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Post by Big Fat Troll on Jul 2, 2017 8:04:01 GMT
I want to pair this list with the Dancocks-Trollock Grissel 2 build because that is the one list I am most familiar with and play best. I started thinking about Ragnor in the first place to cover that list's weaknesses against gun lines and control, but that leaves one big hole in my coverage, and that is Ghost Fleet. To what extent can I close that with specialists? IIRC they are cutting the number down from 40 so I would not be able to swap out her Mountain King.
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gdnerd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 656 
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Post by gdnerd on Jul 2, 2017 16:44:47 GMT
FWIW a Rage and Stone Strength'd Slag Troll by itself should trivially one round a Celestial Fulcrum if you can get it onto it. So depending on how popular fulcrums are, even with a shrunken specialists pool you should be able to fit the solution in there. I believe a Rage and Stone Strength'd Earthborn also can do the trick, also without worrying about its guns or any terrain they put in the way (heck it does it even if you need to trample there for some reason). Following that, Maulers and Mulg should also do the job. I can't offer you an easy shooting solution to dealing with them, which means you're going to have to deal with Tanith's admonition in some fashion (or use whelps to bait it/ lock them in).
Unless I'm missing someone that leaves you with Ragnor or some flavor of Doomshaper. I might be a broken wheel here proselytizing for Doom2 but he crushes this. He'll generically beat pretty much every flavor of Circle including this one, and has ADR so you don't have to keep the dead weight of slags in matchups where they aren't helpful. His slags are so fast on feat turn you can failcharge one to force admo, then send the second one in after they've backed up if you don't feel like rising doomy/don't take a runebearer.
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Post by Big Fat Troll on Jul 2, 2017 18:22:13 GMT
gdnerd That's a good point. Not only the Slags but the Earthborns would be a tremendous asset against the Fulcrum. The Circle players could beat Doomy 2 if they would go back to putting a dedicated assassin in their pairings, which they probably will in SR17. Nonetheless, I take it your counsel is to play him and this Ragnor list? I feel like Grissel 2 is woefully under-rated, and there is something to be said for the dark horse factor. I'll admit that part of it is I feel like I have something to prove since I'm the one who has been warning people about how nasty she can be for a year. And, like I said, there is much to be said for familiarity with the caster and list. Especially at my skill level, I will make many more mistakes if I am less practiced with the list. Recently I have played Doomy 2 more than Ragnor, but pairing those two would leave far too many gaps in coverage. I don't mind Ragnor. I just have to constantly remind myself to be patient and let him do his conservative defensive thing.
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gdnerd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 656
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Post by gdnerd on Jul 2, 2017 18:37:25 GMT
gdnerd That's a good point. Not only the Slags but the Earthborns would be a tremendous asset against the Fulcrum. The Circle players could beat Doomy 2 if they would go back to putting a dedicated assassin in their pairings, which they probably will in SR17. Nonetheless, I take it your counsel is to play him and this Ragnor list? I feel like Grissel 2 is woefully under-rated, and there is something to be said for the dark horse factor. I'll admit that part of it is I feel like I have something to prove since I'm the one who has been warning people about how nasty she can be for a year. And, like I said, there is much to be said for familiarity with the caster and list. Especially at my skill level, I will make many more mistakes if I am less practiced with the list. Recently I have played Doomy 2 more than Ragnor, but pairing those two would leave far too many gaps in coverage. I don't mind Ragnor. I just have to constantly remind myself to be patient and let him do his conservative defensive thing. Depends on what you're seeing. If you have fear of death in your heart, Ragnor is probably a good choice. If you want to mow down infantry, Grim1 has been doing work. Grissel2 is solid, but I don't like her pairing with Doom2. Doom2 hates Cephalyx, Hayley, Fyanna, and Ghost Fleet. Grim has some actual game into all of those IMO. |
