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Post by jonnyboy on Aug 3, 2017 16:48:13 GMT
Has anyone considered running Irusk 1? His feat might be a great counter to the alpha, 4+ tough on all infantry. I would think this helps weather the first round of D1's feat. Then you have Inhospitable ground, unless GF has tons of pathfinder this could provide some needed control vs attrition/assassination. Even airburst would be great for sniping unit leaders/pistol wraiths/hell slingers. It might even be worth it to run out of theme for sylys.
He does lack an RFP, but if you are out of theme bring Alexia 2? He may not be well suited, and I am just a fan of Irusk.
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Post by Netherby on Aug 4, 2017 3:09:12 GMT
I feel like Irusk has trouble not dying when facing ghost fleet. And that is basically the first question to have to answer into it: 'Can my caster reliably not die?'. If you haven't answered that question, then it doesn't matter how good the rest of your tech works into it.
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Post by jonnyboy on Aug 4, 2017 11:05:23 GMT
I feel like Irusk has trouble not dying when facing ghost fleet. And that is basically the first question to have to answer into it: 'Can my caster reliably not die?'. If you haven't answered that question, then it doesn't matter how good the rest of your tech works into it. I have yet to play into ghost fleet myself, so take everything I say as hot gas. I think he can bring 3 pieces of tech against dieing fairly easily. You have the giant 14" of rough terrain around him, im not sure how Gf handles this so maybe it isn't as helpful as i think. His feat also makes for a good anti alpha, giving him no knockdown sounds key here. And then for 3 point the dog can stop one of the arc nodes hopefully. Shooting is definitely an issue, but with good placement, being a small base LoS wouldn't be too hard to block, no? And then his 14" control range allows jacks to opperate pretty far forward.
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Post by Cirga on Aug 4, 2017 12:06:01 GMT
Denny has Ghost walk if she really needs to give stuff pathfinder (ghost walk also gets around you running to engage their guns), it does require Denny to use focus casting ghost walk which is a partial win, but it isn't enough. The rifles are range 14 so they can get into range of Irusk just by toeing the edge of the rough terrain. It doesn't matter much if the rest of your army can blunt the alpha, without RFP you'd have to eliminate a whole revenant unit to keep the Cryx player from getting back all the rifles, and a good ghost fleet player isn't going to let you do that easily. The Cryx player can just run up a bunch of incorporeal black bane grunts to block landing zones for the war dog to charge the arcnode, or they can just shoot the dog with one rifle unit and kill you over two turns.
With Irusk's old man stats the Cryx player isn't going to be concerned about killing your army. They just need to slow you down a bit and keep the scenario contested long enough for them to kill Irusk. Between Denny's back breaking feat and all the incorporeal and cheap recurring models the list has they will be able to very effectively contest scenario and buy themselves the time to kill Irusk.
As Netherby said, reliably keeping your caster alive is the first thing you need to solve when facing GF under Denny1 and neither of the Irusks have the tools to do so.
I beat my local Ghost fleet player, the guy that The armchair warrior lost to in his last steamroller, a couple weeks ago with the following list.
Theme: Jaws of the Wolf 3 / 3 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army
Kommander Zoktavir, the Butcher Unleashed - WJ: +22 - War Argus - War Dog - PC: 3 - Ruin - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 17) - Kodiak - PC: 13 (Battlegroup Points Used: 5) - Kodiak - PC: 13 - Kodiak - PC: 13
Greylord Forge Seer - PC: 0 - Behemoth - PC: 25 Greylord Forge Seer - PC: 0 Widowmaker Marksman - PC: 0 Widowmaker Scouts - Leader & 3 Grunts: 8 Kayazy Eliminators - Leader & Grunt: 5
I won the roll to go first, which definitely helped. I had to keep butcher back a lot, but I kept him safe and with SOD and my other shooting I was able to wipe out 2 pirate units and my opponent conceded when it became apparent that I would eventually win on scenario. I could post a full battle report if people are interested, already PMed it to armchair, would just need to go through and remove the name of the Cryx player.
