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Post by zwergenkrieger on Jun 10, 2020 13:11:03 GMT
Thanks for sharing this one.
While I understand the concept of that multiple Runeshaper lists (thanks to some discussions here) I don not really see the strenght of Grissel1 with that list.
I can´t stop asking myself why not Grissel2? She offers great assasination potential (possible 2nd win condition), Dash (which is nice with the auto knockdown of the runeshapers) and her feat at least plays to the strenghts of a force that doesn´t want to die.
So what is the selling point for Grissel1?
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Post by Kevin on Jun 10, 2020 13:39:41 GMT
Mat and PoW fixing, jojoing Mulg and better threat range for models. There is a difference between pow 16 shapers and pow 18.
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jarrow
Junior Strategist
Posts: 274
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Post by jarrow on Jun 11, 2020 5:47:34 GMT
Hoof it, guardian protector, calamity, hoof it, boudless charge, heroic ballad on feat turn. Problem of dash is that it won't help mulg and grissel2 is also quite helpless without bomber.
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Post by Trollock on Jun 11, 2020 8:51:30 GMT
Can I as why you deploy 4 whelps? I see reason to deploy one (or two) whelp on reckon2 to control friendly flag, but you still have plenty of other solos to do that and whelps biggest strength is that enemy can't rely where they will pop up. It most likely would have been better to keep more in reserve yes :S
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Post by Trollock on Jun 11, 2020 8:54:24 GMT
Thanks for sharing this one.
While I understand the concept of that multiple Runeshaper lists (thanks to some discussions here) I don not really see the strenght of Grissel1 with that list.
I can´t stop asking myself why not Grissel2? She offers great assasination potential (possible 2nd win condition), Dash (which is nice with the auto knockdown of the runeshapers) and her feat at least plays to the strenghts of a force that doesn´t want to die.
So what is the selling point for Grissel1?
The theory is that Calamity allows the Runeshapers to do a lot more work. I havent gotten it to work out so far though, and i too think Grissel 2 is worth looking at with Runeshapers. Dash is indeed very interesting. The list changes quite a bit then though, and your ARM cracking is not as good. You probably go something like Mauler/Bomber, though i have a version with less shapers and MK/Bomber in the BG that i plan to try out some time
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Post by zwergenkrieger on Jun 11, 2020 10:09:58 GMT
Hoof it, guardian protector, calamity, hoof it, boudless charge, heroic ballad on feat turn. Problem of dash is that it won't help mulg and grissel2 is also quite helpless without bomber. Yes, I was thinking about Grissel2 with 1-2 bombers of course. Thanks for sharing this one. While I understand the concept of that multiple Runeshaper lists (thanks to some discussions here) I don not really see the strenght of Grissel1 with that list. I can´t stop asking myself why not Grissel2? She offers great assasination potential (possible 2nd win condition), Dash (which is nice with the auto knockdown of the runeshapers) and her feat at least plays to the strenghts of a force that doesn´t want to die. So what is the selling point for Grissel1?
The theory is that Calamity allows the Runeshapers to do a lot more work. I havent gotten it to work out so far though, and i too think Grissel 2 is worth looking at with Runeshapers. Dash is indeed very interesting. The list changes quite a bit then though, and your ARM cracking is not as good. You probably go something like Mauler/Bomber, though i have a version with less shapers and MK/Bomber in the BG that i plan to try out some time Well, regarding ARM cracking (as was noted before by other members): Calamity is a range 10 spell. I honestly don´t see it without overextending Grissel. Grissel1 is a 6 Fury lock. Lets say you want to put Calamity on a crucial target, in most cases you have to boost (4 fury needed overall). Then you can´t fire the Mulg missle, because casting boundless charge means that you´re on 0 fury then. Is it a good idea? I see the the potential for really cool MULG MISSLE MOVES under Calandra1, ie killing a Colossal/Gargantuan in one turn or two heavies without retaliation. But I don´t see how this list can support those moves. You´ve won all your games by clocking out the opponent. Killing models haven´t seemed to be the real game plan, that´s why I wonder if an other warlock might be a better idea. Live to your strenghts! Last point: if that list doesn´t handle ARM (which often means rather low model count), then bring a second list. Play that list in armies with high number of activations (ie rather high model count) because then the opponent more likely clocks out. I know that clocking out the opponent doesn´t seem to be the graetest win condition, but for me it worked surprisingly well. I do not see that list being good in attrition, therefore I asked myself why not assasination as the 2nd possible win condition. [/div]
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Post by Kevin on Jun 11, 2020 14:41:25 GMT
If ya don't like the current top trend PoD list, there is nth with changing it to suit your taste. I think that there is plenty of us that would be intrested in reading your raports BTW assasinations has never been trolls biggest win condition and with the current shield guards everywhere meta still doesn't looks great :*
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Post by Trollock on Jun 15, 2020 11:59:12 GMT
Hey man, i didnt invent the list, im just trying it out. As i said in my reports i do have real difficulties in making the Runeshapers do work. John Henry swears by the list im just trying to tag along on that, but its not going super well id say so far hehe. Im having a lot of fun though
Speaking of that, i have another battle report up. Now its Kolgrimma with Shapers vs Old Witch with doomreavers!
