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Post by Tom_Bombadil_ on May 2, 2017 21:36:46 GMT
So I have been hearing a lot of people say that they are looking to put E3 together with the new Spears of Scyrah but I am kinda confused on what the purpose of the combination is other than a cute way of getting E3 on the table and I have never seen the value of E3 as a combat solo. If this does really work I would rather run the spears next to Eiryss1. They can still shield guard for her only thing you are missing is the AD. I am sure I am missing something so please let me know what it is.
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Post by Demeritus on May 2, 2017 23:51:22 GMT
I am not personally sold on E3 being with them all the time but it does allow you a chance to get a high def jam unit into your opponents face sooner. At def 17, they are not gonna be the easiest to hit in melee.
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Post by Kallas on May 3, 2017 1:26:29 GMT
One of the nice synergies they have is that when they Vengeance Eiryss also gets to. This gives her a 13.5" melee threat with a further 12" Quick Work. That's a really long way for such a threatening shot.
Shield Guard really helps in that regard (as do Soulless Escorts) as it enables you to more reliably trigger Vengeance if you see a decent opening. Even if there isn't a good opening, you still get extra movement and possible attacks.
Generally speaking I've found the Spears+E3 package to be solid the couple of times I've tried it. It's a nice way of slotting in some Shield Guards, good melee troops, high DEF bastards and Eiryss3's personal threat. It's a nice combination for Thyron, Kaelyssa and probably others too (those are my only casters I've tried them with as of yet.)
Is it insane? No, but it's far from bad, particularly if you don't rate Infiltrators (lol) as Spears are just so much better.
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Post by Dirhavel on May 3, 2017 5:19:41 GMT
One of the nice synergies they have is that when they Vengeance Eiryss also gets to. This gives her a 13.5" melee threat with a further 12" Quick Work. That's a really long way for such a threatening shot. Shield Guard really helps in that regard (as do Soulless Escorts) as it enables you to more reliably trigger Vengeance if you see a decent opening. Even if there isn't a good opening, you still get extra movement and possible attacks. Generally speaking I've found the Spears+E3 package to be solid the couple of times I've tried it. It's a nice way of slotting in some Shield Guards, good melee troops, high DEF bastards and Eiryss3's personal threat. It's a nice combination for Thyron, Kaelyssa and probably others too (those are my only casters I've tried them with as of yet.) Is it insane? No, but it's far from bad, particularly if you don't rate Infiltrators (lol) as Spears are just so much better. I thought only the models with Vengeance could make the actual vengeance movement, why would Eyriss get the 3" if she doesn't have vengeance herself?
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Post by oncomingstorm on May 3, 2017 6:48:32 GMT
One of the nice synergies they have is that when they Vengeance Eiryss also gets to. This gives her a 13.5" melee threat with a further 12" Quick Work. That's a really long way for such a threatening shot. Shield Guard really helps in that regard (as do Soulless Escorts) as it enables you to more reliably trigger Vengeance if you see a decent opening. Even if there isn't a good opening, you still get extra movement and possible attacks. Generally speaking I've found the Spears+E3 package to be solid the couple of times I've tried it. It's a nice way of slotting in some Shield Guards, good melee troops, high DEF bastards and Eiryss3's personal threat. It's a nice combination for Thyron, Kaelyssa and probably others too (those are my only casters I've tried them with as of yet.) Is it insane? No, but it's far from bad, particularly if you don't rate Infiltrators (lol) as Spears are just so much better. I thought only the models with Vengeance could make the actual vengeance movement, why would Eyriss get the 3" if she doesn't have vengeance herself? Vengeance has unique wording in that it specifies 'models in the unit' not 'this model' or some variation thereof. No official word on the matter yet, but RaW 'models in the unit' applies to UAs too, so it would apply to Eiryss.
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Post by Dirhavel on May 3, 2017 9:59:56 GMT
I thought only the models with Vengeance could make the actual vengeance movement, why would Eyriss get the 3" if she doesn't have vengeance herself? Vengeance has unique wording in that it specifies 'models in the unit' not 'this model' or some variation thereof. No official word on the matter yet, but RaW 'models in the unit' applies to UAs too, so it would apply to Eiryss. Interesting, I never noticed that. It's good to know for soulless escorts too, I always played it like they didn't get the vengeance activation.
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Post by Kallas on May 3, 2017 11:22:49 GMT
Interesting, I never noticed that. It's good to know for soulless escorts too, I always played it like they didn't get the vengeance activation. They can both get and trigger Vengeance moves. If you've got a few points left over with Spears/Sentinels, slap a few Soulless on and run them out front (they're also conveniently faster than Sentinels) to body block enemy charges.
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Post by elladan52 on May 3, 2017 12:49:39 GMT
People really need to read the rules on the card. Most of the vengeance rules issues come from not reading the actual text and just applying how it was in mk2.
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Post by Tom_Bombadil_ on May 3, 2017 14:39:50 GMT
I was rereading the card and wow I seemed to have missed that. The wording for vengeance is that if any model in the unit dies than every model gets to make the move it has no clause like ability like shield wall do for 'affected models'. I see how that could be really powerful with E3. Personally I am looking at trying an assassination list with Garryth + Strike Force with Commander + E3 and spears. It actually seems to have some real ranged assassination power but I still need to test it out.
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Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on May 3, 2017 15:28:33 GMT
Giving the Spears repo[3] could be pretty nice, they can charge in, kill something, and then repo forward into melee again to benefit from Duellist
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Post by Squig Hopper on May 3, 2017 15:39:42 GMT
They already have repo[3], you don't need Eyriss3 for that.
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Post by Kallas on May 3, 2017 15:40:04 GMT
They already have Repo 3 base. This is presumably to make Eiryss3 less of an attractive option, though it's still a great combo.
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Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on May 3, 2017 16:10:36 GMT
They already have repo[3], you don't need Eyriss3 for that. *walks back to Cygnar page with head hung in shame*
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Post by koku0ryu on May 4, 2017 8:15:11 GMT
I was rereading the card and wow I seemed to have missed that. The wording for vengeance is that if any model in the unit dies than every model gets to make the move it has no clause like ability like shield wall do for 'affected models'. I see how that could be really powerful with E3. Personally I am looking at trying an assassination list with Garryth + Strike Force with Commander + E3 and spears. It actually seems to have some real ranged assassination power but I still need to test it out. Just to clarify, vengeance triggers on damaged, not just destroyed - if you shield guard and take 1 damage to a spear, the unit gets vengeance. I've been trying them with Issyria: Involiable Resolve helps them shield guard a little more confidently, and Blinding light reduces the number of shots you have to worry about.
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Post by M4gnetic on May 7, 2017 12:41:18 GMT
I'm strongly considering buying them and integrating them into the following goreshade list :
4Shade -Fane dog -Imperatus -Discordia -Hemera Spears + E3 Shyeel arcanist unit danwguard scyir -Moros 3x arcanist
Spears provide infinite shield guard and proc vengeance for eyriss & moros, gives me a stealth flank that has massive threat ranges if you try to shoot at them.
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