place each returned Grunt completely within 2˝ of this model, in formation, and within 3˝ of another model in its unit.
So it isn't an action any more, and the returned models will still get their combat actions now. If they are medium based they can make their CWL Vengeance moves, although the proximity to the Foundry will presumably limit that.
Additionally, PPS_Pagini said that they could probably address the Transverse Enumerator cancelling the Vengeance benefit of CWL for medium based units, although at time of writing there hasn't been a change.
|
|
bundeez
Junior Strategist
Posts: 325
|
Post by bundeez on Oct 12, 2018 10:42:57 GMT
Fantastic! Now they just need to change completely within 2'' to CMD and they are golden With only CMD 7 on most of the units, applying the ability has allways been annoying.
|
|
|
Post by hocestbellum on Oct 12, 2018 11:41:12 GMT
I'd be surprised to see CMD, as that + Vengeance is the exact combination that got nerfed off of the Supreme Guardian. It was allowing models to be placed behind Shield Walls/other models, murder them with Vengeance, and then carry on about their days. Going back to the 'within 3 inches' clause is probably not unthinkable though.
|
|
bundeez
Junior Strategist
Posts: 325
|
Post by bundeez on Oct 12, 2018 12:17:45 GMT
That's fair. Although our vengeance troops are medium base with CMD 7, so more difficult to do than than with the immortals. Now I just need Fury or Battle Lust on Aurora (instead of Arcane Might) and I totally want to play the theme
|
|
|
Post by hocestbellum on Oct 16, 2018 9:24:38 GMT
They've updated Vengeance so that it works regardless of the Transverse Enumerator, they've lowered the RAT of the Locus from 7 to 6, and they've replaced Arcane Vortex with Void Generator, which reads
"At any time during its activation, this model can spend a power token to give a friendly Faction model/unit within 5˝ of it Mage Static for one round. (Enemy magic attacks targeting a model with Mage Static suffer –5 RNG. Model lose Mage Static while out of formation.)"
Delightful changes
|
|
bundeez
Junior Strategist
Posts: 325
|
Post by bundeez on Oct 16, 2018 10:09:01 GMT
You like the changes?
|
|
|
Post by hocestbellum on Oct 16, 2018 10:49:58 GMT
Yeah! RAT 6 from RAT 7 is almost entirely irrelevant on a gun that is so easy to boost.
The Vengeance rewording is perfectly logical, and fixes a daft bit of Skornergy. Having the 6th man and Tactician really helps shield wall units, and the reroll would seem to help the Perforators a lot. Looks great to me.
Mage Static makes it harder to protect specific things (like Axiom or warcaster) but is so much better at protecting units. Most debuffs are going to have a RNG of 3", and you can pop it from CMD behind the unit. The only worry is sprays. This being the infantry theme, I would say that it makes sense for the Locum to protect units more effectively than colossals
So yes, I think that's positive set of changes
|
|
bundeez
Junior Strategist
Posts: 325
|
Post by bundeez on Oct 16, 2018 13:30:46 GMT
Fair points Although it sounds like you are most excited about the Transverse Enumerator. I agree about the rat6, but would much rather have arcane vortex. Most people who cast offensive spells at my stuff use arc nodes. The most scariest ones are arm debuffs which come from Cryx with spd 7 arc nodes, which can just run the 5 more inches to apply their spells anyway. But that's just theory ofcourse
|
|
|
Post by Korianneder on Oct 16, 2018 13:53:25 GMT
Fair points Although it sounds like you are most excited about the Transverse Enumerator. I agree about the rat6, but would much rather have arcane vortex. Most people who cast offensive spells at my stuff use arc nodes. The most scariest ones are arm debuffs which come from Cryx with spd 7 arc nodes, which can just run the 5 more inches to apply their spells anyway. But that's just theory ofcourse The most common cryx debuff is parasite with the most ubiquitous being crippling grasp. Both are range 8 so down to 3. That means they have to run within 3 inches of a unit but outside 2 inch reach of our most common units. It also means that arcnode is 5 inches closer and probably standing somewhere unsafe that it doesn't want to be. Either way it helps a lot more on that unit then arcane vortex does.
|
|
|
Post by hocestbellum on Oct 16, 2018 13:59:59 GMT
I am! It's very efficient for its points, and CMD 9 really helps if you're planning to hang someone back to help the Foundries.
The SPD7 on a Cryx Arc node means that if they're targeting a unit they've certainly got the speed to target a model more than 3" away from the Locus. But knocking 5" off the threat range, and forcing that Arc Node to be that much closer? Amazing.
AV is perfect for protecting a single, high-value target. Mage Static is miles better on units, and still pretty good on single targets.
And even if that Cryx node does run up 3" from his target, you can just ping the target with the Locus next turn to remove whatever spell it was they cast.
If the Locus was in DI, you'd want AV, but as it's in CWL, I think Mage Static is better
|
|
|
Post by feketelovag on Oct 17, 2018 20:16:12 GMT
Im a little surprised that people like Mage Static more than Arcane Vortex. To me this isn't even a question of which I would prefer... Arcane Vortex completely prevents a spell while Mage Static just lowers range. This is just such a no contest that its not even funny. Sure the arc node will have to come closer and expose itself a bit more, but in my experience those arc nodes don't survive the following turn after coming in to get a spell off anyways. If it does then that's because the spell it got off devastated whatever was in front of it, too bad you didn't have a way to prevent that from happening instead of just lowering its range... oh wait.
Not saying Mage Static is useless because it does have its uses but if you ask me, than Arcane Vortex is hands down a better and more flexible ability. So I'm not sure how this wasn't an all around nerf to the model that some other people seem to be seeing.
Will the model still see play and is it still good? Ya it will and it is, but I don't really see any reason to be happy about these changes.
|
|
bundeez
Junior Strategist
Posts: 325
|
Post by bundeez on Oct 17, 2018 20:30:30 GMT
I 100% agree with you feketelovag. As my example above, if cryx applies an arm debuff to any of CoC infantry, it doesn't matter if the arc node is closer or not or that the Locus can remove the debuff the turn after - because the whole unit will die! I don't see why being within 3 inches is a big deal - anything above 2 and you are golden. But hey, an upkeep removal solo in a faction/theme that desperately needs it is good, so not bad
|
|
|
Post by Korianneder on Oct 17, 2018 20:51:48 GMT
It's incredibly difficult getting a large base within 3 inches of an entire unit. Not to mention the enigma foundry that also needs to be in range of that unit. If you don't have every model within 3 inches, they just target one of the models not within 3 inches and the spell goes off.
Arcane vortex is good at protecting single, high value models. It's not good at protecting full 10 man units. It's easier to maneuver it around 5 man medium bases, but even then it's pretty restrictive.
|
|