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Post by deadlyninjacat on Apr 3, 2017 22:10:25 GMT
Like the title says.
Playing a buddy and he loves using the immortal spam under zaal2.
Since I play Ret I was just wondering what this list is scared of and if casters such as Kaelyssa or Vyros1 have game into this list.
Thank you skorne players for any help or opinions.
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psyllus
Junior Strategist
Posts: 119
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Post by psyllus on Apr 3, 2017 22:45:07 GMT
Souls and Vengeance are two of the big mechanics behind that list:
Souls - RFP stops the soul train. Vengeance - If you can kill a whole unit, it can't vengeance.
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demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Apr 4, 2017 0:01:08 GMT
corrosion effects and extra dice on construct models are the go to choices. Focus on killing the Ancestral Guardians first, that will slow them down to a snail's pace. Engaging them first is always a big immortal damage killer... but seriously the only real counter to perfected Zaal2 Exhalted lists is corrosion damage and capitalizing on the fact that they are constructs. To explain the corrosion bit real quick, it's an auto 1 damage per turn until you roll it out; immortals are a piece of cake to hit but their 17 armor is a Female Dog to break through so auto damage that negates armor will auto kill them.
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Post by josephkerr on Apr 4, 2017 3:46:09 GMT
Issyria with a hyperion and all the guns has game. Remove Despoiler during her feat and watch pow 13 immortals try and kill arm 21 hyperion. Also, it won't happen all the time, but Hype's crit Consume doesnt trigger vengeance.
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demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Apr 5, 2017 16:29:16 GMT
why would immortals be attacking hyperion? I'd much prefer to make them incorporeal and just move right through him to Issyria. with MAT 8 thanks to Hakaar, they shouldn't have much trouble doing so. Zaal2 Exalted list loves for you to kill a couple constructs; they all hand out souls and trigger the AGs and Hakaar's Rightous vengeance. I will admit that Hyperion is a beast, but we have plenty of ways AROUND him. AG gives +2 movement and you usually field 2-3 in a Zaal2 Exalted list.
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didder
Junior Strategist
Posts: 166
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Post by didder on Apr 5, 2017 16:47:38 GMT
Offensive magic spells that can scalpel out the Extoller Advocates early are very crippling to this list. Sac pawn doesn't work against them, neither does Krea aura. Orin's/Vision is the only defense.
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demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Apr 5, 2017 17:21:36 GMT
very true, that's generally why people play them pretty far back. The key is to use them just to move the first brick unhindered, then save the one in the far back for the real battle. It's not like I haven't seen Zaal2 Exalted lose, just that there is a constant fear of the list. When you go to tournaments you'll see several people pull out tailored lists against it, which allows you to switch to a Mak2 or Xerxis1 double kitty list. Nothing quite like a waterfall of flanking kitties to piss off heavy armored bricks and high POW, low mat/rat units.
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blade
Demo Gamer
Posts: 17
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Post by blade on Apr 5, 2017 18:45:00 GMT
What's the crazy good zaal2 and immortals list ? I've always loved the immortal models!
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Post by zerodaimaru on Apr 5, 2017 18:53:28 GMT
The one I see (and run) most often is Zaal2, 3 Max units of Immortals 2 with UA, 2 - 3 AGs, Hakaar, Beasts to taste (I personally run Shaman, Drake, Krea, Aggy) I also run Saxon in my list for Pathfinder (trying desperatly to find 1 more point so I can upgrade him to a Tycom) because my meta tends to run a bit more terrain dense then I usually see on the webs.
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didder
Junior Strategist
Posts: 166
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Post by didder on Apr 5, 2017 19:09:28 GMT
The one I see (and run) most often is Zaal2, 3 Max units of Immortals 2 with UA, 2 - 3 AGs, Hakaar, Beasts to taste (I personally run Shaman, Drake, Krea, Aggy) I also run Saxon in my list for Pathfinder (trying desperatly to find 1 more point so I can upgrade him to a Tycom) because my meta tends to run a bit more terrain dense then I usually see on the webs. You could try switching the Drake for a Razor Wurm. A soul-glutted Zaal can afford spiny growth, and he is very susceptible to assassination. Would free the point up for that Ty Comm.
To the topic at hand, multiple scather templates from the likes of Ravagores can be a big headache for immortals. That's one I forgot about. They can incorporeal through it, but the scathers usually would come out and do their damage the turn before immortals have started dying and allowing them to turn incorporeal.
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Post by zerodaimaru on Apr 5, 2017 19:37:58 GMT
The one I see (and run) most often is Zaal2, 3 Max units of Immortals 2 with UA, 2 - 3 AGs, Hakaar, Beasts to taste (I personally run Shaman, Drake, Krea, Aggy) I also run Saxon in my list for Pathfinder (trying desperatly to find 1 more point so I can upgrade him to a Tycom) because my meta tends to run a bit more terrain dense then I usually see on the webs. You could try switching the Drake for a Razor Wurm. A soul-glutted Zaal can afford spiny growth, and he is very susceptible to assassination. Would free the point up for that Ty Comm. Without wanting to drag this to far off topic (and if this conversation is to continue after this a new thread might be best) But unfortunately I can't cut a beast to make the points as I'm already using all of Zaals beast points and not more so cutting the Drake down to a worm doesn't actually get me a point I can use.
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skormedlover87
Junior Strategist
Desperately searching for days off to game...
Posts: 517
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Post by skormedlover87 on Apr 5, 2017 20:22:33 GMT
Elara2 can annoy them by saying no Incorporeal on a unit. Retaliatory Strike helps a bit with attrition. Dahlia and Skareth puts out continuous corrosion. Ghost Snipers auto kill. Many Zaal2 lists lack ways to deal with Nayl, few guns, no throws... Go nuts.
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regleant
Junior Strategist
Sometimes things go right
Posts: 267
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Post by regleant on Apr 6, 2017 5:41:04 GMT
I am very interested in Zaal2 and ran him in MK2. In comparing him to Makeda1, they both, generally, seem to do the same thing: Deliver a mass amount of infantry troops relatively safely and provide a to-hit buff when they get there. But I find Makeda1 actually has more tools (e.g. Molik, Shield Guards) than Zaal2 and always fall back onto her. Am I looking at it wrong? I would love some comparisons by those who prefer Zaal2.
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demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Apr 6, 2017 8:40:20 GMT
infantry brick < exhalted brick
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regleant
Junior Strategist
Sometimes things go right
Posts: 267
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Post by regleant on Apr 6, 2017 10:04:29 GMT
infantry brick < exhalted brick So.., personal choice? Or can you back up your statement with more words? I love my exalted with Zaal1. I can see how they can be great with Zaal2. I don't see how they are better than my Ferox / Cetrati / Legends with Makeda1.
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