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Post by belgarath112 on Sept 4, 2019 16:40:34 GMT
Greetings,
in my Group we are discussing how exactly "Pursuit" from Iona works.
My enemy is playing Buther 3 and with his Tools it would be nice to have a way of stopping him murdering my whole army.
We are discussing the following "thing": Butcher and his dogs are declaring a Charge order. -> Butcher 3 charges (with Pursuit on him), so immediately something could move. -> This movement triggers a free strike, when advancing out of Butchers` reach -> What happens then? Does it matter if he kills the target? -> Does his movement ends before Pursuit triggers (succesfull charge, he can still cast spells and so on) or not (failed charge, activation ends)
Would be glad if someone could help.
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privvy
Junior Strategist
Formerly The Nomad on PP's forums
Posts: 317
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Post by privvy on Sept 5, 2019 0:19:43 GMT
Pursuit specifies Model/Unit, so you have to wait until the whole warcaster unit completes their charge. Since the Butcher has ended his charge legally in melee with an enemy, the charge is considered to have worked. If he kills the model with a free strike, he can redirect his charge attack without the charge bonus into another model in melee range and continue his activation with casting spells, feating, and so on.
Since Pursuit specifies Model/Unit, it also means that he can run both dogs behind you (since it's a press forward order and allows for models in a unit to run or charge) and Butcher charges, blocking your pursuit path out of melee with him.
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Post by belgarath112 on Sept 5, 2019 5:15:36 GMT
Thanks for the answer - but what if he moves Butcher last?
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privvy
Junior Strategist
Formerly The Nomad on PP's forums
Posts: 317
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Post by privvy on Sept 5, 2019 13:17:09 GMT
You still have to wait until the whole unit (Butcher and the two dogs) moves in order to activate Pursuit, so it doesn't matter if Butcher is first, second, or last.
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Post by belgarath112 on Sept 5, 2019 17:37:40 GMT
Damn. That´s not good for me, but thanks!
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privvy
Junior Strategist
Formerly The Nomad on PP's forums
Posts: 317
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Post by privvy on Sept 5, 2019 20:13:55 GMT
Yeah, it's unfortunate and gives really strong counter play to the spell.
But remember, if a card says Model/Unit, it means either a single model such as a solo, caster, or warjack, or all of the models alive in a unit.
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Post by Gamingdevil on Sept 9, 2019 6:35:00 GMT
To elaborate, it doesn't even really matter that Pursuit is on a unit in this case. It's similar to Admonition, which just triggers on a model. The key point is that both Pursuit and Admonition trigger at the end of movement, which is also the prerequisite for getting a successful charge; ending movement with your charge target in range. Even if you were to move away, the charge was already successful and Butcher could redirect his attack at something else (and likely cast Impending Doom first to pull you back into range).
As far as I can think of, there are no ways of forcing unsuccessful charges, apart from actually starting out of range.
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joedj
Junior Strategist
Posts: 513
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Post by joedj on Nov 25, 2019 7:32:49 GMT
Sorta counters to Charges: Counter Slam, Circle Gnarlhorn. But so improbable to pull off, it might as well be non-existent. Skorne Mammoth with Counterblast and Crit Pitch. Slightly less improbable.
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