eauc
Junior Strategist
Posts: 209
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Post by eauc on Feb 11, 2020 23:19:45 GMT
- grots are not base-stealth, they need the (fre) solo IIRC. Chickens need nothing, they just really appreciate stalkers. - more or less the same otherwise. same MAT7 gang vs sitting vulture + veteran leader. same POW between gang and finisher. same abyssmal DEF. same speed. same reach. honestly they could have put those rules on the grots and dispensed with the new unit. chickens models are even inferior quality-wise. and the fluff of the grots could justify them being in primal with ogruns (it's almost the same one as the vulturs). For me it's more that: - the more die on damage rolls the best. It makes the average more likely, especially against models with impervious flesh for example. But also you can try for really high ARM and hope to have 1~2 high rolls. Vultures can reach ~35 damage on charge with the twins, 40+ with kallus2. Sometimes they're insane. I've dropped thrones and other BEs with 4 (very mad) chickens (on meth). Basically the extra dice is more valuable the more you buff them up damage-wise, or if you can add yet another one to that pool... - reposition is really good scenario-wise. You can charge outside of a zone with some models and then reposition inside and still score with the unit. In theory, it can also help to stay out of range of important models (think absy2) but I always forget at some point Their models are also a bit more playable than grots. Wings mess up things less.
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Post by zwergenkrieger on May 18, 2020 8:58:37 GMT
You can build a lot of different lists with them and have fun. From beast heavy with double throne to speedy infantry spam in ravens. Would you like to sketch some of those lists?
In addition, I see a lot of Golab love these days but reading through its rules I can´t really see why. Could someone explain?
Sorry for the questions, I´m out of the game for 2.5 years now and I like to have a restart with some Legion Twins fun.
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Post by thebuoyancyofwater on May 18, 2020 11:59:36 GMT
So I've change dup my list a bit since I last posted on here, currently running: Twins -Blightbringer -Golab -Harrier -Harrier -Seraph Sorceress on Hellion Craelix Hermit Max Rotwings Hellmouth Scouts -UA I like the list a lot and the Hermit is really nice with the Twins. While raptors would be nice and have performed well I'm happy dropping them for the scouts. More bow shots (no poison, but CRA), always on stealth and AD are all very handy and they still have a reposition move. zwergenkrieger: The sprint animus is really useful for Rhyas. I also use Golab with Kallus2 and having access to sprint, Overrun and reposition adds up to a very mobile heavy and caster! As soon as a target is damaged Golab hits surprisingly hard due to finisher, 3 initials and 4 fury. Plus with a hellion or (soon) mekanoshredder he can charge for free. Anti-tough is amazing and IIRC it stops soul collection too, which has become a big deal due to various archons appearing. The built in healing is a bonus as well. Finally veteran leader is handy if you're running rotwings, but not essential. Cheers, Dave
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eauc
Junior Strategist
Posts: 209
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Post by eauc on May 18, 2020 14:13:30 GMT
Would you like to sketch some of those lists? In addition, I see a lot of Golab love these days but reading through its rules I can´t really see why. Could someone explain? Sorry for the questions, I´m out of the game for 2.5 years now and I like to have a restart with some Legion Twins fun.