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Post by Netherby on Aug 4, 2017 13:28:00 GMT
Shooting is definitely an issue, but with good placement, being a small base LoS wouldn't be too hard to block, no? And then his 14" control range allows jacks to opperate pretty far forward. And that's the issue, they usually have 9 of the weapon attachments which have Ghost Shot. That means they ignore other models for LoS along with concealment and stuff. Then the Deny feat reduces all your stats by 2 and he becomes reasonably easy for them to hit and damage. So you're pretty much forced to play him in WGK to sac pawn those shots.
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Post by jonnyboy on Aug 4, 2017 14:26:06 GMT
I definitely see now, an effective p+s 17 rifle shot that ignores LoS at rng 14" would be very problematic. Irusk 1 probably isnt a good choice here, theme might help though.
I did listen to the murder of crows podcast linked, I really dig the B3 Jaws theme list. Would shooting not be an issue here? I figure you would have to run your jacks/kayazy pretty hard, camp focus, and stay pretty far back to stay safe.
I would for sure be interested in a batrep of your game Cirga
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Post by Cirga on Aug 4, 2017 15:29:22 GMT
I managed to win the roll to go first despite my opponent having the +1 to starting roll, I feel like this definitely helped. We played standoff, there was a long thin forest placed with the long side horizontally right in the middle of the board and there was rubble and obstructions scattered around it on either side (the rubble and obstructions ended up being a non factor due to the kodiaks having pathfinder and Denny having Ghost walk, and both of us being able to run around the obstructions). I deployed the butcher Centrally with a kodiak and ruin, another kodiak more to the left, and the 3rd kodiak and Behemoth where on the right along with the eliminators. The the widows and marksman went on the left line after my opponent had deployed.
My oppoenet deployed Denny, nightmare, undead cain, his machine wraith and a pistol wraith centrally and one of his arcnodes favoring my left side. He had one unit of pirates on each flank, and he had one on my right/center, and the blackbanes on my left/center. His 2nd arcnode went on my right side and his stalker being sad that it lost AD took a hard flank on my left.
On my turn I ran everything up, the widows moved just out of his rifles threat range along with the marksman. I had one kodiak move toward the left circle zone, one toward the right (neither made it to the zones) and the 3rd moved toward the center forest along with ruin. B3 put up silence of death on the eliminators, energizered himself + battlegroup and moved up to my rectangular zone favoring the left side with one Argus in front of him and other Behind, and the eliminators ran up to the edges of the right circle zone. Behemoth ran up to the right side of my rectangular zone and the 2 forge seers moved up to within 7 inches of behemoth. The war dog ran to stay close to B3.
My oppoenet runs one of his arcnodes into range to crippling grasp the kodiak I have on my left. Denny activates casts ghost walk on a couple of the pirate units, arcs crippling grasp onto my left kodiak, and walks up into her rectangular zone behind his objective. All three units of pirates run up, the unit on my left into the circle zone on my left, the unit on my right runs into the cirlce zone on my right and the unit that was deployed more centrally runs towards the right zone, but still somewhat centrally and partially behind the forest. The blackbanes run towards the forest and a few of the grunts move deep enough into the edges of the forest that I have LOS to them. Undead Cain runs to the circle zone to my right, the pistol wraith and the machine wraith both move up next to each other centrally, but behind the rightmost edge of the center forest next to a few of the grunts from the center pirates unit and blackbane's unit. Nightmare runs up next to his objective. His second arcnode runs to the the right circle zone behind the unit of pirates, and the stalker runs up his flank to the left getting in walk and jump range of my left flank.
