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Post by vasquez21 on Nov 12, 2020 20:41:37 GMT
Hello guys,
I am playing mostly trolls and khador, and doing it with my friend playing Legion.
He don't know english well so I thought that I will ask in his name about what you guys sugest vs Champions (sanguine bond & high def).
Most of the time our games are equal, but almost always when I am trying to play Champions in one of my list it's total dissaster for Legion.
There was some success with Anamag + double Chosens, but it's just one list to play, and most of the time he has to deploy it vs any of my list including Champions.
So my question is what would be your answer for that?
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Post by voidbender on Nov 16, 2020 15:38:44 GMT
Champs are certainly one of the more difficult things to handle about trolls. I haven't specifically teched for them, but this is how I've approached them in my games:
There is very little in legion that can go toe to toe with them. The champs will hit anything short of our flying beasts under Fyanna's feat, especially with help. They will also kill what they hit, especially on the charge.
If you're playing some of the most durable combinations (like buffed chosen) then you may be able to afford taking a round in melee if you deny them the charge. However, I very rarely play those lists.
In the lists I play, I accept that the champs will hit and kill anything they get to engage if more than 1 or 2 of them can get there (depending on their target). I out threat them though, and I have a few things that they have to be wary of. This often lets me play with ranges and terrain that blocks line of sight to pick off other things while I avoid them for a turn or two. They are usually in range for me to do a lot of damage by the time I have to deal with them.
When I do engage, I accept that they will use sanguine bond and I will have to do about 30 damage to remove the first one. However, that can also help me. If my opponent doesn't realize how much I'm committed to removing them this turn, I can do significant damage to all of them before removing the most vulnerable one. I don't bet on that though.
Some tools that help: Typhon sprays have worked well for me after debuffing def first, say with marked for death from the twins. In that case Rhyas would also be effective with flashing blade. Though twins might not be the most effective choice with the trolls' rfp theme, that's just the first unit def debuff that comes to mind.
In general, you want either a widespread hit buff or area/unit defense debuff combined with something that can repeatedly hit an area or have many attacks to do enough damage to wipe out the whole unit.
A second example that can work is Abby2 with shredders. Assuming Abby can kill something (likely especially with Golab or a scythian around), flanking shredders become a source of cheap and plentiful, incredibly accurate and decently hard-hitting attacks.
Kallus1 can have a lot of attacks with cheap infantry, and accurate with dark guidance in addition to any other hit fix if needed. His feat can also give you an extra turn tying them up.
Thrones seem to have potential, but have always kind of fallen flat for me vs trolls between their def and tough.
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Post by davycannonhound on Mar 10, 2021 0:09:36 GMT
Since Trolls all have Tough, Grievous Wounds will help tremendously with Trolls in general, not just Champions. Blightblades have Critical Grievous Wounds, Scythians have an animus that grants Grievous Wounds.
For high Def, the Scythian actually pulls some weight here as well thanks to Murderous.
In general, anything that buffs MAT will be helpful.
One other thing that will help greatly is guns for the approach. If you can at least soften your hard targets with a little bit of damage, or maybe even outright kill a few lighter targets, that will make your melee turn a lot easier. Angelius and Ravagores are both good warbeasts that have a strong presence both at range and in melee.
The new Virtues might be able to do some work, though that would be true against almost anything. They have guns on their own, along with assault, which fits into the "softening on the approach" theme.
Thrones buffed under Saeryn 1's feat MIGHT be able to take a hit from champions and survive for the next round, but I would only recommend this play if you can guarantee and alpha strike with the Thrones. If you don't hit first, then Saeryn 1's feat is just a crutch, not a benefit.
Vayl1 might also see some usefulness here with her spell Incite, which offers +2 to attack AND damage rolls. It requires her to play a bit forward, but it may be the best army-wide buff against the likes of Champions.
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