blight
Baby's First Wargame
Posts: 9 
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Post by blight on Jul 13, 2017 21:37:34 GMT
Played a Legion mirror match today (SR 2017) and struggled a bit into a Lylyth 3 list in Ravens of War. The list isn't that important (Lylyth assassinated Vayl by herself after I failed to assassinate Lylyth) but really felt on the backfoot trying to protect Vayl from being assassinated all game (shocker: she is really squishy). My list was: conflictchamber.com/#ca111b_-0tbtaPaQbvcObfeJeJaObbbbbebeb9b9gsLegion Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Oracles of Annihilation (Vayl 2) Vayl, Consul of Everblight [+28] - Angelius [17] - Carnivean [19] - Naga Nightlurker [8] - Nephilim Bloodseer [8] - Nephilim Bolt Thrower [11] - Neraph [12] - Neraph [12] - Seraph [14] Blighted Nyss Shepherd [1] Blighted Nyss Shepherd [1] Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion [0(6)] Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion [0(6)] The Forsaken [0(4)] The Forsaken [0(4)] Bunker (Objective) [0] Probably should have stayed back and not gone for the assassination as I was up on attrition but the fact remains: Vayl didn't feel like a good matchup into Lylyth 3. Any ideas on good Legion drops into Lylyth 3? And to broaden the thread a bit: what are good drops into the mirror match? |
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Whiskie
Junior Strategist
Posts: 288
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Post by Whiskie on Jul 13, 2017 22:48:44 GMT
Legion has a lot of casters that are on the squishy end. That's just sort of par for the course when you're an elf.
That means Lylyth3 can prey on most of our caster stable since her ideal target is a squishy caster that'll die easily once rendered stationary.
Thagrosh1 is one Warlock who does better against Lylyth3 than most. He can still die if he gets made stationary and focused down by a bunch of other shots but is safer than most since he has a good number of boxes. Thags1 is also quite strong into most of the rest of Legion, I haven't played against any Legion Warlocks with Thagrosh1 that I felt especially disadvantaged against. Ultimately though when playing against Lylyth3 I always feel most comfortable playing Lylyth3 myself. She's actually very bad at assassinating herself so the Lylyth3 mirror usually comes down to attrition/scenario instead of caster kill.
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Post by maximumhippo on Jul 14, 2017 7:08:35 GMT
Whiskie is on point here. Thagrosh1 seems like the best answer we have to Lylyth3. Other than a straight mirror of Lylyth3 into Lylyth3 which, frankly, sounds miserable. I don't have any regular legion players locally so i've never come up against it and anything I've got to say is primarily conjecture.
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hawkoon
Baby's First Wargame
Posts: 2
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Post by hawkoon on Jul 14, 2017 8:22:05 GMT
The list I played was this: conflictchamber.com/#ca201b_-0lcVaPcqbfbqb9aYb3b4Legion Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Ravens of War (Lylyth 3) Lylyth, Reckoning of Everblight [+29] - Angelius [17] - Archangel [37] - Nephilim Bolt Thrower [11] Annyssa Ryvaal [8] The Forsaken [0(4)] Blighted Nyss Raptors (max) [18] Strider Scouts [9] - Strider Scout Officer & Musician [4] I'm not so sure Vayl2 was such a bad matchup as it felt a lot like a coin toss to be honest. Blight had some bad dice in his assassination attempt and I had some hot dice in mine. I did however make a fair amount of placement mistakes, as this was my first game with Lylyth3 so I ended up practically sacrificing my Archangel because of a placement error. It survived a combined attack from a neraph and angelius, but I ended up charging it into a carnivean the turn after and forgot it had spiny growth. It lost it's body after the charge attack and it's mind after the second. (charging a severely damaged beast into spiny growth turns out to be a really bad idea...) It really was a game of placement, and I'm glad we didn't play on the clock. I have a feeling I spent far too much time measuring distances this game. If I were to play the same matchup again, I think I'd really like a carnivean in the list to up Lylyths armour to 20, but I don't really know what to sacrifice in the list for it. |
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Whiskie
Junior Strategist
Posts: 288
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Post by Whiskie on Jul 14, 2017 12:27:00 GMT
You could fit both a Carnivean and an Angelius and still have a point left over if you replace the Archangel. This would obviously require dropping out of Ravens of War though and you may be playing in Ravens for a specific reason so chances are you're going to have to go without Spiny Growth. Lylyth3 doesn't usually require a defensive animus because her incredible mobility and long threat ranges allow her to stay pretty far away from danger. The exception to this rule is if you're playing her into Sloan or something similar.
If you're trying to make the most optimized list possible I don't think the Archangel has much of a place right now. It's expensive, very squishy and incredibly vulnerable to guns which are usually the match ups that Lylyth3 wants to play into in the first place. It can't benefit from Windwall which can make it an expensive paperweight against Cygnar, Winter Guard Kommand, Gun Bunny spam and so on.
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hawkoon
Baby's First Wargame
Posts: 2
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Post by hawkoon on Jul 15, 2017 14:23:25 GMT
The list isn't intended to be optimal, but to be a viable option to field the Archangel. So, yes, I could probably do better with something else, but I like to see the big gal on the table, and Lylyth3 seems like the best caster for it.
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Post by cainuslupus on Jul 15, 2017 16:43:02 GMT
Played a Legion mirror match today (SR 2017) and struggled a bit into a Lylyth 3 list in Ravens of War. The list isn't that important (Lylyth assassinated Vayl by herself after I failed to assassinate Lylyth) but really felt on the backfoot trying to protect Vayl from being assassinated all game (shocker: she is really squishy). My list was: conflictchamber.com/#ca111b_-0tbtaPaQbvcObfeJeJaObbbbbebeb9b9gsLegion Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Oracles of Annihilation (Vayl 2) Vayl, Consul of Everblight [+28] - Angelius [17] - Carnivean [19] - Naga Nightlurker [8] - Nephilim Bloodseer [8] - Nephilim Bolt Thrower [11] - Neraph [12] - Neraph [12] - Seraph [14] Blighted Nyss Shepherd [1] Blighted Nyss Shepherd [1] Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion [0(6)] Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion [0(6)] The Forsaken [0(4)] The Forsaken [0(4)] Bunker (Objective) [0] Probably should have stayed back and not gone for the assassination as I was up on attrition but the fact remains: Vayl didn't feel like a good matchup into Lylyth 3. Any ideas on good Legion drops into Lylyth 3? And to broaden the thread a bit: what are good drops into the mirror match? Our best mirror caster is probably Kallus2. Whole army being resistant to fire is kinda big deal, he is also quite sturdy. |
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blight
Baby's First Wargame
Posts: 9
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Post by blight on Jul 15, 2017 17:18:55 GMT
Kallus 2 sure looks interesting in the mirror match but haven't really wrapped my head around a viable build with him yet. Gonna be trying Thagrosh 1. He should be able to survive with some transfers and can rival Lylyth's attrition game (especially in Oracles).
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Post by snotling on Jul 15, 2017 19:36:08 GMT
I really like lylyth1 in legion mirror. She is quite good at obe-roubding legion heavys. And casters. xD.
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