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Post by DanX on Apr 6, 2017 13:37:29 GMT
In MKIII Animi got a big downgrade. Some of them got hit a bit to hard I think. Some remain awesome.
Awesome. Excessive Healing (Typhon) Slip Steam (Serpah) Repulse (Angelius Wraithbane (Naga) Counter Charge (Raek) Grevious Wounds (Sythean) Super cloud (Belphagore) Snipe (Bolt Thrower) OK.
Magical interference (Bloodseer) - much better than you might expect. range 10 is good. Attractor (Afflictor and Nerpah) - Its situationally very powerful, and only costs 1, Evasion. (Harrier and Zuriel) - Often the extra transfer is more important, and Knockdowns are easy to get. Bee's animus.. - Only works on Bee's but at least others can cast it. Everything on fire (Arcangel) - I like it - but its no a super power move usually. Azurel - He's already immune to fire and cmd5, so not too great - at Range 5. Only costs one and makes caster immune to fire is nice. Proteus - Situation, but its good when he uses it to lower defence or hold enemy in position. Spiney Growth (Carnivian) - Cost 2, self only, Makes it expensive use.
Bad. Overtake (Soldier) Relentless charge (Shredder) Counter Blast (Stinger and Teraph) These guys usually miss. Casters can't boost, but paid 2 fury to get this effect. I think it should boost attack and damage. Then it would get a lot more use. Retaliatory strike (Protector) - Nearly always worse than a bought attack or a transfer. Boiling Blood (Blight bringer) Swift Hunter (Ravagore)
Probalby missed something cool out. Thoughts?
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Post by ComboSmiteNick on Apr 6, 2017 13:55:41 GMT
Spiny Growth should be in the Awesome category (or at least in a "Good" Category between OK and Awesome). Carnys and Bloodseers with Thags1 are legit and one of Legion's only ways to play tanky.
Retaliatory Strike, I love putting it on Rhyas in the Twins (One of the only places I'll play a Protector as well). I'm not planning on using transfers since she is going to get feated back anyway and I love that she is going to get an attack in whether you hit or miss. I'm not going to withhold attacks to put it up but Rhyas very often kills everything in her melee range with her Flashing Blade attacks before she runs out of Fury.
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thelat
Junior Strategist
Posts: 480
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Post by thelat on Apr 6, 2017 16:08:06 GMT
Nephilim Soldier's animus works well on warlocks like Rhyas, Kallus, Kallus2, and Abby1 and 2, while they have reach. I don't think it works for Thagrosh's sword, though. The Shredder's animus is there for our warlocks that lack pathfinder. The Ravagore's animus is good for Vayl2, Lylyth1, Lylyth3, and Saeryn1.
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Post by socialirregular on Apr 6, 2017 17:08:31 GMT
The problem with the Ravagore's animus is that most of the time you're better off with Snipe from the Bolt Thrower.
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unded
Junior Strategist
Posts: 760
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Post by unded on Apr 6, 2017 20:45:36 GMT
I've had some fun with Ravagore animus and Lylyth3, making her unbelievably mobile when you have to go cross-country to get to a flag.
-und_ed
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Post by josephkerr on Apr 6, 2017 21:17:19 GMT
I think we're only one more Lylyth away from having a warlock who LOVES Ravagore animus. #designspace Edit: Maybe also Kryssa2, if she's learned to RNG 10 her spears.
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Whiskie
Junior Strategist
Posts: 288
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Post by Whiskie on Apr 6, 2017 23:23:52 GMT
The funniest animus for Lylyth3 is Repulsion. When you can clear an entire zone by yourself you laugh.
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Post by copperflame on Apr 7, 2017 14:43:47 GMT
In MKIII Animi got a big downgrade. Some of them got hit a bit to hard I think. Some remain awesome.
Awesome. Excessive Healing (Typhon) Slip Steam (Serpah) Repulse (Angelius Wraithbane (Naga) Counter Charge (Raek) Grevious Wounds (Sythean) Super cloud (Belphagore) Snipe (Bolt Thrower) OK.
Magical interference (Bloodseer) - much better than you might expect. range 10 is good. Attractor (Afflictor and Nerpah) - Its situationally very powerful, and only costs 1, Evasion. (Harrier and Zuriel) - Often the extra transfer is more important, and Knockdowns are easy to get. Bee's animus.. - Only works on Bee's but at least others can cast it. Everything on fire (Arcangel) - I like it - but its no a super power move usually. Azurel - He's already immune to fire and cmd5, so not too great - at Range 5. Only costs one and makes caster immune to fire is nice. Proteus - Situation, but its good when he uses it to lower defence or hold enemy in position. Spiney Growth (Carnivian) - Cost 2, self only, Makes it expensive use.
Bad. Overtake (Soldier) Relentless charge (Shredder) Counter Blast (Stinger and Teraph) These guys usually miss. Casters can't boost, but paid 2 fury to get this effect. I think it should boost attack and damage. Then it would get a lot more use. Retaliatory strike (Protector) - Nearly always worse than a bought attack or a transfer. Boiling Blood (Blight bringer) Swift Hunter (Ravagore)
Probalby missed something cool out. Thoughts?
Separating the warbeast from the animi - and considering them as 'Spell for X cost'... - I wish Attractor was 3" instead of 2"... so that way it can mirror repluse and have a use to pull in things that are outside of 2' melee range. But OK is a good rating because it can open up charge lanes.
