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Post by Azahul on Feb 10, 2020 8:31:57 GMT
Dunno how the theme force gonna be constracted. But Carvel with troll models is gonna get stupid really, really fast Maybe. Krielstone plus Batten is nice but the current Steamroller packet really doesn't favour bricks. And I suspect the theme will only make Trolls into Minion models (and vice versa), not into Farrow models, so Carver's Feat can't be used on any Trolls you might bring. Those two things probably temper what he can do.
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Post by Kevin on Feb 10, 2020 9:50:50 GMT
I wouldnt play as brick. BG of Mauler and 2 eartborns would be enough to not play a brick and yet still be irritaiting as hell. So would few bashers. Anyway I wouldnt like to play against it, dunno if I would wish for myself to play it. Dont have high wishes for that. But I belive that being able to take 2 Dhunia Archonts with Valks and some troll heavy infantry other then runeshapers would be game changer for us. Even without mixing troll amd farrow battlegroup
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Post by Azahul on Feb 10, 2020 10:02:20 GMT
Would you rate lights when Carver can't amp their damage output? I dunno, I don't think hoping enemies bounce off Arm 21 is a thing in the current meta. Pig Warbeasts are already just as sturdy as Trolls, so if you aren't playing in a brick then you'd be expecting basically the same returns as a current Carver player, just without the additional damage die from the Feat. He's not exactly tearing up the meta anyway, so... can't say I'm impressed by the prospect.
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Post by Kevin on Feb 10, 2020 10:31:49 GMT
As long as bashers cost 7 and if Carver would work on them ya have base thread 11, pow 18 wm in the turn ya need. There is a big difference with having rage as an animus. Would it break the meta - dont think so. Not so sure bout EBDT with possibility of armour 25 xd But maybe I have a different aproach cause I currently dont have it
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Post by Azahul on Feb 10, 2020 10:45:01 GMT
As long as bashers cost 7 and if Carver would work on them ya have base thread 11, pow 18 wm in the turn ya need. There is a big difference with having rage as an animus. Would it break the meta - dont think so. Not so sure bout EBDT with possibility of armour 25 xd But maybe I have a different aproach cause I currently dont have it No, that's what I'm saying, they wouldn't have Weapon Master on the turn they need it. Carver's Feat very explicitly calls out that Farrow models gain the damage dice, not Friendly Faction models. While we know that the theme will treat Trolls as Minions and Minions as Trolls, we haven't heard anything to my knowledge that indicates that Trolls will gain the Farrow keyword specifically. I would be surprised to see them do so as well, seeing as none of the other themes have followed that process. You get the faction tag, not the specific subtype tag. No Veteran Leader for Troll infantry from Carver either, for that matter. Carver already has access to Rage in a similarly suboptimal fashion through Underchief Mire and a Wrastler, for the record, so the primary new tech being offered here is the Krielstone access.
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Post by Kevin on Feb 10, 2020 10:51:41 GMT
Thats why I wrote "if Carver would work on them" :* Nah I also dont think it will work like that in Trollow theme force, but I belive for good reasons
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Post by profdikweed on Feb 10, 2020 12:19:19 GMT
Farrow, or at least Arkadius, probably aren't getting Rush. Hungerford mentioned Arkadius with Troll *Heavies* specifically, presumably because Road Hogs with Rush on Arkadius can spray enemy deployment zones top of one. If that's a universal limitation then the only Warbeast swapping would be each side trading heavies, which removes a lot of utility. I really really hope they just exclude Arkadius from the theme and the Cid. I think including him would result in too many restrictions to keep him in check,nerfing the overall potential for the theme.
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Post by Azahul on Feb 10, 2020 12:29:53 GMT
I really really hope they just exclude Arkadius from the theme and the Cid. I think including him would result in too many restrictions to keep him in check,nerfing the overall potential for the theme. I'm of the same view. He would distort the theme around him... and I reckon a good chunk of the time he'd still run in WWFF to get Overtake and Void Archons and other useful tools that aren't Farrow in nature. It's not like he's crying out for a theme to make him good, and he would more than likely make the theme worse for those who do need something like this.
