twity
Junior Strategist
Posts: 179 
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Post by twity on Sept 29, 2017 22:58:03 GMT
OoA now gives a free solo per 30 points of beasts.
Ravens now makes your opponent lose ambush instead of AD, but you can take the Hellmouth in it.
Seems like OoA is taking a hit in the form of one to two solos, but you can still take the Sorceress and Helion as that free solo.
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Post by dxman on Sept 30, 2017 0:39:18 GMT
Wow, I was almost certain that they'd restrict Apparition in Oracles to faction models. Lylyth1 + Farrow Brigands ahoy?
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Post by er3mita222 on Sept 30, 2017 1:02:11 GMT
Now we can take hellmouths in ravens.
Seems good!
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Post by chillychinaman on Sept 30, 2017 1:06:33 GMT
Wow, I was almost certain that they'd restrict Apparition in Oracles to faction models. Lylyth1 + Farrow Brigands ahoy? "Non-warlock Legion unit." |
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Post by dxman on Sept 30, 2017 1:51:28 GMT
Wow, I was almost certain that they'd restrict Apparition in Oracles to faction models. Lylyth1 + Farrow Brigands ahoy? "Non-warlock Legion unit." Reading is fundamental. Not sure how I missed it. Better to notice now than in the middle of a game, thanks. |
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Post by chillychinaman on Sept 30, 2017 1:57:20 GMT
"Non-warlock Legion unit." Reading is fundamental. Not sure how I missed it. Better to notice now than in the middle of a game, thanks. No problem, not that Brigands are a bad choice with Lylyth1 is you weren't maxing out on point anyway. |
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Post by dxman on Sept 30, 2017 2:41:21 GMT
Reading is fundamental. Not sure how I missed it. Better to notice now than in the middle of a game, thanks. No problem, not that Brigands are a bad choice with Lylyth1 is you weren't maxing out on point anyway. During the experimental period, I'd been operating under the assumption of how it turned out. Been using Apparition on the Spawing Vessel to pick up dead pigs, so I'll just continue doing that. The theme change did force me to drop 4 points from the list, but there was already a bit of wiggle room, so it should be workable. |
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Post by fdf86 on Sept 30, 2017 3:07:39 GMT
I'm not sure the OoA nerf will do what they hope it will in fixing list diversity. People will just suck up the free solo loss, remove the solo that was the least useful and keep the rest of their lists exactly the same. It's also ironic that in a theme all about mobility and speed(ravens), the add a unit that cannot move at all and I don't think adding hellmouths fixes it either because it's still lacking what it always was which is punching power.
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Post by cainuslupus on Sept 30, 2017 11:00:16 GMT
I'm not sure the OoA nerf will do what they hope it will in fixing list diversity. People will just suck up the free solo loss, remove the solo that was the least useful and keep the rest of their lists exactly the same. It's also ironic that in a theme all about mobility and speed(ravens), the add a unit that cannot move at all and I don't think adding hellmouths fixes it either because it's still lacking what it always was which is punching power. I'm pretty sure they've put no thought into Legion changes whatsoever, they are copy-paste from changes to other themes. They needed to put Hellmouth somewhere, maybe they though Pre-CiD themes doesn't count? Thematically Ravens are the dumbest place to put them. "Hey, we're extra fast paced scout force, also, before battle - we planted a potato!". |
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Post by HauRukh on Sept 30, 2017 11:38:36 GMT
PP insider: "In these two themes, we removed the benefit that stripped Advance Deployment from opponents and replaced it with a benefit that takes away Ambush. While on some models Advance Deployment is simply an added benefit, other models are designed around being able to advance deploy, and these theme forces disproportionately affected those models, making them difficult to use."
Well, of course this reasoning makes sense. Luckily ambushing units are not at all designed around their ambush ability, and are typically far from heaving victim stats otherwise...
We also would not want a theme benefit that only does anything in 50% of all cases to begin with to actually hurt the opponent when it comes into play...
I mean, it is their choice to remove one of the most thematic / fluff-fitting theme benefits that I have seen so far, but maybe they should think a bit before giving random explanations for their reasons.
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eauc
Junior Strategist
Posts: 209
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Post by eauc on Sept 30, 2017 13:42:02 GMT
Well, after Pagani try to explain to me that I should pay 7pts for 3 summon vortex to screen my warlocks, I stopped caring for their explanations.
For some months I've been afraid that nobody is driving the Legion developpement in PP anymore. The faction was overall fine at the start of mk3 IMHO, but all the changes and releases since then didn't give me any feeling for a direction in developpement, or any sense of reality for what opposition the faction is facing and what changes/new options would be needed.
The Throne was a really good upgrade IMO, but honestly it was just like "hey let's just say it makes 200% more attacks, has 50% more boxes, and cost 3 points less" - a kind of design process anybody would do when they're not sure where they actually want to go with an unplayed model.
Now the theme rework reads like "hey let's just put hellmouths anywhere and nerf oracles instead of thinking hard about why the other 2 themes are never played - maybe they'll play them more when they really have no other options ?". Is there any other faction where important, playable infantry like swordmen, is restricted to a theme were there are so few decent beasts choice available ?
I really start to fear that the Legion CID brings a rework of Saeryn and/or Bethayne, and they "somehow" find an unbelievable way to actually nerf them.
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Post by cainuslupus on Sept 30, 2017 13:54:18 GMT
Saddly I'm in the same boat.
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Lanz
Junior Strategist
Posts: 685
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Post by Lanz on Sept 30, 2017 16:09:39 GMT
Oracles change was unnecessary, but not awful. The second hellion was largely a redundancy anyways. The change from AD to ambush on ravens is also pretty much a dud. I guess PP overvalues handing out ambush to units that are bad at ambushing in so many of their theme lists. A useless rule for countering another largely-useless rule except in the very specific case of a list designed around ambush, which now has to worry about significant match-up skews ruining the whole list.
I do like getting hellmouths in ravens, though. That's nice.
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Post by Ecalsneerg on Sept 30, 2017 16:17:01 GMT
At least we can run Hellmouth+Deathstalkers in theme?
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Post by cainuslupus on Sept 30, 2017 16:35:18 GMT
At least we can run Hellmouth+Deathstalkers in theme? It's not a thing anymore. It was errated long time ago. |
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