- I am surprised you rated Evasion OK instead of Bad... someone mentioned in the Zuriel thread about 'if' it would allow a fade effect to consume the buff to resist a knockdown attempt... that would be awesome. As it stands now... blah
- Hornet's Nest: A warpack only animi is of no use, I think this one should be bad period or changed in some form.
- Draconic Aura: its okay... better than what it was?
- Vortex of Fire: You already said it. The range cripples the usefulness. I still wish that this was a spell for Kallus2 based on control range and AZ got a 'if on fire, gain an additional die on attack' or even 'fire attacks gain an additional die on attack' for Kyrassa's spell- something.
-Crawling Chaos: situational on a warlock (though who doesn't like -2 def) but I really like this with any tough warbeast (unyielding helps). Mind you, if the idea was to 'stick and tank' a -2 str would have made this perfect.
-Spiny Growth: already said.. too expensive for Awesome (though the effect is awesome).
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-Overtake: for the warbeast, I find it lacking. As a spell... we have Rhyas, Twins (Rhays again), maybe Kallus? Do you think if it was on a different warbeast it would be rated OK?
-Relentless Charge: sucks... I know it is there for 'caster with no pathfinder' but still lacking (maybe because we have pathfinder/flight/battleengine/calv). The fact it is on the shredder (what if it had overtake instead?)....
-Counter Blast: I completely agree. I would settle for 1 less cost and bust attack only as well. I really wish this was better, love the concept.
-Retaliatory Strike: Agreed. Outside of the niche use case of Rhyas - it sucks. it needs a boost (and much rather the protector had safeguard instead)
-Boiling Blood: suffers from the same lack of boosting that the other retaliatory animi do. The spray is likely not to hit multiple figures since a unit charging is going to fan out along the base.
-Swift Hunter: moving 2" per shot/kill? this is OK if not Awesome! Though if you can only shoot once, then the usefulness goes down. Or the fact that it is SELF only also hurts...
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Post by ForEver_Blight on Apr 7, 2017 15:08:23 GMT
Draconic Aura, single biggest let down of an animi on a Gargantuan. DA needs to be "model ends movement within 2" takes a pow 12 and suffer cont. fire". Same concept, actually serves a purpose.
Boiling blood, single biggest let down spell on a support model. I mean seriously, at least the Storm raptor's animus has model interactions now matter how limited they do exist. Blightbringer just needs something totally different. I can't imagine what.
Swap the animi of the Soldier and the Raek. Counter charge with precision strike is meaningful and gives so much more value to include Soldiers. Raek is meant for mobility anyways; leap, kill, overtake, so on and so forth.
Bring back Safegaurd.
Azrael will never get a piece or imitation of Horgle's feat. The dream is dead. Though I'd like to see the range of Flame Vortex hard set to 10.
Screw relentless charge, put glider on something new and give it to us.
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Post by umpossible on Apr 7, 2017 18:34:50 GMT
IMHO they could fix the lesser warbeasts by bettering their animi.
I would love to see the stinger with a 2 cost self targeting boosted ranged attack and damage rolls for his spray.
I would also love to see the shredder regain rabid as an animi but with flank that might be a little too strong.
I honestly don't know what I would have for the harrier.
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Post by heckler on Apr 7, 2017 19:09:05 GMT
I think the shredder's animus should also include a free charge; that way it would be useful on the shredder and still fulfill the role on a caster.
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Post by Cheesebeard on Apr 7, 2017 19:47:56 GMT
If the shredder's animus was target model, instead of self, it would be wayyyyy better, and more in line with what we see in other factions; hello, Rush!
I'd really like to see it just give pathfinder to target model, and not only on charges, but at this point my expectations are kind of low... haha
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Post by fossilfinder on Apr 7, 2017 22:53:16 GMT
As to Azrael's Animus it definitely seems more of a thing for a caster to use than Azrael himself. That said, I have happily played him with Thags1 and Typhon under Draconic Blessing or with Kryssa using his Animus into Protectorate warjack gunlines very happily. Our animus pool did certainly get curtailed in the edition change (I maaaay still be a bit bent out of shape that we didn't get a point of ARM or DEF on a few models to make up for the loss of Tenacity), but I feel that some of the Animi suffer from the beasts their on more than being bad themselves. Overtake isn't the worst thing ever, for instance, but it makes the Soldier a confused beast that has some anti-infantry tools and some anti-armor tools but not enough of either to really have a dedicated roll. I think Spiny Growth should be 1-cost if it needs to be Self but that's neither here nor there. Having Safeguard would be a godsend that we'll likely never see again. The best use I've gotten out of Draconic Aura has been with Lylyth3 in testing but it is still pretty underwhelming and Repulsion is almost always a better call. Overall I agree that our animi are largely underwhelming but I'd honestly prefer if our beasts were a bit cheaper to reflect that than necessarily overhauling all of the animi.
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Post by mallios on Apr 8, 2017 0:03:07 GMT
If the shredder's animus was target model, instead of self, it would be wayyyyy better, and more in line with what we see in other factions; hello, Rush! I'd really like to see it just give pathfinder to target model, and not only on charges, but at this point my expectations are kind of low... haha We always see groups of Shredders in the art, but currently there isn't a compelling reason to run more than one. Adelphophagy makes running multiples less likely, if anything. A "Target warbeast" animus at least provides a reason to run a few, even if they are just as animus slaves. Personally, without a free charge i don't think i would ever use their current one...
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Post by piedpiperwtf on Apr 9, 2017 14:56:44 GMT
counterblast: Oh crap! Did Lylyth 1 just add another fury to my charging beast?
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