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Post by moridamn on Feb 10, 2020 15:30:13 GMT
I can't give you my source, but atm, neither Arcadius nor Midas are in the theme.
Edit: its subject to change, but that is the current stance.
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bacon
Junior Strategist
Posts: 134
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Post by bacon on Feb 10, 2020 19:19:46 GMT
I might be alone in that I wish they would not allow any crossover of beasts between trolls and farrow. IMO playing farrow with troll support or trolls with Friendly faction farrow to benefit from troll warlock's spells sounds interesting enough to me on its own.
As far as Carver goes it's possible his feat could be changed from friendly farrow to friendly faction to accommodate this theme. I never really understood why he had that restriction in the first place.
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Post by anoddman on Feb 10, 2020 19:27:50 GMT
I can't give you my source, but atm, neither Arcadius nor Midas are in the theme. Edit: its subject to change, but that is the current stance. Are you sure? Hungerford posted "And Arkadius with Troll heavies" on Facebook only a few days ago.
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shmeep
Junior Strategist
Posts: 742
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Post by shmeep on Feb 10, 2020 19:28:24 GMT
I might be alone in that I wish they would not allow any crossover of beasts between trolls and farrow. IMO playing farrow with troll support or trolls with Friendly faction farrow to benefit from troll warlock's spells sounds interesting enough to me on its own. As far as Carver goes it's possible his feat could be changed from friendly farrow to friendly faction to accommodate this theme. I never really understood why he had that restriction in the first place. I don't have a strong stance either way, but I agree that it goes against the established lore to some degree. It's makes a lot more sense with the human factions, a warjack is a warjack is a warjack, whereas warbeasts are animals that have been conditioned to act a certain way towards very specific groups of people over decades, sometimes millenia, you can't just change something like that with the flick of a wrist.
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Post by robbleyourworld on Feb 10, 2020 19:47:35 GMT
I might be alone in that I wish they would not allow any crossover of beasts between trolls and farrow. IMO playing farrow with troll support or trolls with Friendly faction farrow to benefit from troll warlock's spells sounds interesting enough to me on its own. As far as Carver goes it's possible his feat could be changed from friendly farrow to friendly faction to accommodate this theme. I never really understood why he had that restriction in the first place. I don't have a strong stance either way, but I agree that it goes against the established lore to some degree. It's makes a lot more sense with the human factions, a warjack is a warjack is a warjack, whereas warbeasts are animals that have been conditioned to act a certain way towards very specific groups of people over decades, sometimes millenia, you can't just change something like that with the flick of a wrist. It's fiction so anything can happen... but I agree that explaining it in a satisfying way will be difficult. I haven't kept up much on it but I got the feeling its basically going to be Dhunia wants them to get along for the sake of killing infernals so they are? Which could be interesting or could be really lame depending on how they play it out. Basically "Magic"
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snoozer
Junior Strategist
Posts: 467
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Post by snoozer on Feb 10, 2020 20:16:43 GMT
Arcadius does not worship dhunia, he doesnt even work for trolls. I do not expect him in this theme whatsoever!
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Post by gobber on Feb 10, 2020 20:38:05 GMT
Arcadius does not worship dhunia, he doesnt even work for trolls. I do not expect him in this theme whatsoever! Not working for trolls seems the more compelling part here, though we're still going against Hungie's "arkadius with troll heavies" comment last week. Humans are still Dhunia's grandchildren and IKURG mentions that there still are a few small tribes of humans that still actively worship Dhunia. Whether or not he actually worships her, he has managed a facsimile of dhunian magic sufficient to control dhunian beasts (as well as one devourer one, though they're arguably two sides of the same coin), so applying this to trolls as well doesn't seem like the largest leap. Trollkins' blood connection with the dire trolls is repeatedly brought up as the method of control; if anyone would be able to refine said blood into an a hordes version of Lukas' warcaster serum that would be Arkadius (might even be part of how he controls farrow; the alchemical serums he carries are know to be part of the process). Nor does it seem trolls would be particularly judgmental of Arkadius harvesting some whelps for this purpose...
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