gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Dec 12, 2018 19:43:32 GMT
Releases this week or next
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Dec 12, 2018 19:43:17 GMT
Agonizers count as Titans.
Unlimited minion solos and Chiron in DoA
Marketh and free solos now in IWh
Ancestral Guardians in MoW
Void Spirits for all themes with Mordikaar
Ranged beasts allowed in MoW
Molik Karn in IWh
SG in MoW counts for free points
MoW can take small or medium based solos for free
Sentinel gains recoil, Solider gains Swarm, both gain Snacking
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Dec 12, 2018 18:40:11 GMT
Dev chat happened. OMG. So much
I don't know where to begin. ALL GOOD
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Dec 11, 2018 13:32:16 GMT
Zaal2 goes in Exalted, obviously. Makeda3, assuming she is near her week3 CiD version, will be awesome and goes in IWH. Morgul1 can pretty much only run successfully in IWH, and certainly not in Exalted. Hexeris2 will most likely remain on the shelf, unless you really need a dedicated anti infantry drop that isn't Exalted.
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Dec 10, 2018 14:41:30 GMT
I'd suggest an alternative is having actual interplay between the models. Big, tough models getting killed in an activation isn't just unthematic because of the timeframe, it's because the model doesn't get to respond at all. If two heavies could end up in melee and beat the stuffing out of each other then it'd fit the theme much better even if one did die in one round. Same with the little guys - it's often unthematic when a character solo gets dinged off the table in one hit without being able to respond. It's not that them going down in one hit doesn't make sense - it often does - it's that they just sit there flat-footed waiting for the enemy to hit them in the face as hard as they can. It'd make more sense if they got to respond. Honestly, I don't think 40k or AoS are all that great at this either, they're just better at it than Warmachine. I think a big point where we disagree on the terrain thing is that I really love dense urban terrain and multi-level terrain and Warmachine can't deal with either of those at all. It also doesn't really handle scenic terrain at all because the measurement is so finicky and binary (and this ties back into the heavies dying in one round without response bit) so people don't even want scenic elements on the table that don't have any effect, let alone ones that do. But all that said, the game is what it is and presumably most people who are still playing it have at least made their peace with its limitations, or even see them as positives. Maybe all it will ever be is a competitive game, and that's okay. I just don't think its shortcomings as a narrative ruleset get considered enough when people are talking about why its narrative leagues aren't that popular. Have you played Infinity? From what you are describing it sounds like you just want to play Infinity. It's a fantastic game with it's own set of flaws, but WarmaHordes it is not. Implementing those kind of things would require a fundamental redesign of the game and honestly work best in squad/skirmish level games like Infinity. I don't think it seems reasonable for a small battlefield game like WarmaHordes. This is why company of Iron was such a huge letdown for me, though. They just made WarmaHordes with cards and no battlegroup when they had the opportunity to make something really amazing like a Mordeheim or a tight competitive fantasy skirmish game. What WAS the problem with Company of Iron? I know zero people who ever played it, but I've never looked at the rules myself.
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Dec 7, 2018 18:48:49 GMT
using the rules to your advantage? i hate those guys It's not the guy that's the problem for me, it's the game.
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Dec 7, 2018 15:12:13 GMT
Which leads to another silly critique...that 3d terrain cant be used. I dont see this argument in 40k and yet 1 inch in wm/h is surelly the same as 1 inch in 40k. Anything that affects mesaurment will affect it regardless of the game system. And why would i be less accurate and precise in 40k than in wm/h? This just baffles me. Trust me, there have been issues and arguments in 40K regarding 3D terrain ever since True Line of Sight was implemented. Basically, you go by what your model can "see". That led and leads to loads of arguments about what a model can "see", especially when most 40K terrain is literally in ruins. I've even had arguments regarding what on a model can block Line of Sight between two models. The worst guy was someone who had a very crazy interpretation of English and often lied about other people's positions to strawman his case on numerous cases. True LoS was the nail on the coffin for GW games for me. I'll never play a game that uses it. I've seen enough crouching Wraithlords...
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Dec 6, 2018 15:59:15 GMT
Yeah turtles are almost impossible to ignore in most skorne lists. My only grumble with the turtle crutch we have as a faction is that the can be hard countered by effects they can't shake blind, paralysis etc. I also think Tibbers is excellent with X2 given the Overtake as you mentioned + shield guard+hyper make him hard to handle... Yeah, they have hard counters. In those instances, your other list needs to be ready. My other list is WoD Rasheth, so it stops most things except Shadow Bind, which I can usually just stay at range to avoid. Paralysis we have no answer for at all, since beasts can't shake it either. Fortunately all it does to turtles is to prevent them from charging. They can still trample and shoot. And again, you still have a Shield Guard to help deal with some of these effects too
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Dec 6, 2018 15:58:19 GMT
Turtles? It's a mistake to ignore them. Under his feat they are incredible and they give X2 the ability to threaten outside of his control range a well as give him something to hide behind when needed. Yeah turtles are almost impossible to ignore in most skorne lists. My only grumble with the turtle crutch we have as a faction is that the can be hard countered by effects they can't shake blind, paralysis etc. I also think Tibbers is excellent with X2 given the Overtake as you mentioned + shield guard+hyper make him hard to handle... Yeah, they have hard counters. In those instances, your other list needs to be ready. My other list is WoD Rasheth, so it stops most things except Shadow Bind, which I can usually just stay at range to avoid. Paralysis we have no answer for at all, since beasts can't shake it either. Fortunately all it does to turtles is to prevent them from charging. They can still trample and shoot.