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Post by Trollock on Jun 15, 2020 12:04:19 GMT
... Well, regarding ARM cracking (as was noted before by other members): Calamity is a range 10 spell. I honestly don´t see it without overextending Grissel. Grissel1 is a 6 Fury lock. Lets say you want to put Calamity on a crucial target, in most cases you have to boost (4 fury needed overall). Then you can´t fire the Mulg missle, because casting boundless charge means that you´re on 0 fury then. Is it a good idea? ... One thing about that. You have the runebearer to cast boundless for you. You can chose to arc calamity and have the shapers do work (i have failed at this so far), or you cast calamity as part of your counter punch. If they come in to your front lines (or fail to kill Mulg with an alpha) then you calamity whatever is nearby and have Mulg kill it.
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Post by Trollock on Jun 25, 2020 20:55:44 GMT
New battle report up on LoS! Borka 1 this time!
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Post by Trollock on Jun 30, 2020 21:27:49 GMT
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Post by dickovdk on Jul 1, 2020 8:01:13 GMT
Just read it, and frankly like your thoughs on Madrak3. He is one of the best looking models but i feel you highlight all the right things about him. However your number ranking is maybe a bit too positive Great write up
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Post by mydnight on Jul 1, 2020 10:52:40 GMT
I love Borka1, but in the current meta, his def skew is just not good enough to bank his whole game on. His feat doesn't even give a free charge for the battle group . I considered playing him with W & S to get that def skew up, but all that effort for 1 unit of champs doesn't seem worth it. In terms of his personal ability to kill things, yes, it is pretty decent -- I remember back in MKII when he could be raged and he killed a colossal for me. I look at your list and can't help but feel that Borka2 can run that while also maintaining the 'I Will personally bash your head in ' playstyle.
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Post by Trollock on Jul 2, 2020 20:25:47 GMT
I love Borka1, but in the current meta, his def skew is just not good enough to bank his whole game on. His feat doesn't even give a free charge for the battle group . I considered playing him with W & S to get that def skew up, but all that effort for 1 unit of champs doesn't seem worth it. In terms of his personal ability to kill things, yes, it is pretty decent -- I remember back in MKII when he could be raged and he killed a colossal for me. I look at your list and can't help but feel that Borka2 can run that while also maintaining the 'I Will personally bash your head in ' playstyle. I cant argue that Borka 1 is better than borka 2, but borka 1 is better at controlling the board by threatening to feat. As for hitting power, Borka 2 is better only if he was damaged. He still very good and way more mobile and all that. You can definitely run a similar list with Borka 2. I havent tried him against infernals or Flames, but those lists dont seem to like being staionaried, and Borka 2 can easily kill a horror a turn. Maybe that is worth exploring? I have no local infernal though, so im not the right person to do it...
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snot
Light Addition
Posts: 63
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Post by snot on Jul 3, 2020 6:32:52 GMT
Very good Madrak3 summary! I fully agree, but what makes me most sad about him is that in most games he is just plain boring.
One thing i tried out was to play him aggressive as assassin. His stats look mediocre, but with fellcaller and Pyre and fortune he gets quite scary, If you add +5 threat from Vengeance and ledfoot.
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