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Post by michael on Aug 22, 2019 14:07:42 GMT
In regards to Reznik's feat I am very sure that neither Rain of Death, nor Pony sprays are ranged or melee attacks, so no mass blowing up of infantry (outside of Hand of Silence sprays, AOEs or the Archon's thresher). :/ I also checked out the Protectorate heavies and the Vanquisher has both and AOE and thresher. What is the verdict on him? The Vanquisher has needed a PC drop for years now. At least from the Protectorate’s perspective. (It’s basically just a Destroyer with 4 less RNG and continuous fire on the AOE, so... Does that make it worth 3 points more...?)
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sorokin
Junior Strategist
Posts: 775
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Post by sorokin on Aug 22, 2019 14:40:46 GMT
In regards to Reznik's feat I am very sure that neither Rain of Death, nor Pony sprays are ranged or melee attacks, so no mass blowing up of infantry (outside of Hand of Silence sprays, AOEs or the Archon's thresher). :/ I also checked out the Protectorate heavies and the Vanquisher has both and AOE and thresher. What is the verdict on him? The Vanquisher has needed a PC drop for years now. At least from the Protectorate’s perspective. (It’s basically just a Destroyer with 4 less RNG and continuous fire on the AOE, so... Does that make it worth 3 points more...?) Sounds resobale. But I thought if you'd consider a Grolar on Reznik, downgrading it to a 17 point jack doesn't sound too bad, given it can recieve choir buffs, curse and fuel the flames. MAT 18, POW 18 Thresher, or a RAT 7 POW 18/11 gun sounds not that bad for his feat. But yeah, range 10" and SPD 4 is not that good even with boundless charge, and that's the same reason i wouldn't consider a Decimator with him either.
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Post by sand20go on Aug 22, 2019 15:16:41 GMT
Re Devestator (buried WAY deep in the rule book) - it does not trigger Rez's ability
pg. 36 "..Special attacks listed as a rule of the model itself are neither melee attacks nor ranged attacks"
So now serious explosions akin to Kingsman's final scene.....
However,
Incite WOULD impact it as that reads ..."FF modles gain +2 to attack and dmage rolls against enemy models while the enemey models are in the spellcaster's command range."
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Post by hamicron on Aug 22, 2019 18:02:12 GMT
The Vanquisher has needed a PC drop for years now. At least from the Protectorate’s perspective. (It’s basically just a Destroyer with 4 less RNG and continuous fire on the AOE, so... Does that make it worth 3 points more...?) Sounds resobale. But I thought if you'd consider a Grolar on Reznik, downgrading it to a 17 point jack doesn't sound too bad, given it can recieve choir buffs, curse and fuel the flames. MAT 18, POW 18 Thresher, or a RAT 7 POW 18/11 gun sounds not that bad for his feat. But yeah, range 10" and SPD 4 is not that good even with boundless charge, and that's the same reason i wouldn't consider a Decimator with him either. The other thing to consider is that Scourge of Heresy is only 16 points. You lose out on the gun, keep Thresher, gain Purgation on the other weapon, Arcane Vortex for even more anti magic and a bond that lets it move when Rez kills something.
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sorokin
Junior Strategist
Posts: 775
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Post by sorokin on Aug 22, 2019 18:22:45 GMT
Sounds resobale. But I thought if you'd consider a Grolar on Reznik, downgrading it to a 17 point jack doesn't sound too bad, given it can recieve choir buffs, curse and fuel the flames. MAT 18, POW 18 Thresher, or a RAT 7 POW 18/11 gun sounds not that bad for his feat. But yeah, range 10" and SPD 4 is not that good even with boundless charge, and that's the same reason i wouldn't consider a Decimator with him either. The other thing to consider is that Scourge of Heresy is only 16 points. You lose out on the gun, keep Thresher, gain Purgation on the other weapon, Arcane Vortex for even more anti magic and a bond that lets it move when Rez kills something. However the fuq i managed to miss that his character jack is literally a Vanquisher with a sword instead of a gun that also kept thresher. Gee,, it's almost as if it had been made specifically for him! Who would have guessed?
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Post by Havock on Aug 22, 2019 19:08:57 GMT
If you want to make your devastators do godawful stronk kaboom: Incite + Hymn of Battle.
Hell, add Enliven to the mix and you start asking your opponent the question how he is going to deal with the Devastators and not die the next turn.