I upkeep SOD on the eliminators, I give Ruin a focus and Butcher keeps 4. The Eliminators activate first and they are in charge range of 3 of the rifles on the right most pirate unit and 1 from the center unit. If I can hit with all my attacks I can kill all 4 thanks to side step, sadly my first eliminator rolls snake eyes followed by a 3, missing both her initials despite being mat 9 with gang, the second eliminator manages to kill her two targets, RFPing 2 rifles from the right most unit. The forge seers move up slightly so that Behemoth will still be within 7 of each after he moves and they both give him a focus. Behemoth moves up to the right most edge of my rectangular zone which gets him los to the machine wraith and pistol wraith. Using the +2 to hit drive he puts a boosted shot into the machine wraith killing him, and a couple grunts from the center pirate unit and a couple black bane's grunts die to blast damage. I whiff on blast damage against the pistol wraith leaving him on 2 boxes, the second boosted shot goes into the pistol wraith killing him as well as the third rifle from the right most pirate unit and 1 rifle from the center unit of pirates. B3 activates, energizers and camps 2, and then just moves a couple inches towards the left edge of my rectangular zone so that the forest is blocking LOS to him from Denny and I position the argus so as to block landing zones from the stalker. The crippling grasped kodiak moves to contest the left zone, while blocking the last landing spot that the stalker could jump to to reach Butcher. Ruin activates and charges one of the blackbane grunts that is in the forest, ending his charge with blackbane in reach of his mace, Ruin kills his charge target and uses his 2 focus to kill blackbane and another grunt. I run my right most kodiak into melee with nightmare, in the hopes of keeping Nightmare away from Ruin (who is nigthmare's prey target). The marksman followed by the widowmakers activate aim, and shoot the arcnode that crippling grasped my kodiak off the board . The last kodiak moves up behind the center of the forest in case something does get to Ruin. The war dog mves up to be within 3 inches of Butcher.
With 3 of my jacks in the thick of things my opponenet decides to feat. Pirates come back where they can, he upkeeps crippling grasp, loads up nightmare, he parasites the kodiak I ran up into nightmare's grill, feats, and moves up and puts some damage onto the parasited kodiak with Denny. He then has the center unit of pirates charge the kodiak, he is only able to get half of the unit in, but he gets enough (he piles in the rest of the unit behind the ones that charged in though, which he pays for later) in and the last dude finishes him off opening up a charge lane for Nightmare to get to Ruin. Nightmare walks up to ruin (and my opponent points out that even if he didn't kill the kodiak that Nightmare has ghostly and would have been able to just walk around to Ruin anyways, aka I threw away my kodiak, whoops). Between the -2 arm from Denny's feat and the +2 str from prey Nightmare kills Ruin with 2 focus to spare (so I kind threw Ruin away too). On the right undead Cain moves into melee and the back arc of one of my eliminators and kills her and then manages to shoot the other clearing the zone (totally forget to move something else besides the eliminators into that zone). The unit of pirates in that zone spreads out so that the whole unit is within the zone as they don't have any good targets to attack. A couple of the remaining blackbane grunts charge the crippling grasped kodiak on the left putting on some damage, a few of the pirates charge the kodiak too putting some more damage on it, but the unit mostly spreads out, the stalker then jumps in and finishes off the kodiak. He moves his remaining arc node into the back edge of the circle zone on my right. My oppoennet scores 3 points, 1 in each cirlce zone, and one in his rectangle zone I score 1 in my rectangle zone.
Butcher keeps everything, SOD fell off as both eliminators are dead. Behemoth, the forge seers, the widomakers and marksman are all lucky enough to be out of Denny's feat. The Forge seers activate inch up slightly and give behemoth 2 focus. Behemoth moves into the edge of the right circle zone (and I brain fart and don't position him so he is also contesting my rectangular zone), he gets the +2 to hit drive and is able to completely wipe out the center pirate unit that clumped up to kill my kodiak that had run to engage nightmare. B3 activates moves up 3 inches due to being speed 3 under feat, and is able to get into a position were he is able to impeding doom nightmare, the stalker, all but 4 of the pirates from the left pirate unit, and some blackbanes. He puts up silence of death on himself and goes to town with flashing blades. I have to feat and boost some hits against the stalker due to being mat 7 under Denny's feat, but I manage to kill nightmare, the stalker, and all the pirate and blackbane grunts that I pulled in leaving Butcher with a camp of 3 and the center forest between him and Denny. Unfortunately though I had to move him out of the rectangular zone and I decide I'd rather have the extra camp than risk going down to a 1 camp to energizer to score both the left circle zone and my rectangle zone. The marksman aims and kills the one pirate grunt in the left unit that the widomakers didn't have lOS to, and then the widowmakers pick off the 3 remianing grunts that they do have los to, wiping out the whole unit. I Run my last kodiak into his rectangle zone to keep him from scoring. At this point all he has left is his caster, 1 pirate unit that has 2 of its rifles RFPed, undead cain, one arcnode and 2 blackbane grunts so he concedes. Both my remaining Kodiak and Behemoth are undamaged. He could score the circle zone on my left with his last 2 blackbanes grunts and he could possibly clear one of my contesting heavies, but it isn't a guarantee by any means and even if he managed that would still only get him to 5 points, which is one short. Next turn Butcher would be able to start scoring both my rectangular zone and the left circle zone and I may have been able destroy his objective and start scoring his rectangle zone.
