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Post by hypnotoad on Oct 11, 2019 12:53:10 GMT
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Post by charlzheimer on Oct 11, 2019 13:05:51 GMT
considering the CID atmossphere around certain models **cough**paladins**cough** (that is both the mounted and unmounted version) or mechanics (Grymkin corpse collectors and infernal summoning) i see and understand this article completely.
ALOT of toxicity was/is on the CID and adressing certain CORE problems was either met with "boo" or sometimes even by PP stating "no wishlisting" followed by a lock. (I.E. paradox pointing out how a element beeing tested felt pointless cuz it would require a larger overhoul then currently presented)
in theory it allowed us to prevent SHIT models from beeing released. but now we have tridents....and paladin initiates.
powercreep on one end and shit releases on the other.
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zhoe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 254
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Post by zhoe on Oct 11, 2019 14:41:44 GMT
dat fellow couldnt get a clue if he cobered himslef in clue musk an did teh clu mating dance in a feeld of horny clues
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Post by beardmonk on Oct 11, 2019 15:00:42 GMT
CID in the form it was in needs to go by the wayside. Sadly, if recent reports are to be believed, the size of PP as a company means that they probably dont have the staff to do full and proper testing.
Any community testing should be done behind closed doors not put on show to the general public. Wyrd did this with their new edition change. Internal testing. Closed Community Alpha under NDA. Closed Community Beta under NDA. Then open Beta to those who wanted it but feedback was still locked to a closed forum. Then release.
Many models that were put into CID should never have got to the customer/public in the form they did. If done right community dev is a good way of improving a product. Done badly you customer could head for the hills.
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Post by charlzheimer on Oct 11, 2019 15:23:15 GMT
dat fellow couldnt get a clue if he cobered himslef in clue musk an did teh clu mating dance in a feeld of horny clues how Does a horny clue look like i wonder?
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Post by michael on Oct 11, 2019 16:42:31 GMT
I could reduce CID toxicity by about 80% with permanent bans of about 8 individuals on the CID forums.
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Post by copperflame on Oct 11, 2019 19:04:32 GMT
I can't read the article because I'm at work. But I do love the concept of the CID... leveraging the player base for beta testing (like video games use test servers) would ideally increase the chances of catching issues with model interactions across the entire game. It also has a wonderful chance for communication between the company and players (this took a big hit when the forums shut down).
In practice, it seemed like the CID suffered from the pitfalls of a social platform. Admittedly, I only participated in CID's that involved Legion models since I own no other faction. With that limited experience though - it was evident that there was a very vocal minority stressing their point of view (agenda?) on any thread. It was disheartening to see some of the behavior of those few people yet was unavoidable since it was a public forum.
I'm sure this issue could be applied to a wider concept past just the CID. The point is that idea vs reality when considering social platforms can have a wide variance.
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Post by Charistoph on Oct 11, 2019 21:39:02 GMT
Speaking of video games, would it be too much to run CID through Vassal or similar? This would make recording Battle Reports simpler and make it easier to capture fine data, such as the dice rolls.
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Post by michael on Oct 12, 2019 1:12:40 GMT
Speaking of video games, would it be too much to run CID through Vassal or similar? This would make recording Battle Reports simpler and make it easier to capture fine data, such as the dice rolls. How players play the game doesn’t matter. That is not the problem. The antagonistic and prejudiced attitudes displayed by some posters, and the dubious-at-best conclusions drawn by other less-malicious but of questionable caliber posters, those are the problems. Tionas pretty much nailed it all in the posts. When people try to pick fights about how math works because it harms their arguments, or post what appear to be staged reports in order to support their dubious and biased conclusions, well... it’s the participants, not the process.
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Post by Charistoph on Oct 12, 2019 1:27:33 GMT
Speaking of video games, would it be too much to run CID through Vassal or similar? This would make recording Battle Reports simpler and make it easier to capture fine data, such as the dice rolls. How players play the game doesn’t matter. That is not the problem. The antagonistic and prejudiced attitudes displayed by some posters, and the dubious-at-best conclusions drawn by other less-malicious but of questionable caliber posters, those are the problems. Tionas pretty much nailed it all in the posts. When people try to pick fights about how math works because it harms their arguments, or post what appear to be staged reports in order to support their dubious and biased conclusions, well... it’s the participants, not the process.
I'm not arguing about many of the CID problems being the participants, in fact, I rather agree that the human factor is what can and does futz up a lot of things.
What I am arguing is that through Vassal, or similar, we can cut out as much of the human emotion quotient as possible by having access to real data. Now, it won't solve everything, such as someone deliberately tanking a move by not building in proper synergies or using available buffs, but that kind of thing would be easily seen and verified in the digital report rather than just what the person claimed on the forum later on.
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Post by mydnight on Oct 12, 2019 1:51:45 GMT
As much as CiD has problems, PP internal playtesting is very limited. Some optimal combination of the two will be required.
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Post by Blargaliscious on Oct 12, 2019 2:30:02 GMT
I think any discussion about CID is a bit moot.
I think CID is dead.
When has there been any recent discussion about the next CID? Has anyone noticed that there have been new Warmachine solos released, courtesy of Riot Quest, that did not go through CID?
Unless there is a new theme army released, I don't think there's going to be another CID. Warmachine and Hordes are not dead, but I think they've been sent out to pasture, and we are only seeing the beginning of it now. Aside from more Riot Quest inspired solos and some hole fillers (like the Assault Kommando officer) I'm not really expecting anything major that would require a CID.
I hope that I'm wrong...
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Post by Korianneder on Oct 12, 2019 2:33:29 GMT
I think any discussion about CID is a bit moot. I think CID is dead. When has there been any recent discussion about the next CID? Has anyone noticed that there have been new Warmachine solos released, courtesy of Riot Quest, that did not go through CID? Unless there is a new theme army released, I don't think there's going to be another CID. Warmachine and Hordes are not dead, but I think they've been sent out to pasture, and we are only seeing the beginning of it now. Aside from more Riot Quest inspired solos and some hole fillers (like the Assault Kommando officer) I'm not really expecting anything major that would require a CID. I hope that I'm wrong... They've already confirmed the next cid will be convergence. Hungerford said on stream that it might be before the end of the year but it's not guaranteed. There's no guarantee that they'll stick to that or that cid won't change, but as of right now it's already confirmed.
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Post by mcdermott on Oct 12, 2019 6:53:31 GMT
I feel like them giving warning that there'd be a cid break post oblivion, and then them moving offices, followed by the holiday season isn't exactly a sign that CID is dead and more of a "they warned us that there was a break, plus the holidays and an office move"
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Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on Oct 12, 2019 7:26:31 GMT
PP should hire some better devs and ditch CID
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