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Post by Big Fat Troll on Jul 2, 2017 21:07:28 GMT
gdnerd It's hard to say what I'll be up against. Riverfront Rumble is in Minneapolis, and I don't know much about their local meta, and a regional event is different still, and it is one of the very first big tourneys in SR17, so it's hard to say. From what little I do know, I'm guessing lots of Khador and Legion and enough Circle, Cryx, and Mercs to be worried about. I cite Ghost Fleet in particular because it's been doing well, and I think it is only stronger in SR17, and I consider that to be the biggest weakness of pairing Grissel 2 with Ragnor. Fyanna is also right up there. Cygnar is a little less popular in the midwest but they can never be discounted. Now, that said, the Grissel 2 list is better against infantry than most people realize. Discord on the MK can be annoying or even devastating, situationally, as can his sweeps and sprays. Grissel can both place hazards and spray with RAT 6, which can really do a number on infantry. Deflection can be a decisive edge against those who can't boost or CRA, like Rocketeers. Two Bombers will get good scatters eventually, and POW 8 blast damage threatens most units. The Axer has Thresher. So given the new roster and SR17 rules, what do you think that A) you would play and B) I should watch out for and/or try to cover with specialists if this is indeed my pairing? conflictchamber.com/#c7201b_-0bfL9D5-5-5L5L0hbL7d6R0l0m6n6n___-0b7e0r0rc60h0j7dfJ6R0k0mTrollbloods Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] The Power of Dhunia (Ragnor 1) Ragnor Skysplitter, The Runemaster [+30] - Dire Troll Mauler [15] - Earthborn Dire Troll [15] - Earthborn Dire Troll [15] - Slag Troll [10] - Slag Troll [10] - Troll Axer [10] - Trollkin Runebearer [0(4)] Janissa Stonetide [0(4)] Troll Whelps [0(4)] Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes (max) [9] - Stone Scribe Elder [3] Trollkin Runeshapers [9] Trollkin Runeshapers [9] Trollbloods Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] The Power of Dhunia (Grissel 2) Grissel Bloodsong, Marshal of the Kriels [+27] - Dire Troll Bomber [19] - Dire Troll Bomber [19] - Mountain King [36] - Troll Axer [10] - Troll Bouncer [9] Janissa Stonetide [0(4)] Northkin Shaman [0(4)] Troll Whelps [0(4)] Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes (min) [6] - Stone Scribe Elder [3]
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Post by Big Fat Troll on Jul 2, 2017 21:24:25 GMT
So let's parse it out:
Can Counter Incorporeal:
Both lists: Elder, Janissa, caster weapons (though Grissel's are much better)
Ragnor: Runeshapers, Hex Blast, Runebearer
Grissel: Shaman
And Grissel's list is much better at troop swarms.
Whose Feat is better VS Ghost Fleet? I'd say Ragnor but maybe not?
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gdnerd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 656
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Post by gdnerd on Jul 2, 2017 21:59:52 GMT
Riverfront Rumble is after July 19th, right? Why not try a Kriel Company version?
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Post by Big Fat Troll on Jul 2, 2017 22:06:00 GMT
Riverfront Rumble is after July 19th, right? Why not try a Kriel Company version? It's the 22nd. Did they say something about when KC was legal to play? Or how much it's changing from what we last saw? Do you not value the RFP and +2 deploy from Band very much? |
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mattmcd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 521
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Post by mattmcd on Jul 2, 2017 22:15:20 GMT
Riverfront Rumble is after July 19th, right? Why not try a Kriel Company version? Is that when No Quarter drops? I was trying to look that up. |
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gdnerd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 656
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Post by gdnerd on Jul 2, 2017 23:30:14 GMT
Riverfront Rumble is after July 19th, right? Why not try a Kriel Company version? Is that when No Quarter drops? I was trying to look that up. |
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Post by Big Fat Troll on Jul 3, 2017 0:06:33 GMT
Is Kriel Company in that one? |
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mattmcd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 521
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Post by mattmcd on Jul 3, 2017 0:28:23 GMT
Yes. Confirmed from PP that Kriel Company will be released with the next No Quarter. And that release schedule has it dropping on July 19th.
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