My opponent did make a couple mistakes, but I did as well. My opponent said that in a steamroller setting he would probably just drop his dark host list into me if he saw my B3 list as one of my pairings.
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Post by sand20go on Aug 4, 2017 16:22:35 GMT
Butcher 3 is a decent ghost fleet drop because SOD RFPs. I love him with the gun carriage in that match up.
What I NEED to see is if he can also weather out Heretic dudes list. As with GF, the key really comes down to saving Butcher from the shooting. In the Grymkin match up B3 will likely be looking at one (if not two) Hollowmen Death star shots while under Heretic's version of Pray. That gets them up, if my math is rigth before that third cup of coffee to POW 23 on the CRA. The the critical issue of SacPawn in theme.
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wags
Junior Strategist
Posts: 102
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Post by wags on Aug 4, 2017 18:07:06 GMT
Until we see what the greylord theme looks like, I feel like khador's best option is probably some sort of B3 list. The problem with ghost fleet is not just ghost fleet but that you need something that can play in to their second pair as well. I mean Sorscha 2 on paper is a hard counter to GF, but if they see her they'll probably drop a bane list and she is not the most durable of casters. Scaverous in bane tier is an absolutely gnarly assassination threat. The other big thing to be aware of is the Wraith Engine. You absolutely need to have something that threatens the WE or else they will run it straight at you and basically say "come at me bro." You can't ignore it as it's a nasty threat on it's own between dark shroud and the machine wraiths it can spawn. This means having magical weapons on something other than a caster. In theme the options are a butcher with Ruin, or a jaws list with a forge seer marshal. I feel out of theme plays too far behind in both points and granted abilities to compete once you're against a skilled cryx player.
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Post by Armchair Warrior on Aug 12, 2017 0:30:44 GMT
So in advance of ouR graylord theme I'm still using Butcher 3 as my Crupyx drop. I tested my List last night into ghost fleet and came out on top but I'm worried that the build still isn't great. I want to be able to handle anything Cryx can dish out. This is the current list.
War Room Army
Khador - Butcher 3 Kommand
Theme: Winter Guard Kommand 2 / 2 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army
Kommander Zoktavir, the Butcher Unleashed - WJ: +22 - War Argus - War Dog - PC: 3 - Ruin - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 17) - Kodiak - PC: 13 (Battlegroup Points Used: 5) - Kodiak - PC: 13 - Marauder - PC: 10
Winter Guard Gun Carriage - PC: 17
Kovnik Jozef Grigorovich - PC: 4
Winter Guard Infantry - Leader & 9 Grunts: 10 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Infantry Officer & Standard - Officer & Standard: 4 Winter Guard Mortar Crew - Gunner & Grunt: 0 Winter Guard Mortar Crew - Gunner & Grunt: 0
So in general I didn't feel disadvantaged in the matchup against a Denny ghost fleet list but I didn't feel particularly in managed. The list suffered from short range on the Wintergard, and I needed to keep the Wintergard really close to but sure which meant I wasn't getting enough dude killed each turn to Handle the recursion well. Also the gun carriage was easy for Danny to crippling grasp which limited it's effectiveness. The -5 armor swing on the Jack's also make it easy for Denny to remove one each round.
I'm thinking of dropping the GC to put in another unit of Wintergard so that I can keep one close to butcher and one farther forward getting real work done. I'm also thinking about dropping the marauder in order to fit in scouts. I think they'll boss into dark host and obviously shine and the ghost fleet matchup. Still... Butcher with just 3 jacks?! Here's the list...