Golab -> mainly sprint on Rhyas2, which change the way you play her. Usually you would play her by trading with the juiciest piece of your opponent, letting her die, then feating and taking another big piece, and hope you made a good difference. Now with sprint you trade her less, but since she needs a fury for sprint, you also need more support 1/ to make sure she kills the target (you need to soften the prey before) and 2/ to make sure she survives after the sprint. I've found the Hermit with Visions to be fundamental in the goal of making the opponent give up on retalation. If he gives up retalation for 2 turns of this you are usually in a very good position attrition-wise. Regarding the lists Recently I played [Theme] Ravens of War [Twins 2] Saeryn & Rhyas, Talons of Everblight [+24] - Blightbringer [32] - Golab [17] - Seraph [14] Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion [0(6)] Hermit of Henge Hold [5] Spell Martyr [1] Strider Deathstalker [0(4)] Strider Deathstalker [0(4)] Blighted Rotwings (max) [12] Blighted Rotwings (max) [12] Hellmouth [6] Which is performing fine for my tastes. I want to include the future mecanoshredder because it's stupid on Rhyas and really nice on Golab too (free charge and rng 15 -> good), but either I drop the hellmouth, or I switch theme to primal terrors: [Theme] Primal Terrors [Twins 2] Saeryn & Rhyas, Talons of Everblight [+24] - Blightbringer [32] - Golab [17] - Seraph [14] - Shredder [4] Hermit of Henge Hold [5] Spell Martyr [1] Warmonger War Chief [0(5)] Blighted Rotwings (max) [12] Blighted Rotwings (max) [12] Hellmouth [0(6)] Hellmouth [0(6)] Swamp Gobber Bellows Crew [2] I loose some fine tech with the stalker and any useful theme bonus however. You can also adapt my old double throne lists to modern choices, hermit and mecanoshredder [Theme] Oracles of Annihilation [Twins 2] Saeryn & Rhyas, Talons of Everblight [+24] - Neraph [12] - Proteus [19] - Seraph [14] - Shredder [4] Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion [0(6)] Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion [0(6)] Hermit of Henge Hold [5] The Forsaken [0(4)] Ice Witches [7] Throne of Everblight [16] Throne of Everblight [16] Problem is, you don't have much in 6pts to finish the list, that would really bring it something interesting. Maybe a shield guard with bokur or wanderer. The Rhyas1 version of this list has a Sacral Vault but that's probably overkill with the Twins who already have banishing ward.
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Post by zwergenkrieger on May 18, 2020 14:53:20 GMT
Thanks for both these great replies! So I've change dup my list a bit since I last posted on here, currently running: Twins -Blightbringer -Golab -Harrier -Harrier -Seraph Sorceress on Hellion Craelix Hermit Max Rotwings Hellmouth Scouts -UA I don´t know much about strenghts of that list, but it contains every single piece I like to start Legion with. In addition, it´s free of spams of any kind which I try to avoid now (though my Minions armies are full of spams – spams formerly were the the art of list building for me, but now I refuse to play spams in order to get more intresting games). BUT... ...there is that Hermit, that piece of pewter which is included in every single list I see on the internet. Really? I hate to play / use mainstream pieces, things that everyone and his aunt is taking. What would you take into this list if you´d like to drop Hermit? You can also adapt my old double throne lists to modern choices, hermit and mecanoshredder [Theme] Oracles of Annihilation [Twins 2] Saeryn & Rhyas, Talons of Everblight [+24] - Neraph [12] - Proteus [19] - Seraph [14] - Shredder [4] Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion [0(6)] Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion [0(6)] Hermit of Henge Hold [5] The Forsaken [0(4)] Ice Witches [7] Throne of Everblight [16] Throne of Everblight [16] Also a nice list when it comes down to model selection. How does this list play?
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Post by dirtyharrypotter on May 19, 2020 9:08:35 GMT
Quick question on sprint. If you cast the animus after you do the killing, do you still get to sprint? The sprint rule reads that way to me (you check to see if the demand was met at the end of the activation) but it's counterintuitive to me.
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Post by custardboy on May 19, 2020 9:21:23 GMT
Yep, that's how it works. It was a change from mk2.