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Dec 6, 2018 14:43:47 GMT
So this is my X2 list:
War Room Army
Skorne - boot camp Xerxes2
Theme: Imperial Warhost 2 / 2 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army
Xerxis, Fury of Halaak - WB: +28 - Basilisk Krea - PC: 0 - Agonizer - PC: 0 - Bronzeback Titan - PC: 18 (Battlegroup Points Used: 18) - Titan Gladiator - PC: 15 (Battlegroup Points Used: 10) - Tiberion - PC: 22
Siege Animantarax - PC: 17 Siege Animantarax - PC: 17
Feralgeist - PC: 2
Paingiver Beast Handlers - Leader & 3 Grunts: 5 Paingiver Beast Handlers - Leader & 3 Grunts: 5 Swamp Gobber Bellows Crew - Leader & 1 Grunt: 2
THEME: Imperial Warhost ---
GENERATED : 12/06/2018 09:31:15 BUILD ID : 2069.18-10-06
It's not at all intuitive to me, it was basically "forced" on me by a much better player. But ever since I started running it I've been doing much better. It's actually become my "sweeper" list.
General thoughts on it: Only 2 free choices? You need the swamp gobbers as a unit for scenario play.
Feralgeist? Same basic need as the Swamp Gobbers, but add on the following: all those big bases get in your way, but not for him. Also played right, he is one more activation required to kill your Agonizer or Tiberion. Plus one time he killed a Judicator, which is the best that ever happened to me.
Tiberion? From the top he appears way too expensive, but he adds so much in one package that you really want. Overtake + High MAT + Reach = answer for infantry that you desperately need. Shield Guard? Incredibly important with that many huge bases. Arm 21 + 32 boxes? Incredibly hard to remove. Here is the kicker: he really really works well with Hyper-Aggressive. Very few armies can deal with a Tibbers in their face, and the extra 6" to his threat range, triggered usually because of Shield Guard, pretty much gaurantees he will get you. Bonus, immovable object for awesome scenario presence. With Ignite and Feat, he single handedly killed a Victor, a Strike Tanker, and then finally Vlad 2. Simply having him on the table means you can threaten a turn your opponent can't deal with before you even consider popping your feat. I can't imagine making a list without him anymore.
Turtles? It's a mistake to ignore them. Under his feat they are incredible and they give X2 the ability to threaten outside of his control range a well as give him something to hide behind when needed.
Bronzeback? Most important part is how he helps manage your fury, but he is also basically Tibbers Jr. Not trivial to kill, crushes things all by his lonesome, and high enough MAT to threaten infantry too.
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Dec 4, 2018 21:34:09 GMT
Actually, clock is a good point. Most of us play on the clock as a good practice, but we don't end the game when the clock is over. We just keep playing, knowing that one of us needs to work on our clock skills.
Playing on the clock is really intimidating for most players, and I think a relaxed clock could go a long at to appealing to more players. Even just another 30 minutes could go a long way, though for certain sized events it would be prohibitive.
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Dec 4, 2018 21:29:02 GMT
Regarding balancing towards the 70% as opposed to the top 10% - you cannot do this for a number of reasons in games like this, and this is the primary reason why. Simply put, if you do not balance with the top 10% of the game in mind (and I would argue that it's more like top 1% to be honest), then those players will in short order 1) figure out some insanely broken combinations of things that most people would not have figured out 2) win an event with it which will 3) lead to everybody doing the same thing until 1) see above Ad nauseum. This is not a good idea from tons of different perspectives. By balancing the game towards the top players, PP ensures that nothing is broken or egregious while also being strong and interesting the game has to be balanced this way or else it will spiral out of control very quickly. This. I watched it happen time and again in GW games.
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Dec 4, 2018 18:23:46 GMT
Regarding casual vs competitive:
Maybe my meta is weird because of our giant Mark Howard Dojo league thing, but I have found competitive aspects help us pick up new players, not drive them away. The game's basic mechanics really aren't suited to narrative, fluffy games, so I think this is natural. We draw in new players pretty well just by merit of having a huge wealth of players to draw upon and a lot of support for newbies to draw on (mentorship, loaned models, play space, etc). Our player base stays a good size because old players stick around because the game had good enough competitive aspects that it keeps them interested, which in turn keeps them sticking around and helping out the new guys, as well as the meta regularly changing thanks to errata and CiDs. We have our share of "casual" nights too (or as we call them, Drunkmachine).
Tldr: all the aspects that PP has control over (steam roller rules, errata, meta shake ups) keep the game fresh and engaging for veteran players so they don't get bored. They don't get bored so they don't leave. So the player base grows gradually while never shrinking, which in turn makes it grow faster due to its perceived popularity.
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Dec 3, 2018 15:52:09 GMT
Let the doom saying and speculation begin
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Morghoul1
Nov 27, 2018 16:27:46 GMT
via mobile
Post by gordo on Nov 27, 2018 16:27:46 GMT
The biggest issue with Morgul1 is that Xerxes2 basically does everything he does better. Same spd buff that costs no fury, ignite is roughly the same damage buff, but rapport fixes MAT and control range issues. Feat is that even more. Plus Xerxes2 works great with Turtles, our best piece, where as Morgul does nothing for them. Morgul does bring a totally different and defensive feat, but it's very limited in both range and what it can target so... I'm telling you, Morghoul1 and Zadeesh1 are match made in heaven. Just remember to run with Zaadesh1 during your 1st turn to maximize First Blood threat range. Morgul1 definitely works better with Zaadesh1 for sure. More points too so you can fit in two units of whippers and still have points for a solo.
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