War Room Army
Khador - Butcher 3 Kommand - Alt
Theme: Winter Guard Kommand 2 / 2 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army
Kommander Zoktavir, the Butcher Unleashed - WJ: +22 - War Argus - War Dog - PC: 3 - Ruin - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 17) - Kodiak - PC: 13 (Battlegroup Points Used: 5) - Kodiak - PC: 13
Kovnik Jozef Grigorovich - PC: 4
Winter Guard Infantry - Leader & 9 Grunts: 10 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Infantry Officer & Standard - Officer & Standard: 4 Winter Guard Rifle Corps - Leader & 9 Grunts: 13 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 Winter Guard Mortar Crew - Gunner & Grunt: 0 Winter Guard Mortar Crew - Gunner & Grunt: 0 Widowmaker Scouts - Leader & 3 Grunts: 8
THEME: Winter Guard Kommand I could drop the scouts and one rocket in order to put in a marauder but I'm not sure... I do feel like this list asks a more definitive question...can your stuff get through all this shooting and still deal with Butcher?
My other list is Karchev with 8 jacks. So... if my opponent brought heavy beast or jack spam I already have an answer.
Advice?
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Post by Cirga on Aug 12, 2017 14:29:53 GMT
I could drop the scouts and one rocket in order to put in a marauder but I'm not sure... I do feel like this list asks a more definitive question...can your stuff get through all this shooting and still deal with Butcher? My other list is Karchev with 8 jacks. So... if my opponent brought heavy beast or jack spam I already have an answer. Advice? I don't think there is any list we can make that will feel advantaged into ghost fleet while still being useful against other lists. Not feeling disadvantaged is about as good as you can probably hope to get. Ghost fleet under Denny1 is just that powerful. If the GC didn't work out for you then going with a unit of rifles isn't a bad call. The scouts should do well into ghost fleet, however they may not be as good into dark hosts as we hope. Dark hosts gives banes prowl and lets them place 2 4 inch clouds anywhere completely within 20 inches of their deployment table edge. Combined with the increase in LOS blocking terrain in SR2017 the scouts could have trouble finding targets they can shoot, at least for 1 turn. I've only played into Dark hosts once so far and that was with a Legion of steel list, so I don't have any experience using scouts against it. Our local Cryx player picked up two Wraith Engines last week, so you can probably expect to have to deal with some variation of the Skarre1 double wraith engine dark hosts build as his pair to his Denny1 Ghost fleet. The Marauder may be needed to help deal with the Wraith engines, I'm also considering shaking up the jack load out for my B3 Jaws lists to squeeze in a marauder. The engines will both be arm 23 (def 12) with 26 boxes the turn that he decides to feat and commit them. They'll be pow 22 under feat with 3 initials, so they will cripple/wreck any jack they charge. It has a 12 inch threat so it out threats everything but Ruin. A Fully loaded marauder with SOD has about a 33% chance of killing one under feat, but even if it doesn't kill it it should only have a few boxes left and something else can finish the job. So having the marauder may be well worth losing the scouts and 1 rocket just in case he drops dark hosts instead.
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Post by Armchair Warrior on Aug 12, 2017 15:13:00 GMT
I could drop the scouts and one rocket in order to put in a marauder but I'm not sure... I do feel like this list asks a more definitive question...can your stuff get through all this shooting and still deal with Butcher? My other list is Karchev with 8 jacks. So... if my opponent brought heavy beast or jack spam I already have an answer. Advice? I don't think there is any list we can make that will feel advantaged into ghost fleet while still being useful against other lists. Not feeling disadvantaged is about as good as you can probably hope to get. Ghost fleet under Denny1 is just that powerful. If the GC didn't work out for you then going with a unit of rifles isn't a bad call. The scouts should do well into ghost fleet, however they may not be as good into dark hosts as we hope. Dark hosts gives banes prowl and lets them place 2 4 inch clouds anywhere completely within 20 inches of their deployment table edge. Combined with the increase in LOS blocking terrain in SR2017 the scouts could have trouble finding targets they can shoot, at least for 1 turn. I've only played into Dark hosts once so far and that was with a Legion of steel list, so I don't have any experience using scouts against it. Our local Cryx player picked up two Wraith Engines last week, so you can probably expect to have to deal with some variation of the Skarre1 double wraith engine dark hosts build as his pair to his