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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Jul 19, 2017 12:54:14 GMT
Err I don't really think Themes made anything competitive. I would attribute Ghost Fleet much more to people not being used to it, as opposed to the theme being that vital.
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Post by pangurban on Jul 19, 2017 12:57:39 GMT
Err I don't really think Themes made anything competitive. I would attribute Ghost Fleet much more to people not being used to it, as opposed to the theme being that vital. Not dudespam related, but: Convergence. Dudespam related: banes and exemplars. Arguably kayazy.
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Post by Rowdy Dragon on Jul 19, 2017 13:10:03 GMT
Not dudespam related, but: Convergence. Dudespam related: banes and exemplars. Arguably kayazy. .....Banes wen't through Cid, the Convergence hasn't really changed, Exemplars are being duded? and Kayazy: No.
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Post by octaviusmaximus on Jul 19, 2017 14:34:36 GMT
Literally #fakenews? Cmon, you have no evidence for your claim. PP have stated that this is what was planned. Feel free to disagree, but you know what they say about extraordinary claims. They also stated at one point that they wanted the meta to be 50% theme 50% non theme so i feel like they maybe change their minds from time to time. If you are talking all players, including casual and competitive, i'll imagine that number remains pretty true. Competitive players, though, will be playing theme.
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Post by W0lfBane on Jul 19, 2017 14:53:40 GMT
They also stated at one point that they wanted the meta to be 50% theme 50% non theme so i feel like they maybe change their minds from time to time. If you are talking all players, including casual and competitive, i'll imagine that number remains pretty true. Competitive players, though, will be playing theme. Way to move the goal post there buddy. I find the claim pp makes that this is all according to plan and none of it was reactinary an extraordinary in itself. Especially with previous statements
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Post by octaviusmaximus on Jul 19, 2017 15:13:57 GMT
If you are talking all players, including casual and competitive, i'll imagine that number remains pretty true. Competitive players, though, will be playing theme. Way to move the goal post there buddy. I find the claim pp makes that this is all according to plan and none of it was reactinary an extraordinary in itself. Especially with previous statements Way to base your claim on a quote without directly quoting, M80. Of course nothing is directly to plan because you can't plan for people. I spoke with Hungerford Today on his Twitch stream and he said that he wished that PP would have released more themes with Mk 3 because that was the direction Mk 3 was going. Themes are the way forces are designed to be used. They aren't reactionary unless you decide that PP has been lying this whole time in some kind of a conspiracy. PP make changes on the fly, they have changed things when they felt it needed too, but Themes haven't changed. They were and are the way to play the game competitively.
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isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
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Post by isotope on Jul 19, 2017 15:26:28 GMT
People hate on harby but a guy around her plays her with only 3 light jacks and all dudes and he wrecks stuff.
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Post by Big Fat Troll on Jul 19, 2017 16:21:49 GMT
Pat Dunford's Heretic list is quite impressive. 2x max Hollow Men with CA and 2x (might have been 3) max Dread Rots, no Death Knell, because they're all single-wound anyway. The Arcana are extremely dangerous and it will take us all some time to learn how to play around them.
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Post by Big Fat Troll on Jul 19, 2017 16:24:21 GMT
Banes are awesome and I'm glad they made the entrance that they did. Aaron built a fantastic list.
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Post by W0lfBane on Jul 19, 2017 17:05:49 GMT
Way to move the goal post there buddy. I find the claim pp makes that this is all according to plan and none of it was reactinary an extraordinary in itself. Especially with previous statements Way to base your claim on a quote without directly quoting, M80. Of course nothing is directly to plan because you can't plan for people. I spoke with Hungerford Today on his Twitch stream and he said that he wished that PP would have released more themes with Mk 3 because that was the direction Mk 3 was going. Themes are the way forces are designed to be used. They aren't reactionary unless you decide that PP has been lying this whole time in some kind of a conspiracy. PP make changes on the fly, they have changed things when they felt it needed too, but Themes haven't changed. They were and are the way to play the game competitively. Unfortunately i don't have the time to go look up the precise quote that has been handed down the generations. I'm sure you'll forgive me. "That was the direction mk3 was going" could mean that that's the direction they were planning for or could mean that's where the game was going but we didn't know that at the time and i wish we did. But that's not the direct quote so i guess i can't really use that argument.
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Post by pangurban on Jul 19, 2017 17:12:56 GMT
They also stated at one point that they wanted the meta to be 50% theme 50% non theme so i feel like they maybe change their minds from time to time. If you are talking all players, including casual and competitive, i'll imagine that number remains pretty true. Competitive players, though, will be playing theme. I don't think anyone considers "all players, including casual and competitive" the meta. Nor should they: players who never, ever play against one another really aren't part of the same meta.
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Post by W0lfBane on Jul 19, 2017 17:14:55 GMT
On another note i almost exclusively play dude spam or mixed lists. Rarely do i play jack spam. But it's from a fun standpoint rather than a competitive standing. Hanging easy access to weapon master helps cause then you have a way to deal with the enemy heavies
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Post by greytemplar on Jul 19, 2017 20:08:13 GMT
Way to move the goal post there buddy. I find the claim pp makes that this is all according to plan and none of it was reactinary an extraordinary in itself. Especially with previous statements Way to base your claim on a quote without directly quoting, M80. Of course nothing is directly to plan because you can't plan for people. I spoke with Hungerford Today on his Twitch stream and he said that he wished that PP would have released more themes with Mk 3 because that was the direction Mk 3 was going. Themes are the way forces are designed to be used. They aren't reactionary unless you decide that PP has been lying this whole time in some kind of a conspiracy. PP make changes on the fly, they have changed things when they felt it needed too, but Themes haven't changed. They were and are the way to play the game competitively. Themes didn't used to be the end all be all of competitive play. Certain themes were competitive for sure. Many others were not. To claim that themes were always intended to be the only way to play the game competitively(which is exactly what you are saying) is completely wrong. Maybe PP wants that to be the case now. Thats not a good thing, because they're frankly awful at designing balanced themes. So yeah, PP's wish for themes to become the standard is not a good direction for the game. Stop fanboi'ing that it's like the best thing ever and we shouldn't question what PP says. Ideally, yes, all themes would be competitive. But so should playing outside of a theme. What themes should be is a set of list building restrictions that compensates for that restriction to allow a particular list style that wouldn't be possible outside vanilla. But thats not what themes are shaping up to be sadly. Many of the benefits of the bad themes are just awful. Many of the OP themes have benefits that are way too powerful. Many themes are just lacking in flavor. Thats the problem. PP is really REALLY bad at designing themes that are both competitive and not OP. They're all over the board. If PP wants themes to be the way to play the game competitively, they're really throwing balance completely out the window. Because of this, PP should not be trying to force the game towards more themes. They're not good at designing themes. If they were, they wouldn't have let such obvious stinkers and OP themes slip through the cracks. They'd be a little more consistent.
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Post by Swampmist on Jul 19, 2017 20:21:12 GMT
From what Hungerford said, the plan from the beginning was to have theme forces be the basis for comp Warmahordes. This has been the case from the inception of mk3.
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Post by lordsizzlor on Jul 19, 2017 20:28:09 GMT
Themes are fine; troop spam is just as fun as balanced lists.
The balance with the game are just part of being a new system and would actually be worse if themes didn't break down an expansive game into smaller more manageble sections.
I know it seems like a year is a long time bit it isn't.
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