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Post by sand20go on Aug 22, 2019 23:25:02 GMT
If you want to make your devastators do godawful stronk kaboom: Incite + Hymn of Battle. Hell, add Enliven to the mix and you start asking your opponent the question how he is going to deal with the Devastators and not die the next turn. Pow 22/pow 13 autohitting Rain of Death sounds exceedingly tasty. Boosted ;-) Put Hermit walking behind them for even MORE fun ;-)
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Post by anderfreak on Aug 23, 2019 1:18:59 GMT
If you want to make your devastators do godawful stronk kaboom: Incite + Hymn of Battle. Hell, add Enliven to the mix and you start asking your opponent the question how he is going to deal with the Devastators and not die the next turn. Pow 22/pow 13 autohitting Rain of Death sounds exceedingly tasty. Boosted ;-) Put Hermit walking behind them for even MORE fun ;-) Wow that's gross. I love it.
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Post by Armchair Warrior on Aug 23, 2019 1:39:44 GMT
And what’s grosser than gross?
The Hermit can scurry past your Devvys and, if you brought Vlad 3, prance through enemy territory (thanks to Parry) so that your bad bots keep their ARM 23 while your enemy takes the hit to ARM. And, adding salt to the wound, lets say the Hermit gets caught in the blast. Who cares? It’s still only 1 point of damage.
Back on an earlier topic...
I’m liking the idea of the Grolar over the Spriggan. He’s always been a great assassin jack, especially against Hordes where his gun burns through transfers. In Warmachine? Well, not so much. POW 12 guns against ARM 18 doesn’t quite cut it. Buuuut, POW 14 guns? Excluding Hermit potential (and lets face it if you delivered a functional Hermit to your opponent’s caster you were probably going to win anyway), you’re cranking out 12 additional points past ARM with average rolls. That’s money.
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Post by hamicron on Aug 23, 2019 10:04:07 GMT
The other thing though that the Spriggan has to recommend it is the Flares providing a bit of anti-cloud tech. As a mainly charging melee force I do think this might be one of the bigger weaknesses of WotOF lists.
So what match ups do you think WotOF will struggle into?
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Post by Havock on Aug 23, 2019 11:18:58 GMT
And what’s grosser than gross? The Hermit can scurry past your Devvys and, if you brought Vlad 3, prance through enemy territory (thanks to Parry) so that your bad bots keep their ARM 23 while your enemy takes the hit to ARM. And, adding salt to the wound, lets say the Hermit gets caught in the blast. Who cares? It’s still only 1 point of damage. Back on an earlier topic... I’m liking the idea of the Grolar over the Spriggan. He’s always been a great assassin jack, especially against Hordes where his gun burns through transfers. In Warmachine? Well, not so much. POW 12 guns against ARM 18 doesn’t quite cut it. Buuuut, POW 14 guns? Excluding Hermit potential (and lets face it if you delivered a functional Hermit to your opponent’s caster you were probably going to win anyway), you’re cranking out 12 additional points past ARM with average rolls. That’s money. To be fair at SPD5 the Hermit isn't going to d a lot of scurrying.
He's mostly there to punish people for taking on the authorities wall.
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Post by Armchair Warrior on Aug 23, 2019 11:27:52 GMT
@havoc of course you’re correct about that... I don’t think he’s going to pull off hot ARM debuffin’ love with the cav, but he’s got a shot to do it with Devvys if you brought Vlad 1 and he bumps up to a blistering speed 6. I don’t know that the trick will ever work if you play him tentatively in the back,though.
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Post by Armchair Warrior on Aug 23, 2019 11:48:27 GMT
The other thing though that the Spriggan has to recommend it is the Flares providing a bit of anti-cloud tech. As a mainly charging melee force I do think this might be one of the bigger weaknesses of WotOF lists. So what match ups do you think WotOF will struggle into? Yes, the Spriggan vs. Grolar tech is somewhat matchup dependent. You ask a good question, which relates to the one I have ... what would I pair well with it. For reference, this is currently my best idea of a list (potentially swapping the Spriggan and an extra Mechanik for a Vassal). Vladimir Tzepesci, Great Prince of Umbrey - WJ: +27 - Judicator - PC: 35 (Battlegroup Points Used: 27) - Grolar - PC: 18 Vassal of Menoth - PC: 0 Vassal of Menoth - PC: 0 Hermit of Henge Hold - PC: 0 High Paladin Dartan Vilmon - PC: 0 Menite Archon - PC: 8 Wrack - PC: 1 Wrack - PC: 1 Vassal Mechanik - PC: 1 Choir of Menoth - Leader & 3 Grunts: 4 Flame Bringers - Leader & 4 Grunts: 17 Greylord Outriders - Leader & 4 Grunts: 17 My current list pairing is Vlad 2 doomreavers, and Vlad 1 rockets list with 6 jacks including 3 Marauders. With theme drop, I’ve been looking at playing around with substitutes for Vlad 1 - Sorscha 3 (double shocks, 4 jacks), Karchev, or Butcher 3 for instance. It geels like this might struggle a bit into something Uber-Bricky, or with superlatively good shooting (both of which seem to correlate with having at least one huge base in my meta). Essentially, I think this list would sub in for doom reavers and appreciate a high-armor backstop which brought huge base killers.