Denny1 Ghost fleet. The Marauder may be needed to help deal with the Wraith engines, I'm also considering shaking up the jack load out for my B3 Jaws lists to squeeze in a marauder. The engines will both be arm 23 (def 12) with 26 boxes the turn that he decides to feat and commit them. They'll be pow 22 under feat with 3 initials, so they will cripple/wreck any jack they charge. It has a 12 inch threat so it out threats everything but Ruin. A Fully loaded marauder with SOD has about a 33% chance of killing one under feat, but even if it doesn't kill it it should only have a few boxes left and something else can finish the job. So having the marauder may be well worth losing the scouts and 1 rocket just in case he drops dark hosts instead. Thanks. That's really practical advice. The marauder may help a bit more into other matchups as well vs 4 snipers and a rocket. I've found the marauder is just sooo good into large bases. That leaves me with this. War Room Army Khador - Butcher 3 WGK w Double WG Theme: Winter Guard Kommand 2 / 2 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army Kommander Zoktavir, the Butcher Unleashed - WJ: +22 - War Argus - War Dog - PC: 3 - Ruin - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 17) - Marauder - PC: 10 (Battlegroup Points Used: 5) - Kodiak - PC: 13 - Kodiak - PC: 13 Kovnik Jozef Grigorovich - PC: 4 Winter Guard Mortar Crew - Gunner & Grunt: 0 Winter Guard Mortar Crew - Gunner & Grunt: 0 Winter Guard Infantry - Leader & 9 Grunts: 10 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Infantry Officer & Standard - Officer & Standard: 4 Winter Guard Rifle Corps - Leader & 9 Grunts: 13 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 THEME: Winter Guard Kommand --- GENERATED : 08/12/2017 11:12:40 BUILD ID : 2047.17-07-25 Or this... War Room Army Khador - Butcher 3 WGK w Triple WG Theme: Winter Guard Kommand 2 / 2 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army Kommander Zoktavir, the Butcher Unleashed - WJ: +22 - War Argus - War Dog - PC: 3 - Ruin - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 17) - Kodiak - PC: 13 (Battlegroup Points Used: 5) - Marauder - PC: 10 - Marauder - PC: 10 Kovnik Jozef Grigorovich - PC: 4 Winter Guard Mortar Crew - 0 Winter Guard Infantry - Leader & 5 Grunts: 6 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Infantry Officer & Standard - : 0 Winter Guard Rifle Corps - Leader & 5 Grunts: 8 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 Winter Guard Rifle Corps - Leader & 5 Grunts: 8 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2 Strategy wise that let's me put one min WGRC unit on each flank and The Infantry surrounding Butcher. Lots of rocket pressure. I lose a kodiak but can advance move all 4 jacks. The marauders go on the flanks amid the rockets. Ruin and kodiak go with Butcher. Swap a marauder with a kodiak depending on terrain. I lose the cloud walk but it's useless into Ghost Fleet anyway. THEME: Winter Guard Kommand --- GENERATED : 08/12/2017 11:24:17 BUILD ID : 2047.17-07-25
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Post by utilitycookie on Aug 13, 2017 19:39:18 GMT
Currently 4-2 into ghost fleet with strakov1 in JOTW. (2 wins on a 150 man team event this weekend)
Lots of overrun targets, all easily killed, just keep 21 inch between jacks and denegrah or let her feat on 2 marauders and behemoth to give the illusion of a good feat, charge and overrun into her with a grolar or torch. Behemoth can clear some intervening Models, torch as well and can remove stealth with grenades, assault and arcing fire.
Denegrah had difficulty killing a Jack on range even on feat. And losing 1 or 2 to kill her is worth it.
Cheers,
Utility
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Growl
Junior Strategist
Posts: 496
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Post by Growl on Aug 13, 2017 23:14:19 GMT
utilitycookie awesome job and good advice, yet I think I would somehow have trouble and botch up the positioning. With regard to the talk about marauders up above, I found that I had difficulty in my match ups with Denny GF because the Wraith Engines out threat them by so much. How do you get your Marauders into them, and how do you give them magic weapons?
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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Aug 14, 2017 0:12:14 GMT
Im just thinking why Not Malakov 2?
At least in terms of survival, he's pretty much immune to Ghost fleet assassination. Sucker is a great ability 90% of the time, and Ghost shot ignores clouds and concealment, but not concealment for purposes of stealth, so he can make himself stealthy when necessary.
Also his feat isn't as stat dependent as other feats. Even a 2-inch advance backward is good enough to deny further killing ability and allows you to weather a feat turn.
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