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Post by thebuoyancyofwater on May 19, 2020 9:23:17 GMT
Quick question on sprint. If you cast the animus after you do the killing, do you still get to sprint? The sprint rule reads that way to me (you check to see if the demand was met at the end of the activation) but it's counterintuitive to me. Yes you can cast it after killing something and still sprint. Or if you can't, my Circle playing friend lied to me But 99.9% sure you can. Cheers, Dave
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Post by thebuoyancyofwater on May 19, 2020 9:33:33 GMT
Thanks for both these great replies! So I've change dup my list a bit since I last posted on here, currently running: Twins -Blightbringer -Golab -Harrier -Harrier -Seraph Sorceress on Hellion Craelix Hermit Max Rotwings Hellmouth Scouts -UA I don´t know much about strenghts of that list, but it contains every single piece I like to start Legion with. In addition, it´s free of spams of any kind which I try to avoid now (though my Minions armies are full of spams – spams formerly were the the art of list building for me, but now I refuse to play spams in order to get more intresting games). BUT... ...there is that Hermit, that piece of pewter which is included in every single list I see on the internet. Really? I hate to play / use mainstream pieces, things that everyone and his aunt is taking. What would you take into this list if you´d like to drop Hermit? So the list is just very versatile, able to cope with a lot of situations I find. And pretty much all the pieces interact together nicely. Saeryn, BB, seraph, Craelix and scouts create a solid magic/shooting base. Rhyas, BB, golab, rotwings and hellmouth provide melee. The sorceress gives out free charges, is a fast solo for flags and can mix it up in melee or at ranged (great for hunting gremlin swarms). The harriers are also fast beasts for scoring far zones then dying, and mark target can be very useful with the ranged elements. Between mark target, flare, Marked for Death, rotwings, Craelix and the BB you have a huge range of DEF debuffs to apply when needed, dropping basically anything into hitting range. EG: Apply marked target, boost with flare, 3 goes with Craelix, Marked for Death then run a rotwing base to base. Send Golab in and he's at about effective MAT16 or something daft, and that's not including the potential BB buff. Obviously you won't generally get all of them, but that shows the range of options you have. Then you have the BB and Hermit for boosting your hitting power. There's multiple elements that either contest or score well such as the hellmouth, sorceress, Hermit or harriers too. To be honest, I'd probably keep the Hermit in this list and drop it elsewhere. Neither of my other lists (Abby2 and Kallus2) currently run the Hermit. If you absolutely had to drop it, I'd probably go a mekanoshredder and spell martyr I think. Cheers, Dave
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Post by custardboy on May 19, 2020 9:34:12 GMT
The thing to note is that Rhyas often doesn't have Golab in her ctrl after she's charged, so can't cast the animus...
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Post by thebuoyancyofwater on May 20, 2020 9:38:08 GMT
The thing to note is that Rhyas often doesn't have Golab in her ctrl after she's charged, so can't cast the animus... Very true! Be sure to cast it first in that case! Also had another thought on what could be changed in my list above to remove Hermit: drop the scouts and Hermit for max raptors Seems solid, but Hermit is so good with the Twins. Cheers, Dave
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Post by thebuoyancyofwater on Jun 25, 2021 15:21:39 GMT
Sorry for the threadromancy, but figured it would be OK since it's my thread...
Now that I've been able to start getting games on the table again I've been able to play the Twins twice. Used pretty much the same list as the last one I posted, though I dropped the sorceress to make the strider UA free and used the 4pts for a mekanoshredder.
Games have resulted in two wins by assassination, once against Heretic and once against Kromac2. I feel I'm starting to get a proper handle on how to play the list at last.
Basically, it starts very passively, scoring anything easy and contesting with throwaway rotwings or tentacles. I can generally piece trade very favourably early on too to take out some key pieces while the list and in particular Twins, Golab and the Hermit get into position. From here I've noticed attrition seems to swing in my opponents favour as they eventually get to grips with some parts of the list, but this is where the assassination opens up for the win.
Still really enjoying the list!
Cheers, Dave
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Post by copperflame on Jun 28, 2021 14:07:09 GMT
Awesome to see peeps getting games in again! I like the Twins very much. Can you give (an updated) role that the Blightbringer has? Do you use it for cover and a big gun or some other reason(s)?
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Post by thebuoyancyofwater on Jun 29, 2021 20:39:32 GMT
Thanks!
I've used the STR/ARM buff and the DEF debuff options quite a lot. On assassination runs it'll use either breath depending on the target. Also generally projects it's melee threat to keep hard hitters away and claim zones on my side of the board. Typically Rhyas will be ahead of the BB, but within the CMD bubble.
I think that's about the jist of it! Put out the buff/debuff as needed each turn while positioning to threaten heavier targets and score nearby zones. Occasionally provide a place to hide for Saeryn too.
Don't know if that's a reasonable answer?
Cheers, Dave
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Post by copperflame on Jun 30, 2021 12:56:10 GMT
Very reasonable Thanks mate!
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