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Post by Havock on Aug 23, 2019 12:57:51 GMT
@havoc of course you’re correct about that... I don’t think he’s going to pull off hot ARM debuffin’ love with the cav, but he’s got a shot to do it with Devvys if you brought Vlad 1 and he bumps up to a blistering speed 6. I don’t know that the trick will ever work if you play him tentatively in the back,though. I really need to try it but I really think the F3 Dev wall can work, if only my local meta wasn't dead.
- You can't meaningfully shoot them or magic them because they have ARM23 and either protection from nonmagical shooting or spells, depending on what is scariest in your list. - The leading Devastators will be under Enliven, meaning any melee attempt needs to either have something with Countercharge or a lot of backups. - If you can't kill them there is going to be a bunch of POW20-24 autohits or MAT8 PS18+ attacks coming your way, because she totally fixes their "pillow-fistedness" between Incite, Battle and Redline.
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Post by hamicron on Sept 6, 2019 18:13:42 GMT
So tomorrow I’ll be riding out again with the Horse Force to Blood and Oil in the UK. In total there are 4 of us out of 8 Khador players running V3 (never thought I’d see the day!) I’ll be running the following again: Vladimir Tzepesci, Great Prince of Umbrey - WJ: +27 - War Dog - PC: 3 - Grolar - PC: 18 (Battlegroup Points Used: 18) - Devout - PC: 9 (Battlegroup Points Used: 9) Fenris - PC: 8 - Fenris (Continued) Man-O-War Drakhun - PC: 9 - Man-O-War Drakhun (Continued) Yuri the Axe - PC: 0 Hermit of Henge Hold - PC: 0 High Paladin Dartan Vilmon - PC: 0 Wrack - PC: 1 Wrack - PC: 1 Greylord Outriders - Leader & 4 Grunts: 17 Iron Fang Uhlans - Leader & 4 Grunts: 20 Iron Fang Uhlans - Leader & 2 Grunts: 12 Choir of Menoth - Leader & 3 Grunts: 4 It’s a weird 3 list DC0 event, so the Horsies are supported by the following 2 lists: Theme: Wolves of Winter Obavnik Kommander Zerkova & Reaver Guard - WJ: +24 - Greylord Adjunct - PC: 4 - Grolar - PC: 18 (Battlegroup Points Used: 18) - Kodiak - PC: 13 (Battlegroup Points Used: 6) Koldun Lord - PC: 0 Koldun Lord - PC: 4 Eilish Garrity, the Occultist - PC: 5 Greylord Ternion - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0 Greylord Ternion - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0 Greylord Outriders - Leader & 4 Grunts: 17 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 - Greylord Escort - PC: 3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 - Greylord Escort - PC: 3 Lady Aiyana & Master Holt - Lady Aiyana & Master Holt: 8 - Koldun Kapitan Valachev - PC: 4 Obavnik Kommander Zerkova & Reaver Guard (Cont.) - PC: 0 And this Theme: Wolves of Winter Kommandant Sorscha Kratikoff - WJ: +28 - Greylord Adjunct - PC: 4 - Beast 09 - PC: 18 (Battlegroup Points Used: 18) - Ruin - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 10) - Kodiak - PC: 13 - Kodiak - PC: 13 - Marauder - PC: 11 - Marauder - PC: 11 Koldun Lord - PC: 4 Koldun Lord - PC: 4 Greylord Forge Seer - PC: 0 Greylord Forge Seer - PC: 0 Greylord Ternion - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0 Battle Mechaniks - Leader & 3 Grunts: 3 Kayazy Eliminators - Leader & Grunt: 5 The idea is Z2 deals with overwhelming infantry or armies I cannot charge while S3 deals with absurd amounts of armour that horses won’t be able to crack. We’ll see how it goes! For anyone interested you can find all the players here www.tiebreak.co.uk/bloodandoil-2019/playersClicking on names will bring up their lists if you fancy a snap shot of the uk meta.
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